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[H] Violet Hold...where to tank portal guardians

Strats / Info that doesn't fit in a specific instance

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Postby Sarutankah » Wed Jan 28, 2009 1:58 pm

I always watch LOS here as I have healed it many times, things like pulling back two steps after pull on a guardian can make it so much easier for the healer or ranged dps and letting the elite dragonflight guys come out a little bit from the portals after biffing avenger's shield is fine as well.

Tanking is about awareness, if you don't check where your healer is at (especially if you have concerns) and just blindly charge in all the time then you shouldn't be pugging cos a lack of awareness will cause wipes.

And there is nothing more crap than a wipe on cyanigosa/ichoron in that place.

On a more positive note.. we made it through here with a 1300sp (without totem) shammy healer last night - skill (on healers part) > gear imo.
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Postby Annadin » Thu Jan 29, 2009 10:15 am

The only 2 portals I do any different to you are the two at either end of the right-hand balcony, as follows:

For the extreme right hand one, as the group emerge I stand just below the top of the round stairs, drop a consecration and frisbee the group as they come around the corner. Then, immediately run through them and plant my back, square on, against the low pillar that marks the end of the wall. That way the healer and ranged dps still have LoS from the floor and the annoying knockback just pushes me against the wall itself.

For the portal to the right of the broken ramp (the next one across from the one mentioned above), I'll run to it and drop a consecrate then move back onto the 'rubble' surface a little and pick up the adds and adjust position as they come - but always on the rubble. Again, so ranged & healing have LoS from the floor of the instance.

A lot of tanking is about Body Language, and Rank1 consecrate is by far the most efficient 'right, I'm gonna tank these suckers right here, come and join me' marker in game. :)
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Postby bub64882 » Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:34 pm

Ran VH last night for the first time since 3.8. Mobs were running all over the place. There seemed to be totally different pathing for all portals on the second floor.

Anyone else experienced this?
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Postby Archimeades » Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:18 pm

Annadin wrote:A lot of tanking is about Body Language, and Rank1 consecrate is by far the most efficient 'right, I'm gonna tank these suckers right here, come and join me' marker in game. :)


Doesn't Rank1 cost as much if not more as a full Consecrate these days since they nerfed downranking?
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Postby Xerian » Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:53 pm

Archimeades wrote:
Doesn't Rank1 cost as much if not more as a full Consecrate these days since they nerfed downranking?


yes
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Postby Doogiehowser » Thu Jan 29, 2009 2:29 pm

bub64882 wrote:Ran VH last night for the first time since 3.8. Mobs were running all over the place. There seemed to be totally different pathing for all portals on the second floor.

Anyone else experienced this?


Yes, the elite squad of 3 or 4 now split up. 2 going one way, one the other.

If you have a hunter, have them MD to you on the single guy unless it's the caster. I'll toss my shield at the group of 2 and have them drag their slow buts to the one if it's the caster who you would have judged and shield slammed by then so the threat lead on that guy is already sky high.

So when you see the elite squad text pop up, take some time to figure out who is going in which direction and use your AS for the group of 2 and a shield slam for the one guy. I'll drop a consecrate for good measure and then it's just party time.

Make sure the dps knows what you're doing though. Run through the scenarios ahead of time since marking can be difficult since you're compressed on time.

Edit: This is only the case if they pop up on the higher levels. At ground level, they are all in a nice pack.
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Postby masterpoobaa » Thu Jan 29, 2009 2:43 pm

Yep there are changes now.
Im running VH daily so i know exactly what changed.

When portals open (non bosses) u either get 1 miniboss guarding the portal, or 3-4 mobs that charge the doorway.

These 'Chargers' spawn from 3 places. (looking into the instance standing at the doorway)
1. Rear balcony, to the right (jus tto the left of the holding cell for the big floating eyeball boss).
2. on the ground floor, dead ahead of the doorway
3. on the balcony, just to the right of the skethis boss holding cell.

When u get portals spawning from locations 1&2, they all come in one convenient group, easily aggroable using consecrate or Frizbee.

Group 3 HAS changed though. u normally get 4 mobs here, and they split up into 2 groups, one goes left, the other right. Can get messy - specially with pugs.

What i do is either:

A. if we are ahead of time i run right up to the portal, and frizbee the mobs the instant they spawn - not giving them time to split up.
Then kite them back to the floor so im not LOS of healer.

or

B. if i cant get to portal before they spawn, frizbee 1 group, run to other group and consecrate/hotR.
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Postby bub64882 » Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:54 am

masterpoobaa wrote:Yep there are changes now.
Im running VH daily so i know exactly what changed.

When portals open (non bosses) u either get 1 miniboss guarding the portal, or 3-4 mobs that charge the doorway.

These 'Chargers' spawn from 3 places. (looking into the instance standing at the doorway)
1. Rear balcony, to the right (jus tto the left of the holding cell for the big floating eyeball boss).
2. on the ground floor, dead ahead of the doorway
3. on the balcony, just to the right of the skethis boss holding cell.

When u get portals spawning from locations 1&2, they all come in one convenient group, easily aggroable using consecrate or Frizbee.

Group 3 HAS changed though. u normally get 4 mobs here, and they split up into 2 groups, one goes left, the other right. Can get messy - specially with pugs.

What i do is either:

A. if we are ahead of time i run right up to the portal, and frizbee the mobs the instant they spawn - not giving them time to split up.
Then kite them back to the floor so im not LOS of healer.

or

B. if i cant get to portal before they spawn, frizbee 1 group, run to other group and consecrate/hotR.


I've taken to dropping a consecrate at the bottom of the rubble, and running left to the ramp and intercepting the two runners there. I walk back down the stairs, drop another consecrate, and all four walk right up to me. Provided DPS has a brain, you have enough aggro on all mobs to account for any HOTs ticking on you.
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Postby Viycktor » Mon Feb 02, 2009 2:36 pm

The last time I did it with the split groups, I just ASed the two melee (think they always go right) while running left. On the 3-pack I just HandoR the one left runner, on the 4-pack I HandoR one of the left guys and judge the other.

However, if you catch it fast enough you can AS the right two and be in range to HammeroR the left two and not have to worry about taunting or judging... but I have PoJ so that probably helps a bit.

Dropping a consecrate proactively is also a good idea (though I've been running low on mana for the trash in there lately) and frees you up to AS the left one/two.
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Postby Maat » Mon Feb 02, 2009 4:04 pm

When I'm on my hunter, I cheetah over to that portal, MD the tank, and drop an Explosive trap under it <.< seems to help out to prevent the group from splitting
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Postby bub64882 » Wed Feb 04, 2009 1:14 pm

Maat wrote:When I'm on my hunter, I cheetah over to that portal, MD the tank, and drop an Explosive trap under it <.< seems to help out to prevent the group from splitting


God I wish there were more hunters like you. The class has some awesome tools, and some really bad players who either ignore them or put them to poor use.
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Postby Mozen » Wed Feb 04, 2009 8:06 pm

Just to chime in a little on LOS issues. I used to play a warlock and I really don't like to be squeezed onto little platforms like that. Probably because back in TBC, a thunder-clap, war stomp or some similar melee AOE can take down half if not more of my health. (And anyone should understand how warlocks hate to be close to AOE packs due to Seeding---a mere 10 yards can often be the difference between life and death.)

I also did once have LOS issues when healing a blood elf death knight in the original heroic VH. He couldn't decide whether he wanted to tank on the platform or off the platform and kept adjusting the packs. It was annoying as hell to keep getting LOS errors.

Here's my rule (when playing tank) when there's stairs involved: always tank so that nothing's on the top of the stairs. Keep all the mobs and myself just one step below the top, then all will be fine.

Just tank them somewhere halfway on the stairs. What's there to loose? Making it easy for your group is making it easy for yourself. Reasonable players will know to position themselves behind you so you can pick up adds.
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Postby Mishakal » Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:45 pm

The instance is so small, I just smash into the mobs and the group moves to do DPS/Healing ... easy as that

Havent had anyone complain.
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Postby HinataDestiny » Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:44 am

You sir have found the standard pug group when people say what pugging is like. Idoits
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Postby Discus » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:35 am

Interesting - last time I ran this with the guild healer he said he'd run it with lots of PUGs and we were doing it wrong i.e. on orb boss we shouldn't kite across the landing as we'd always done as the healer couldnt keep me in los.

TBH it ended up with a rare guild fall-out and I vowed not to return to the place. Even if you find Heroic VH easy it's just not a fun dungeon and causes more fights between guildies/PUGs than any other dungeon (chiefly because of the horrible wipe and have to re-run mechanic)

I say boycott the place, otherwise it just encourages Blizz to add more like it :wink: After all it's far less work to create a Violet Hold/Black Morass than a proper dungeon.
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