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Beta Retribution

Mists of Pandaria Beta discussion

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Beta Retribution

Postby Mannstein » Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:37 am

Hello all,

Have someone playing ret in the Beta? What's your feedback so far?
I'm talking more about playability and fun factor.

I have been doing some questing but i was expecting to see if there will be some lvl 90premades.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby Sabindeus » Fri Jul 20, 2012 11:31 am

also known as "Betribution"

I'm levelling as Ret right now and I am enjoying it.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby Worldie » Fri Jul 20, 2012 1:46 pm

Holy power like it's raining!

After having player a few hours on beta, playing again on Live looks so... slow. With the 1 holy power every 4.5 sec being our standard since 2 years, moving to a system in which you got a dynamic gain of holy power through 3 skills is so refreshing.

Much more fast paced and enjoyable than live, if you ask me. Also, the new 5 HP cap allows you to have some variations in the rotation (still not well discussed by the experts) where you may prefer a HP generator over a finished.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby PsiVen » Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:15 am

I'll have to try that out... I read the little blurb about how Holy Power "comes faster" now, practiced my Prot rotation on a target dummy with my 0.8% hit, read that line again, and scratched my head. It's pretty clear to me now that I will have to hit cap for my own sanity in MoP.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby Sabindeus » Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:12 am

Retribution HoPo comes way faster than Prot, especially when you're hit/exp capped
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby theckhd » Sun Jul 22, 2012 7:04 am

PsiVen wrote:I'll have to try that out... I read the little blurb about how Holy Power "comes faster" now, practiced my Prot rotation on a target dummy with my 0.8% hit, read that line again, and scratched my head. It's pretty clear to me now that I will have to hit cap for my own sanity in MoP.

Well, it does come a little faster.

Cata: 1 every 3 seconds, or 0.333 HP per second
MoP: 1 every 4.5 seconds (CS) + 1 every 6.75 seconds (J), for 0.3704 HP per second.

That's ignoring hit/exp, but that only skews things further in MoP's favor. We currently have to overcome 28.5% avoidance (8% hit, 6.5% dodge, 14% parry), though it's only 22% if you count the double-dipping on exp (8% hit, 6.5% dodge+parry, 7.5% parry). In MoP we'll only have 22.5% (7.5% hit, 7.5% dodge, 7.5% parry) total, with no double-dipping, and that's only on 60% of our generation (CS). The other 40% is from Judgment, which can't be parried, lowering the total to 15%. The generation-contribution weighted average of the two is 19.5% avoidance, a net increase in reliability.

In any event though, it looks like hit and expertise will be decent survivability stats in MoP, so we may be inclined to hit cap and exp soft-cap anyway.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby Qeeze » Sun Jul 22, 2012 8:49 am

theckhd wrote:In any event though, it looks like hit and expertise will be decent survivability stats in MoP, so we may be inclined to hit cap and exp soft-cap anyway.


You'll want to stay capped as you level. A quick trip to the reforger is a good idea for every quest reward you pick up as you level. On live right now I'm BiS, and at 90 I'm only using a few of those items. You'll get plenty up upgrades as you level. Just make sure you do all the quests lines and run the dungeons.

Challenge mode runs will want Ret paladins for their burst potential and ability to toss a heal or two. Sacred Shield is a very useful ability and I keep it up on myself at all times while in combat. I set up a weak aura to track it on both me and other players. ClCinfo has a working version up on curse now. So basically as ret I do my usual rotation and added SS & SotR into the mix, and with Holy Prism I have plenty of options.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby Worldie » Sun Jul 22, 2012 10:01 am

You people don't happen to know a working dmgmeter on the beta?
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby KysenMurrin » Sun Jul 22, 2012 10:52 am

Haven't had a chance to load them up yet myself and see what they're like, but on WowInterface there are Skada and TinyDPS, both claiming to be MoP compatible.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby halabar » Sun Jul 22, 2012 5:01 pm

Worldie wrote:You people don't happen to know a working dmgmeter on the beta?


Recount is working, just download the latest version from the project site.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby PsiVen » Mon Jul 23, 2012 9:35 pm

theckhd wrote:Well, it does come a little faster.

Cata: 1 every 3 seconds, or 0.333 HP per second
MoP: 1 every 4.5 seconds (CS) + 1 every 6.75 seconds (J), for 0.3704 HP per second.

That's ignoring hit/exp, but that only skews things further in MoP's favor. We currently have to overcome 28.5% avoidance (8% hit, 6.5% dodge, 14% parry), though it's only 22% if you count the double-dipping on exp (8% hit, 6.5% dodge+parry, 7.5% parry). In MoP we'll only have 22.5% (7.5% hit, 7.5% dodge, 7.5% parry) total, with no double-dipping, and that's only on 60% of our generation (CS). The other 40% is from Judgment, which can't be parried, lowering the total to 15%. The generation-contribution weighted average of the two is 19.5% avoidance, a net increase in reliability.


MoP is also missing the SoV glyph, which double-dips to 5%. Grand Crusader procs are an important contribution as well (roughly estimated).

Cata gives 76.5% to-hit x 0.333 HP/sec + (85.5% x 76.5% x 20.0% x 0.333) = 0.299 HP/sec average
MoP gives 77.5% to-hit x 0.222 + 85.0% x 0.148 + (85.0% x 77.5% x 20.0% x 0.222) = 0.327 HP/sec average

On average I should expect to see slightly better results in MoP. In practice I find it feels like I'm having far worse miss streaks...
Just takes getting used to, I suppose, but I fully intend to reforge full hit/expertise in 5.0 and never look back. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby Sagara » Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:47 pm

We'll be back to a good old choice between stability and average.

Dodge, Parry will bring the biggest contribution, while Hit and Expertise will smooth the HoPo curve and give greater control and stabler availability. Mastery would then fall more in the "middle of the road".

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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby Flex » Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:45 am

PsiVen wrote:On average I should expect to see slightly better results in MoP. In practice I find it feels like I'm having far worse miss streaks...


Sanity check in that you're going against a non-boss training dummy.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby PsiVen » Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:06 pm

Well, I'm comparing against a boss mob in both cases.
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Re: Beta Retribution

Postby Skye1013 » Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:55 pm

Boss mobs on live are lvl 88. If you're still lvl 85 on beta/ptr, then the lvl 93 boss mobs would definitely cause lower HP gen.
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