Diablo 3 is live!

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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby rodos » Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:06 pm

Worldie wrote:
halabar wrote:And then you hit Inferno where the monk needs at least a 9 million gold MH weapon with tons of LoH to be decent and a DH can get by with a lot less.

That's a bit exagerated. I'm doing just fine in act 3 with 2.8% life steal and 800ish life on hit... and i spent barely 500k for all the gear set (including 750 dps weapon)

Dual wield is a trade of more armor vs higher atk speed hence more life return and some more dodge.

(after getting bored of my WD i rerolled monk, feels like playing a paladin tank ^_^ )

I play my monk (Act 1 Inferno) in a very paladin tanky style. I usually DW, but also have a shield with +armor and +resist for really hard hitters. I play with low dps (about 8k, because I can't afford a decent weapon yet) but a very defensive build with Serenity and Breath of Heaven, which feel a lot like DS and WoG :) Grinding things down, healing when I get to about 60% hp, and bubbling out of sticky situations is the paladin solo style gameplay that I always loved.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby PsiVen » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:21 am

Worldie wrote:
halabar wrote:And then you hit Inferno where the monk needs at least a 9 million gold MH weapon with tons of LoH to be decent and a DH can get by with a lot less.

That's a bit exagerated. I'm doing just fine in act 3 with 2.8% life steal and 800ish life on hit... and i spent barely 500k for all the gear set (including 750 dps weapon)

Dual wield is a trade of more armor vs higher atk speed hence more life return and some more dodge.

(after getting bored of my WD i rerolled monk, feels like playing a paladin tank ^_^ )


I'm a bit mystified by this considering my wizard's 650 dps LoH weapon cost 800k (which was a pretty good deal), and the resist gear needed to melee in A3 (before 1.03) cost 300k-700k per slot with aggressive shopping around plus a 4m String of Ears.

I don't think it's any exaggeration that melee needs a 9 million gold MH weapon to be decent, at least for farming DPS. Ranged classes can easily focus their gear on more DPS stats, and in particular can easily obtain a weapon with several hundred more DPS for the same price as an LoH weapon. To actually catch a decent weapon for an affordable price requires getting extremely lucky or spending a lot of time camping the AH for undervalue postings to pop up.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby Passionario » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:36 am

Wait, are we talking about EU or US auction prices? There's a pretty huge discrepancy between these regions.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby lythac » Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:54 am

Yesterday I bought a 725 DPS, 450 LoH, ~10 Arcane Power, 100+ Vit (and other random stats) for 50k EU side for my Wizard. Isn't the greatest weapon due to zero int but I felt it was a nice buy. Replaced a 730 DPS, 250 LoH blue that I picked up for 30k.

Either there is a massive price discrepancy between regions or the bottom has fallen out of the lower end level 60 weapon market due to saturation.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby halabar » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:45 am

Starting to have some fun flipping weapons in the AH, only buying potential future upgrades and then reposting them, made about 100k last night during raid on lvl 30-40 weapons. I see the potential here. (But I think I may have screwed up this morning and posted the wrong weapon at an undercut price level, which means while I didn't loose much on it, I lost out on big profits... sigh.. working too fast).

You certainly need to jump on deals when you see them, they don't stay up there long.

But perhaps it is sad that I still see the AH as more interesting than actually playing the game.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby amh » Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:04 pm

fuzzygeek wrote:The best ad in the world for Torchlight 2 is Diablo 3.


Torchlight (1) was a nice appetizer for returning to Diablo, but it felt rather shallow. Grinding further and further down into that dungeon just seemed pointless. :( It's been months since I played it, but if I remember correctly, I got some fifty levels down, and it just got easier and easier. I used the warrior archetype character with a 1H + shield build, and breezed through packs like they weren't even there.

I haven't checked out the sequel yet, but I hope it's got more to offer than the first game.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby Flex » Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:08 pm

amh wrote:
fuzzygeek wrote:The best ad in the world for Torchlight 2 is Diablo 3.


Torchlight (1) was a nice appetizer for returning to Diablo, but it felt rather shallow. Grinding further and further down into that dungeon just seemed pointless.


I "beat" Torchlight dumping all of my points into adventuring or whatever for health potion boosts and pet return speed while occasionally using a point to unlock an attack or skill.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby amh » Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:10 pm

Yeah, that about sums it up. :]
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby rodos » Wed Jun 27, 2012 4:30 pm

lythac wrote:Yesterday I bought a 725 DPS, 450 LoH, ~10 Arcane Power, 100+ Vit (and other random stats) for 50k EU side for my Wizard. Isn't the greatest weapon due to zero int but I felt it was a nice buy. Replaced a 730 DPS, 250 LoH blue that I picked up for 30k.

Either there is a massive price discrepancy between regions or the bottom has fallen out of the lower end level 60 weapon market due to saturation.

Searching wiz 1-handers with 400 LoH, 8 Max AP, 85 Vit on US AH at the moment, best under 50k gold is 609 dps (for 40k gold). To get 725 dps or higher - 880k gold.

So yes, there is a massive price discrepancy.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby lythac » Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:35 pm

rodos wrote:
lythac wrote:Yesterday I bought a 725 DPS, 450 LoH, ~10 Arcane Power, 100+ Vit (and other random stats) for 50k EU side for my Wizard. Isn't the greatest weapon due to zero int but I felt it was a nice buy. Replaced a 730 DPS, 250 LoH blue that I picked up for 30k.

Either there is a massive price discrepancy between regions or the bottom has fallen out of the lower end level 60 weapon market due to saturation.

Searching wiz 1-handers with 400 LoH, 8 Max AP, 85 Vit on US AH at the moment, best under 50k gold is 609 dps (for 40k gold). To get 725 dps or higher - 880k gold.

So yes, there is a massive price discrepancy.


As I am at home and not guessing from work the item stats are -

725.9 DPS
95 STR
153 Dex
148 Vit
546 LoH
13 AP

But aw :( no int.

But in searching for wizard 1H I am not sure I would search for AP, that might push the price up. Search for LoH and then judge on DPS (for cheap weapons).
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby rodos » Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:45 pm

lythac wrote:
rodos wrote:
lythac wrote:Yesterday I bought a 725 DPS, 450 LoH, ~10 Arcane Power, 100+ Vit (and other random stats) for 50k EU side for my Wizard. Isn't the greatest weapon due to zero int but I felt it was a nice buy. Replaced a 730 DPS, 250 LoH blue that I picked up for 30k.

Either there is a massive price discrepancy between regions or the bottom has fallen out of the lower end level 60 weapon market due to saturation.

Searching wiz 1-handers with 400 LoH, 8 Max AP, 85 Vit on US AH at the moment, best under 50k gold is 609 dps (for 40k gold). To get 725 dps or higher - 880k gold.

So yes, there is a massive price discrepancy.


As I am at home and not guessing from work the item stats are -

725.9 DPS
95 STR
153 Dex
148 Vit
546 LoH
13 AP

But aw :( no int.

If I saw a 700+ dps, 150 dex, 550 LoH monk weapon for anything less than double my net worth I'd probably fall off my chair. Too bad monk can't poke people with wands.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby halabar » Thu Jun 28, 2012 6:41 am

My Goblin ways are still running good... while the RMAH has slowed...

In the past two days I've made 650k buying lvl 30-40 weapons and flipping them. Biggest was a lvl 40 fist weapon that I bought for 40k and sold for 330k. (120 dps, 110 agi, 30 LoH, or something like that). Wasn't planning really on selling it, but figured I'd post it on the high end and see what happened. :o
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby Passionario » Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:17 am

Flex wrote:The difference between Monk and Barbarian interaction with LoH pisses me off.

On other hand, Barbarians don't need 70K+ DPS to reach the point where Lifesteal becomes more efficient than LoH.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby aureon » Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:39 am

OK, hear my words.
As a fellow tank and mathematician.
String of Ears sucks. Really, really sucks. Even 20% ones.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby Winkle » Thu Jun 28, 2012 9:28 am

Passionario wrote:
Flex wrote:The difference between Monk and Barbarian interaction with LoH pisses me off.

On other hand, Barbarians don't need 70K+ DPS to reach the point where Lifesteal becomes more efficient than LoH.


Lifesteal has a coefficient of 0.2 on damage in Inferno though. At 70k dps you would need 5k lifesteal to get 1000hps which is equivalent to 666LoH considering 1.5 attacks/sec
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby Worldie » Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:04 pm

So wait, you telling me the 6% lifesteal i got is completely useless and i wasted my money? :S
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby PsiVen » Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:39 pm

aureon wrote:OK, hear my words.
As a fellow tank and mathematician.
String of Ears sucks. Really, really sucks. Even 20% ones.

If you want to take less melee damage, nothing is going to do it better than String of Ears. It's equivalent to ~300 physical resist for most people, if you're taking punches in the face.

That said, post-1.03, it's not best in slot for A3/A4 Inferno. Most of the dangerous damage is not melee, and the prospect of stacking enough resist/armor to reduce Molten and various awful fireballs / succubus bolts to tankable levels is much more reasonable now. I will probably wind up switching when I find an awesome belt.

Stormshield, however, sucks pretty bad for its asking price.


Worldie wrote:So wait, you telling me the 6% lifesteal i got is completely useless and i wasted my money? :S

Not useless, but pretty lousy until you get good DPS gear. Given an attack that connects for 20k with 100% LoH coefficient, 6% lifesteal in Inferno is as effective as 240 LoH.

Most builds that take advantage of LoH to heal meaningfully use spells with high coefficients. For example, on my melee wizard I have about 11k listed DPS, perform roughly 70k DPS with an ideal rotation, and generate in excess of 400% LoH per second against a single target. My 1200 LoH would match 34% lifesteal.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby Passionario » Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:03 pm

Winkle wrote:Lifesteal has a coefficient of 0.2 on damage in Inferno though. At 70k dps you would need 5k lifesteal to get 1000hps which is equivalent to 666LoH considering 1.5 attacks/sec


Yeah, but Lifesteal procs from all damage you do. Many attacks either don't proc LoH at all or do so at ridiculously low coefficients.
And Barbarians can get an additional 3% (0.6% on Inferno) LS due to their awesome belts.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby aureon » Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:31 am

Thing is, for using String of Ears, you lose out:
~50 all res
~50 specific res
~50 vit
and other random stats.
even if you're hellah high on resists (i'm at nearly 1400 now), it's hardly worth it, since at this point, it's not melee damage having a shot at killing you.
At lower resist values, that 20% is much less efficient.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby Epimer » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:58 am

So after my woes from a few pages ago, I feel like I'm back on track with my WD.

I've followed this guy's advice with a few minor tweaks and it's let me do my quickest and easiest 5 NV stack Butcher farm yet. I have high hopes for it holding up in Act II as well.

Basically it's a Dire Bats/Vision Quest build. I hated VQ builds but because you'll use Spirit Walk/Siphon all the time, plus Unbreakable Grasp for the slow, you're already at 3 out of the 4 abilities you need on cooldown already. The fourth is either a CC ability (he uses Horrify, I use Hex) or a short term damage buff like Big Bad Voodoo with Slam Dance.

It's not a build I would have come up with myself through experimentation, not least because it uses Pierce the Veil with a high mana cost primary damage ability. But it works. I use Hex over Horrify because of the heal from Hedge Magic; I'm not sure what the LOH coefficient of Dire Bats is but it certainly feels very, very low. I'm not sure that Languish is the best rune for Soul Harvest but I guess it's additional safety for an ability I didn't think would be usable in Inferno.

The other big help is that gear has come down in price since I was having trouble. I can get 100+ Int items for comfortably less than 50k for each slot, with mana regen on weapon, helm and off-hand to support the above build and some crit. I spent maybe 200k on gear this morning and my stats are now:

- 26k damage (with 20% from Pierce the Veil already included)
- 14.5% crit chance
- +77% crit damage
- 833 max mana with 49 mana regen per second
- 20k health, 49% damage reduction (resists around 200)

With even a 3 stack of Soul Harvest, Act I Champion packs just melt. I think I'm now in a comfortable position to start work an Act II and get those stats up some more.

Also, I frickin' love Dire Bats and am very happy to have a build which uses them and works well. I've missed them.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby halabar » Mon Jul 02, 2012 8:14 am

Amused that now with my Monk at lvl 40, I have 2M gold mainly from flipping items in the AH..

At some point I'll spend all I have on one lvl63 max item, sell it on the RMAH, and call it a day.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby Gab » Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:17 am

gtechman wrote:This video helped me a lot for farming gear in Inferno. I can do a quick Act 1 run and get tons of more rares than just from a Butcher run.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0r2EzZDngQ


Not bad. Just got around to trying this out and am averaging about 1 rare/minute as a decently geared melee Wizard wearing a 219% MF set.

Not really sure, looking for some opinions, would it be better to be clearing Act III with virtually no MF at a much slower pace/higher mortality rate vs obliterating Act I with 219% MF. It really seems MF Act I is a better bet but I only recently cleared Act III so again not really sure.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby djlar » Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:55 am

Wow and I thoght my DH's crit damage @ 245% was a bit low.. hehe..

I'm seeing constant 120K crits now...

Did a full Act 1 run, got a couple of upgrades and a sellable item for 500K (that sold almost immediatly I should have placed it at 1M LOL)
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby aureon » Mon Jul 02, 2012 1:23 pm

halabar wrote:Amused that now with my Monk at lvl 40, I have 2M gold mainly from flipping items in the AH..

At some point I'll spend all I have on one lvl63 max item, sell it on the RMAH, and call it a day.

Sorry, but at the current prices, 2M is about 3€.
Anything not made in inferno is peanuts, basically.
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Re: Diablo 3 is live!

Postby halabar » Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:12 pm

aureon wrote:
halabar wrote:Amused that now with my Monk at lvl 40, I have 2M gold mainly from flipping items in the AH..

At some point I'll spend all I have on one lvl63 max item, sell it on the RMAH, and call it a day.

Sorry, but at the current prices, 2M is about 3€.
Anything not made in inferno is peanuts, basically.


Hmm.. then I made out really well with the $11 that I made selling low-level (20-40) stuff sofar.

On the other hand, the market is probably getting more saturated, and I haven't sold anything in a week or so.
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