[10H] Majordomo Staghelm

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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Kishandra » Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:37 pm

Total scythe damage = around 700k for a tank. -50% (GoAK) = 350k. -40% (dp) = 210k. -20% (AD) = 168k. That's definitely healable. Add BH trinket for further damage reduction.
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Treck » Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:48 pm

Hmm, would be a waste using AD together with the others.
As it works fine on its own.
But, you can always use GoAK, DP (glyphed), TB trinket together with some CD from the raid like rallying cry (should make you survive it for sure since TB trinket can be random) Barrier/painsupp, or Sacrifice, since your using GoAK a 3min CD any other CD WILL be off CD at the same time as theres nothing with +3min on it.
If your priest is Holy, GS works aswell, and you shouldnt have to use more than DP/TB trinket for it to succesfully save you.
Thus, you can rotate:
1st Scorpion Phase, 1st cleave, GoAK + DP + TBtrinket + Sacrifice. Then AD for the 2nd one.
2nd Scorpion Phase, 1st cleave, DP + TBtrinket + GS.
then repeat.
Otherwise id suggest one cleave per scorpion phase.
Remember that the cleave damage goes up every time you change him, so unlucky TB ressists in the end can be very bad :S
Also, your priest should obviously time a shield for the cleave ^^
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Belloc » Wed Aug 24, 2011 6:07 pm

Base cleave damage is actually 900k. With just DP and GoAK, you're looking at 270k (minus resists). With the mirror it's considerably lower.
Last edited by Belloc on Thu Aug 25, 2011 7:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Arincia » Wed Aug 24, 2011 9:48 pm

With min resist could be possible to take up quite a few stacks.
30% is aura mastery(390)+elixir(90)= 480/483
30% is aura/totem (195)+Trinket (400)= 595/483
40% is aura mastery(390)+trinket(400)= 790/724

So if you went with 40% min resist then:

.5 (gank)*.6 (glyped dp) *.6 (min resist)= 18% taken
900k*.18= 162k

Using GS with this stacked (so max of 380k for a 190k tank)
380/162= 2.375 increase in damage or
380/.18=2111 damage
so 900*(.08*x)=2111
x= 29
So Domo would need 29 or more stacks of fury to kill you.

If PS is used with this (so max taken of 170k for a safe survival)
.18*.5=.09
.09*900k= 81k
170/.09= 1889
so 900*(.08*x)=1889
x= 26
SO 26 or more stacks untill tank is dead.

Either way it safe to say as long as the tank was toped off before hand you can easily have the tank solo a flame scythe every 3 minutes. (using ad trick can solo 1 every 1.5 minutes or 2 in a row every 3 minutes).

Of course 30% min resist does severely drop down the stacks till your at a higher risk (due to no AM). and it does require 2 coordinated cd's (AM and PS/GS).
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Bellante » Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:05 am

While it's all well and good with all these considerations on scythe damage, if you look around you'll notice that most people completely cheese the fight by taking 0-1 scythes in every scorpion form, and then go back to cat for 7-8 jumps. Rinse, repeat, dead boss.

On our first kill, which was on 4th try, first 3 being complicated "let's take 13 scythes on first scorpion, to maximize concentration on 3 dps'ers etc", then switching to "hell, let's just try this thing with keeping him in cat, and only take 4-5 scythes until debuffs are gone), I was shocked to find how ridiculously easy this fight is.

You can easily 2-heal this and just take 0 scythes to be honest, after I told a sister-guild about our kill, they 2 shot it like that.

Shockingly bad design, you are not even close to enrage on it like this. To fix the fight, he needs a huge health buff and/or a mechanic to force you to stay in scorpion for longer. It just seems that concentration wasn't that thought out by blizzard. It was a very interesting fight when it was about planning cooldowns, how many people to have out of scythe stack, etc., and then cat phase being about a breather for healers whilst maintaining dps pressure. As it stands, I'm surprised more people don't make this their first kill (although the feeling of cheese might come from more and more set-bonuses and general gear level, obviously).

Anyway, I'd definitely stop worrying about complicated tactics and just go in and 1-2 shot him with 0 scythes, 8 cat, all the way down.
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Ezelyn » Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:28 am

Bellante wrote:Anyway, I'd definitely stop worrying about complicated tactics and just go in and 1-2 shot him with 0 scythes, 8 cat, all the way down.


Totally agree, we were wasting our time, trying to kill him with 3 heal and scorpion phase...
He is really easy with the 2 healing way.
Doesn't require heavy dps, doesn't require heavy healers.
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Hrobertgar » Fri Aug 26, 2011 7:19 am

To fix the fight, he needs a huge health buff and/or a mechanic to force you to stay in scorpion for longer.


I think a health buff would be counter-productive as staying in scorpion and eating flame scythe damage would still remove concentration and extend the fight so people would just be even more adamant about doing cat only. A mechanic change to require more scorpion hits might be in order.
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Bellante » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:22 pm

Yeah, I guess you're right that the point is that concentration stays up longer in cat form - I was just thinking that what I liked about it was the need to find out how many people you can keep out of scythe while going as high as possible and still survive, even having more people stacked up as the scythe stacks get higher.

With a health buff and something as simple as a cooldown on form switching, I think he'd be quite back on track, if the dps requirement was tuned to require a dynamic tactic on how many people are stacked up on scythe during each scorpion phase. Oh well, better luck next time blizz, guess we've never seen a boss buff this late into the content..
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Hrobertgar » Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:49 pm

Actually I think your idea on a form switching CD would really address your concerns. If Domo has to spend long enough in scorp form to send out ~3 flame-scythes (1+ mins) then most of the raid has to stack and give up their concentration buffs, as few raids will have enough CDs for a tank to consistently eat more than 1 scythe each scorp phase.

As to what would motivate Blizz to add such a mechanic in exchange for loot upgrades...
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Treck » Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:04 pm

The reason you DONT go scorpion more than solosoaks/resetting Adrenaline is to gain dps.
Increasing the boss hp would just mean that you would never be able to soak.
On that note, theres really no dps race in 10man.
A lot of the firstkills in 10man was with cleave soaks, and STILL way before enrage.
Firstkills in 25man was with the dpsers having close to 100% uptime on consentration (downtime during orbs and their own Seed) and STILL just very tight on the dps making it before enrage.

Theres not much they can do to make people wanna stay in scorpion form, unless they reduce the cleave dmg or smth AND makes you not loose consentration from the cleave damage.
If you keep your consentration or loose it should be up to you playing good/bad, not up to your strat imo.
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby fafhrd » Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:03 pm

While upping his hp would indeed provide even more incentive to skip cleaves, even 3 healing through lots of cleaves and having nearly everyone eat every one of them his enrage is something of a non-factor on 10. Our first kill with high cleave numbers beat the enrage by about 10s with one dps dying around 10%, and even on bad attempts we've only seen the enrage once. Nowadays with a bit more gear and people playing better in terms of Concentration uptime/use, but the same high cleave 3 heal strat he dies about a minute before enrage. We even had time to switch to making only DPS soak Fire Orbs, unlike our first kill where healers helped. Actually doing no cleaves would probably mean beating the enrage by 3 minutes or so.

A mechanic change to force people to stay in scorpion form longer would be a better fix, but unless they only apply the change to 10, that would make 25 harder since even taking 0 cleaves, a lot of guilds that kill him on 25H now are still close to the enrage. With that in mind you have to ask why Blizzard would want to enforce a strat that includes taking cleaves - if the goal is just to make the fight's relative difficulty closer to 25's, the better solution would be to buff his HP so the enrage at least isn't a nonfactor and people use the no-cleave strat because they need it to beat the enrage.
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Belloc » Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:23 pm

Oh, just let it stay a free loot boss :P
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby PsiVen » Sun Aug 28, 2011 1:22 pm

It would make more sense if Concentration only applied in Cat form and encouraged you not to take damage, while Determination or something buffed you based on damage taken during Scorpion form.

But yeah, there's not much point in changing it now.
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Darielle » Sun Aug 28, 2011 2:43 pm

Honestly? There are mechanics in place to "deter" keeping him in one form all the time. That's basically what Fury's supposed to do, as well as forcing Searing Seeds and Orbs the more you make him transform.

If Fury affected, say, Searing Seeds and Orbs (and Orbs pierced immunity), and you couldn't dodge Leaping Flames, no-Scythe might be a lot less viable. But there's no real point in them changing it, because I think they approve of people being smart as long as fights aren't being "broken".
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Re: [10H] Majordomo Staghelm

Postby Bellante » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:10 am

Well, I think most would agree that something that feels this cheesy as the last boss before Ragnaros Heroic is exactly that: Broken. Comparing it to say, Cho'gall heroic (dropped tier11 Heroic shoulders), where there was definitely a gimmick involved with the corrupted blood mage, Cho'gall was still a challenge and an exciting kill.

Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with a lootship, but not one that drops tier and is the right hand of Ragnaros. Or he could at least be wearing a funny hat :D
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