Remove Advertisements

Logical Progression Path?

Moderators: Fridmarr, Worldie, Aergis, guillex

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Chicken » Fri Feb 25, 2011 5:19 pm

baleogthefierce wrote:
Creature wrote:I hate it when new people come in these boards and don't even learn to read. Freaking scrubs. It clearly states 'heroic progression' in the post he quoted.

L2Read nub. I say we ban this 'Creature' fella, simply for being so dumb.


Good thing this isn't EJ. I hear they take away your birthday for a post like that.
No, standard moderation procedure at that point is merely to send a couple of our 'assistants' over to ensure that there will be no further accidents of such a nature.
Image
User avatar
Chicken
 
Posts: 1597
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby sakkdaddy » Sat Feb 26, 2011 5:35 am

I have heard now that Nefarian is probably easier than Ascendant Council, but does everyone agree that Nef is harder than Valiona? I think our progression path is now going to be Valiona, Nef, Council, Cho'gall, Sinestra, Al'akir.
sakkdaddy
 
Posts: 38
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:14 am

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Treck » Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:00 am

sakkdaddy wrote:I have heard now that Nefarian is probably easier than Ascendant Council, but does everyone agree that Nef is harder than Valiona? I think our progression path is now going to be Valiona, Nef, Council, Cho'gall, Sinestra, Al'akir.

Im guessing your talking about hardmodes (since you listed sinestra).
Valiona is a pretty complex fight, but its not hard to exectute, the absolutely most important part, send people who know how to improvise, and adapt to new machanics fast, into the twilight realm. This is going to be the biggest source of wipes, people inside dying.
And if you dont have people who know how to not make the same mistake over and over, and actually see whats going wrong, then you can prolly kill them fairly easy.
Sending in 5people or so who are just used to doing what they are told, and not how to improvise was our main source of wipes when we progressed it, didnt help our progression, after 10 wipes of them dying, they didnt know why they died, or how they would prevent it, and most people who come up with the strat was never even inside that realm (we had more or less the same issue with conclave, the people on the wind platform just kept dying, and noone could tell us why or how they would do to prevent it from happening again as we couldnt see what was actually going on over there).

Back on topic, as you said, nefarian is not all that difficult.
Tbh its just like normalmode, but higher numbers, really.
Biggest differance is that Nefarian lands when the first add dies, so you need to have even dps, and the flaming cinders ("I hope you can swim, IN MOLTEN LAVA" what an awesome quote from Nefarian) takes a few tries to get to know (remember backupers if the kickers get cinders), a good path to progressing this is to just kill off Onyxia asap, and go to platforms for practice. P3 can be done from 100% down to 0% if you keep the add tanking up tbh, but i still recommend that if your going for a kill, do some dmg to nefarian in p1.

Coucil is a hard fight, its very tight in many ways.
After the change they got a lot easier for range heavy raids imo.
The hitbox is huge, and meele are most of the time out of range from the healers, so its easy for them to die tbh.
A lot of it comes down to just get a working positioning in p3.
Oh, and have many priests for lifegripping people with frost orb :P
But this fight is a bitch progressing on, since P3 is really the only "hard" part, but your gonna wipe a lot of times in p2, making you not even practice the hard part, then you get a bad gravity crush or whatever and it can still be a wipe easly p3, so it takes time, while actuall time spent progressing p3 is very minimal.

Some guilds start working on Chogall before they kill council, and it makes sence since the fight is a lot easier to understand and work with.
Tip is having a prot warrior that can spellreflect the firedebuff, so you dont have to dps it, and I use heavy CDs to survive them (so we dont have to dps any of the fire elementals).
Interrupts/knockbacks and people really beeing prepared to interrupt peoples worship is key to this fight really.

Sinestra is a very technical fight, and its gonna take a lot of time for your dispellers to get used to wrack and how to improvise with it.
And people should stop beeing blind when orbs come.
Id say this is one of the hardest fights ingame, but that depends a lot on your dispellers tbh, theres a lot for them to keep an eye on, and if they make a misstep, it can easily be a wipe.
And always have as high dps as you possibly can, it helps a lot on that fight.

On alakir its really only P1 that is difficult, there always seems to be some people dying from windburst combination, or chaining lightning to much, proper positioning in p1 is very important.
If you can make it through p1 without deaths, you can for sure kill the boss after that pretty fast.
Dont underestimate the other 2 phases, but p1 is really the biggest source of wipes.

Prolly way to much information.
TLDR, id say Valiona, Nefarian, chogall, council, sinestra alakir is prolly the "easiest" way of progression.
But that still depends on your guild, as every guild works different.
Image
User avatar
Treck
 
Posts: 2128
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:10 am

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby sakkdaddy » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:45 am

Nefarian is far easier than Valiona imo, after killing both. I think Valiona took us 55 wipes, and we killed Nefarian in under 35. We just ignored Nef other than banes of havok and a few double-dots until P3, then took him to zero with good add positioning in P3, and 3 cooldowns to cycle for Crackles. Rogues and ret pallies on platforms made interrupts easily manageable even if they got Cinders, because they can reset the stacks.

A guild on our server has indicated to us that Al'akir is the next boss after Nef that we should work on, simply because P1 is the only hard phase and the rest is mostly just like normal mode. I am just a bit confused as why so many more guilds do Al'akir last if he is easier than Cho'gall. If cheesing it by leaving some people at the entrance in Phase 1 still works, and Phases 2 and 3 are easy, why not do Al'akir before Cho'gall?

Just looking at kill statistics though, it does make sense to wait on Ascendant Council for us and focus on Cho'gall or Al'akir instead.
sakkdaddy
 
Posts: 38
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:14 am

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Boyfriend » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:40 am

I'd say due to the kiting bug (check the other thread for details) until it is fixed Nefarian is easier than Valiona, possibly easier than Magmaw or Omnotron. As P3 is a total joke and P1 is no different from normal. All you gotta do is get through P2, which is fine if it takes 10 tries and then kill him in P3. This will all change again once Nefarian and his adds can actually hit moving targets though.
Image
User avatar
Boyfriend
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 588
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 8:16 am
Location: Sweden

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby sakkdaddy » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:11 am

We didn't bother with the kiting bug at all in P3 and still killed it very quickly. Our main OT (prot paladin) just minimized movement and made sure to drag them away before new fire spawns hit them. Our OT (prot warrior) used a talented intervene for Crackle cd's on the Paladin, and we had 3 healers each on the MT and add tank, with 1 healer flexing. We entered P3 with Nef at about 94% hp or something, then burned him to 0 with time to spare on the enrage timer.

Killing it without abusing that exploit really doesn't make the fight much harder if you have skilled tanks.
sakkdaddy
 
Posts: 38
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:14 am

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Boyfriend » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:56 am

sakkdaddy wrote:We didn't bother with the kiting bug at all in P3 and still killed it very quickly. Our main OT (prot paladin) just minimized movement and made sure to drag them away before new fire spawns hit them. Our OT (prot warrior) used a talented intervene for Crackle cd's on the Paladin, and we had 3 healers each on the MT and add tank, with 1 healer flexing. We entered P3 with Nef at about 94% hp or something, then burned him to 0 with time to spare on the enrage timer.

Killing it without abusing that exploit really doesn't make the fight much harder if you have skilled tanks.


The bug always effects you, no matter what you do, so it's not like you're abusing it or not. The bug actually makes it harder for them to not get hit by fire as the adds will stand still for quite long times sometimes instead of moving towards the tank.
Image
User avatar
Boyfriend
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 588
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 8:16 am
Location: Sweden

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Rooix » Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:21 pm

As for 10man heroic progression path. Do you recommend going for Nefarian hc before V&T hc?
Rooix
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011 7:24 pm

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby maurok » Fri May 06, 2011 10:33 am

This topic is a little outdated now, plenty of changes/hotfixes were since early march.

My guild has been killing Halfus HC for 3 weeks, and last week as a really easy kill... we just downed nefarian (yes, we went for halfus hc before 12/12N ... shame on us :oops: ).
My group do a good job on brute forcing stuff, but some people lack good situational awareness (we did Twilight Council and halfus HC releasing evertything but slate at once in MUCH less tries than we did chogall for example). me, the other tank, 2 healers e 2~3 dpsers are really good players, the other ones are close friends that take more time to get things right =]

So, which Hard modes should we focus now? I heard atramedes and magmaw are significantly easier after the patch.
Image
maurok
 
Posts: 126
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 8:02 am

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Arianne » Fri May 06, 2011 10:51 am

Atramedes requires a lot of personal responsibility for dodging the rings and kiting the fire. You could stick the people who don't have good situational awareness in their own 'group' and let them all die and maybe get it down anyways though.

Magmaw is easier in that respect because you can stick most people in melee range and only have the people who can move well stay out in the dangerous area - though it has a higher comp requirement because you need a good kiter (DK, balance druid, hunter most likely) and 2-3 tanks depending on if you're 10 or 25.

After that, probably Chimeron if you have a good healing core and good tanks. Most people just have to move between two spots in that fight and you can stick any healers who can't move well in or near the stack up spot.
Arianne
 
Posts: 502
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2007 1:22 pm

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby superworm » Sun May 08, 2011 2:09 am

If your members are good at brute forcing, then the first choice after H Halfus should be H Chimaeron. You just need to assign a good standing point to each person before fight and ask them to return there after feud, so no positioning problem at all.

H Magmaw could be easy, if you have a good kiter and several people who knows how to avoid fire.

H Maloriak needs your party to avoid the black puddles fast in the black vial phase, so it could take some practice. After the patch 4.1 the AoE abilities of many classes are buffed and taking the adds down should not be a problem. The boss enters the burn phase at 25%, so watch out for your dps. You need two green phases to take down all the abberations.

After these comes the harder ones which requires good movement/coordination. H Atramedas, H conclave of wind and H twin dragons all need good coordination. I would say go for H twin dragons if you have been doing well in normal mode, as it has litter change except for sending people downstairs. H Nefarian requires your add tank in P3 to be very vigilant, other than that it's not very difficult, however as your raid group just down him in normal mode, I would recommend you practice more in normal mode before go for the H mode.
User avatar
superworm
 
Posts: 305
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:56 pm

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Nikachelle » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:23 am

Alright, yanking my thread back up for Firelands. Anyone have some solid thoughts on what the logical progression path is in there?
User avatar
Nikachelle
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 11001
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2009 10:39 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby RedAces » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:24 pm

25man.com has a kill order outlined here: http://25man.com/
also treck made a post here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=31779#p666187
Image
User avatar
RedAces
 
Posts: 500
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:39 am
Location: Germany

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Marsha » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:43 pm

Shannox - Alysrazor - Beth'tilac - Lord Ryolith is the kill order we'll most likely follow to get to Gatekeeper, Staghelm, & Rag.

Here's a map I found on a fairly new Strategy Site called Icy Veins http://www.icy-veins.com/

Image

Everyone probably should be looking to kill all the trash for the new rep, and those trash drops will be highly sought after. With Firelands every guild no matter their T11 progression rate has the option to pick which boss they'd like to learn 1st. IMO it's a smart move on Blizzards part. This new raid instance is tuned for raiders in 353 to say, 365 gear, so normal mode Boss kills really shouldn't be that hard.

From all reports from the PTR a lots of guilds should get several kills their 1st week in there, but we'll have to see if Blizzard did any last minute changes.

So which boss is your guild starting on first?
User avatar
Marsha
 
Posts: 74
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:44 am

Re: Logical Progression Path?

Postby Fetzie » Mon Jun 27, 2011 2:37 pm

I didn't think you would be able to farm tons of rep from trash mobs?

We are going for

Shannox
Rhyolith
Alysrazor
Baleroc
Beth'tilak
Majordummy
Raggy
Fetzie | Protection Paladin | EU-Kazzak
Author of the TankSpot Protection Paladin Guide
Image
Sagara wrote:You see, you need to *spread* the bun before you insert the hot dog.

bldavis wrote:we are trying to extend it as long as we can...it just never seems to last very long
User avatar
Fetzie
 
Posts: 2194
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2009 9:43 am
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PreviousNext

Return to Cataclysm Raids (T11+)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


Remove Advertisements

Who is online

In total there is 1 user online :: 0 registered, 0 hidden and 1 guest (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 380 on Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:28 pm

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest
?php } else { ?