[10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Finkum » Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:39 pm

saif wrote:Is it possible to for a tank to kill the adds in a melee heavy comp? Will the infected tank spawn a single add or multiples for each infection?


I tank the adds in 10-man Magmaw and it's quite simple. You can have a maximum of 3 infection debuffs at any point in time, and despite what the tooltip text indicates, you only generate 1 add per debuff. The adds hit for trivial amounts and the infection itself isn't very scary as long as you've got resistance aura/equivalent going.

As a warrior tank, as long as you use Thunderclap, Revenge, and Cleave on cooldown you will easily get aggro on any freshly spawned adds (and it's quite easy to taunt the occasional loose add back into the group). Given the 3-second cooldown on HoTR and 15-second cooldown on Avenger's Shield, I don't see why paladin tanks would have any issues either.

As an added bonus, you get to show up all of the dpsers; typically I pull 25+k DPS on Magmaw e.g. http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-eemvgt229224nbsd/sum/damageDone/?s=1070&e=1447
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Epimer » Mon Jan 17, 2011 2:42 am

Koatanga wrote:We first used a strat where the entire raid sat at melee except the tank and one ranged person to get the pillar of fire. Works remarkably well, though either the melee is not immune to being pillared, or we had someone standing slightly far out.


We used this strat too, and I'm fairly certain that a Pillar on the melee clump is due to someone straying too far out. We had that problem when people became over-eager to start DPS on the freshly spawned Parasites; they'd take a few steps towards them to get in range then would be targeted by the next Pillar, and things went downhill fast.

After the first pull, the healing lead said the strat was unworkable due to the massive amount of damage hitting everyone. We later discovered that a massive amount of damage happens regardless of position. With our gear level, I do not believe 2-healing is remotely possible through the first phase.


We two-healed this with a Resto Druid in ~346 gear and a Holy Paladin who was mostly in Bloodthirsty Gladiator/Ornate Pyrium gear. The log is here. Not through choice, I might add, but it worked. I think the difference for us was calling out Massive Crash and having people move out of it. I couldn't see so well (and was focusing on other things), but one of our melee swore that you could tell which side his head was going to come down on when he's thrashing about with chains, and by having the clump move out of it, you greatly reduce the healing requirements. A brief look at the log shows that we have a couple of players who took 0 damage from Massive Crash on the kill attempt, despite being in the melee clump for the entire fight, which lends credence to the idea that it is avoidable.
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Goodheart » Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:39 am

Isn't the crash direction indicated by the steam/clouds on the floor?
Or am I confusing abilities now :S
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Epimer » Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:06 am

Goodheart wrote:Isn't the crash direction indicated by the steam/clouds on the floor?
Or am I confusing abilities now :S


Ignition is indicated by the steam clouds on the floor and is extremely easy to avoid.

Massive Crash is, I think, damage caused by Magmaw's head smacking into the ground when he's thrashing about before being impaled on the spike. It seemed that his head could land in one of two places (I confess I wasn't watching too closely as I was busy trying to survive Mangle) and that there was some indication on the ground (dust maybe?) about which of those places his head would hit. Unfortunately I wasn't logging our early attempts where raid damage felt much higher (although that feeling could well be due to healer familiarity etc.), so I can't compare Massive Crash damage from those attempts and on the kill, so this is all somewhat anecdotal.

Clarifications welcome from anyone who has more of a clue about this than me!
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby ceric » Mon Jan 17, 2011 9:03 am

I'm doing this off memory and someone will need to confirm this but, I thought Magmaw sort of leaned his head a little toward the side he was going to fall on. I'm always watching for tells. I find them easier then the raid warnings. (like Pistol barrage with Godfrey. Easier to see his crossed arms.)
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Siral » Mon Jan 17, 2011 10:07 am

we just started raiding yesterday and stopped in our first tries at 50% of magmaw.

I've some problems using cooldowns at the right moment.

Tonight we go back to magmaw and this is what i'm supposed to do:

1) not using cd when i was mangled, just spam 3 HoPo Wog on me (i'm also specced with eternal glory and glyph of WoG)
2) using cooldowns in this order: GoaK after first mangle (maybe combined with all the other cd to reduce damage), Divine shield after second mangle, all Cd i have up after third mangle, lay on hands after fourth mangle (forbereance will be faded i hope).
3) having some problems to regain aggro when switch back to phase 1. Censure Dots + Consacration + Holy Radiance will be a good strategy to regain aggro, since our dps are too "retarted" to wait 2-3 seconds??? :) I want to put dot or similar because maybe i could be wrong in timing the taunt.
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Bashe » Wed Jan 19, 2011 4:19 am

Siral wrote:3) having some problems to regain aggro when switch back to phase 1. Censure Dots + Consacration + Holy Radiance will be a good strategy to regain aggro, since our dps are too "retarted" to wait 2-3 seconds??? :) I want to put dot or similar because maybe i could be wrong in timing the taunt.


I usually just position myself properly a few secs before vulnerability ends and start P1 with a taunt>discus>ShotR. Doesn't seem to fail.
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby baneoftruth » Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:02 am

OK, the issues I was previous experiencing with raid damage have been resolved. Chalk it up to improper healing.

That said, I wanted to share a couple tidbits of helpful strategy.

1. If your off-tank is not a paladin, use Hand of Protection on him/her at the start of Mangle. Cooldown-wise, you will only be able to do this every other Mangle, so if you have another paladin in your raid, just work out a rotation.
2. Regardless of your off-tank's class, use Hand of Sacrifice during Mangle once HoP/DS falls off.
3. Pop Divine Shield when your own Mangle starts. If you use the standard DS cancel macro, do not spam click it! When Magmaw goes to pick you up, you are prevented from using any abilities for about 1-2 seconds. It may actually be best to place the base ability onto your bar and just use that.
4. When you are being Mangled and are up in the air, you can attack the Exposed Head of Magmaw. Use this to generate Holy Power and use WoG.

One thing to note...and I'm not sure if this is a bug or not, but I have my OT as my focus target, and he drops as my focus at the start of Mangle. I believe this is related to how the Mangle ability executes, but either way, using the OT's name in your macros instead of focus may be advisable
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Dashdar » Tue Jan 25, 2011 6:32 am

Lots of great information here.

I just have a quick question. My guild has just started working on this fight and this is my first time being the raid leader and main tank. Several attempts this past Friday and we ended up calling it because of too little DPS on the parasites.

So my question is what kind of DPS should I be looking for from people in the raid? I've been saying at least 8k from everyone but was not sure if this is too low.

thanks
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Winkle » Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:08 am

Dashdar wrote:Lots of great information here.

I just have a quick question. My guild has just started working on this fight and this is my first time being the raid leader and main tank. Several attempts this past Friday and we ended up calling it because of too little DPS on the parasites.

So my question is what kind of DPS should I be looking for from people in the raid? I've been saying at least 8k from everyone but was not sure if this is too low.

thanks


Well considering you'd struggle to complete some heroic 5mans if DPS are doing less than 7k I think hitting 10k raid buffed isn't asking to much. OFC since Magmaw has the 100% damage debuff when spiked your raid DPS should be higher.

If you're struggling with AOEing down the adds you can always just have someone OT them or kite them for the whole fight.
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Dashdar » Tue Jan 25, 2011 9:20 am

Winkle wrote:Well considering you'd struggle to complete some heroic 5mans if DPS are doing less than 7k I think hitting 10k raid buffed isn't asking to much. OFC since Magmaw has the 100% damage debuff when spiked your raid DPS should be higher.

If you're struggling with AOEing down the adds you can always just have someone OT them or kite them for the whole fight.


We are struggling with the Adds and have yet to be able to make it through (or really into ) the second phase. We have 1 hunter stand who sets a trap and then the ranged DPS goes at them. Out hunter (BM) and Lock (Destro) are hitting 12k, but our Shadow Priest is only in the 8k (at best) mark.

And yes, there are several heroic 5mans that I just hate to do because of similar frustrations.
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby exiledknight » Tue Jan 25, 2011 9:48 am

Shadow Priests AoE sucks atm, not much they can do about it, however with those dps numbers it really seems like the adds should be dying. Is the priest single target nuking? We have a pretty competitive priest as far as WoL goes on this fight and when we do have them on adds they do single target, mind sear is just too weak until the patch. The group may not be moving far or fast enough.
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Winkle » Tue Jan 25, 2011 10:13 am

Dashdar wrote:
Winkle wrote:Well considering you'd struggle to complete some heroic 5mans if DPS are doing less than 7k I think hitting 10k raid buffed isn't asking to much. OFC since Magmaw has the 100% damage debuff when spiked your raid DPS should be higher.

If you're struggling with AOEing down the adds you can always just have someone OT them or kite them for the whole fight.


We are struggling with the Adds and have yet to be able to make it through (or really into ) the second phase. We have 1 hunter stand who sets a trap and then the ranged DPS goes at them. Out hunter (BM) and Lock (Destro) are hitting 12k, but our Shadow Priest is only in the 8k (at best) mark.

And yes, there are several heroic 5mans that I just hate to do because of similar frustrations.


TBH with those kinds of numbers you'd just be better off having an OT look after them. Our OT managed 26k DPS just aoe tanking the adds down on his own, rest of the dps just stay on the boss.
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Winkle » Tue Jan 25, 2011 10:13 am

Dashdar wrote:
Winkle wrote:Well considering you'd struggle to complete some heroic 5mans if DPS are doing less than 7k I think hitting 10k raid buffed isn't asking to much. OFC since Magmaw has the 100% damage debuff when spiked your raid DPS should be higher.

If you're struggling with AOEing down the adds you can always just have someone OT them or kite them for the whole fight.


We are struggling with the Adds and have yet to be able to make it through (or really into ) the second phase. We have 1 hunter stand who sets a trap and then the ranged DPS goes at them. Out hunter (BM) and Lock (Destro) are hitting 12k, but our Shadow Priest is only in the 8k (at best) mark.

And yes, there are several heroic 5mans that I just hate to do because of similar frustrations.


TBH with those kinds of numbers you'd just be better off having an OT look after them. Our OT managed 26k DPS just aoe tanking the adds down on his own, rest of the dps just stay on the boss.
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Re: [10] Magmaw - tastes like chicken!

Postby Dashdar » Tue Jan 25, 2011 10:20 am

exiledknight wrote:Shadow Priests AoE sucks atm, not much they can do about it, however with those dps numbers it really seems like the adds should be dying. Is the priest single target nuking? We have a pretty competitive priest as far as WoL goes on this fight and when we do have them on adds they do single target, mind sear is just too weak until the patch. The group may not be moving far or fast enough.


Our group does not move. The range stack with the melee and the hunter is the only one at range distance to get the worms to spawn on him and his trap. I think he may be trying to slow the adds that's part of the problem.
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