[25/10] Blood Prince Council

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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby hoho » Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:39 am

Doing it on normal mode I positioned my spriest under one of the orbs and meleed it. It's not quite perfect but it worked quite fine. I'm not sure if it was my lag or what else but I seemed to hit the orb between spellcasts quite often keeping it up rather well. Haven't tried it on heroic yet but I wouldn't be surprised if it did work good enough there aswell, though I guess a fast mainhander would be better than slow staff for it.
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Vathral2 » Tue Mar 23, 2010 5:32 am

I tank this encounter on the 25 man hardmode for our guild on my alt due to a severe issue in tank recruitment, and I'm usually the tank that is on keleseth. Surprisingly enough, paladins are actually GREAT tanks in my eyes to tank keleseth without any issues whatsoever.

Paladins only have 2 realistic attacks that work without fail with picking up dark nuclei, and that is JoWhatever you're running (I run wisdom), and exorcism. Since we tank the 3 princes in a triangle position, Valanar being right by the door, as the keleseth tank, if there's any orbs in the middle of the raid, the most important thing to remember is that you only need to spread out when the Invocation is on Valanar, and positioning is irrelevant for Taladaram/Keleseth Invocations. If it's too far for me, I run to it and use exorcism. If I can get closer, I just use JoW on it.

On our pulls to avoid threat issues, I tank with a death's choice/bloodvenom blade, pop wings and go nuts until about 5 seconds before the second Invocation. I'll grab 2 nuclei and then go back on keleseth. If the Invocation is on Taldaram, I'll stay on Keleseth, and if it's on Keleseth, I play the time to live mode and get orbs ASAP, disregarding what I have stack wise for shadow prison. Whenever it's on Taldaram/Valanar, Hammer of Wrath on Keleseth to avoid threat issues while I'm moving is amazing.

I've yet to experience ANY issues as the paladin tank on Keleseth using this.
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Loras » Tue Mar 23, 2010 5:37 am

On the other hand, this fight is soooooo ridiculously easy for a DK tank... Even for a normal DK. Due to bad setup, we've been doing our 10-man runs with a dps DK going frost presence (still in dps gear). Unless a healer screws something up, this is cake. Icy Touch is godlike for collecting orbs. Ranged, no cooldown (apart from the runes cooldowns themselves), and leaves a dot component which helps keeping the orbs sticked to you. Anti Magic Shell and IBF for emergency situations - coolio :)
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Argali » Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:51 am

Loras wrote:On the other hand, this fight is soooooo ridiculously easy for a DK tank... Even for a normal DK. Due to bad setup, we've been doing our 10-man runs with a dps DK going frost presence (still in dps gear). Unless a healer screws something up, this is cake. Icy Touch is godlike for collecting orbs. Ranged, no cooldown (apart from the runes cooldowns themselves), and leaves a dot component which helps keeping the orbs sticked to you. Anti Magic Shell and IBF for emergency situations - coolio :)


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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Loras » Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:09 am

It's so easy without it even, that I forgot it :P
And before we were a bit careful on aggro, since our DK could only IT Keleseth, but now with the "OMFG IT BUFF", it wouldn't be even a remote problem. *sigh*
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Benjilol » Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:58 am

ydraw wrote:On Hardmode we also ignored Keleseth to minimise shadow prison damage. It takes a while but the fight isn't a DPS race of any kid.

We are beating enrage by 2 minutes without our melee on Keleseth at all. Hardmode is basically just a Kinetic Orb check, everything else is fairly simple.
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby ydraw » Mon Mar 29, 2010 12:44 am

Yeah, we've actually had a few wipes when the game decided to spawn kinetic orbs in the next room and in places where they can't be targetted by players. FML.
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby econ21 » Tue May 25, 2010 4:29 am

My guild spent Saturday night wiping on this encounter (10 man normal) - I've read this thread and the one on tankspot, but wonder if anyone can offer further advice?

We initially tried with our warlock tanking Kelseth and two tanks on the other bosses, but the warlock kept dying and it seemed a waste of his great dps (he's very well geared). So then we switched to me (pally tank) on Kelseth and a (warrior) main tank on both the other two bosses. Much of the time we used a mage to bring the pink orbs to me as they were taunt immune, but reading since then, that seems to have been a waste of dps as HoRec can grab them if they are not targeting us and anyway, I can use judgement, AS and exorcism to grab them.

We tended to wipe when the main tank died and often our healers were out of mana about then. I am not sure exactly why this happened - maybe a lack of dps, maybe too much raid damage (the encounter was new to most of us) - as from reading it does not seem that main tanking both melee bosses (rather than having one tank per boss) should increase the burden on healers.

However, my query is more for tips with tankadining Kelseth. I read that he does nasty melee damage, so staying back - always or just when he is enraged? - is better. Is that right?

Also, one possibility for me is using my Holy spec in PVP gear (which is not bad, furious + wrathful/relentless offpieces). I would go from around 60k hp to 38k hp, but I would be able to use a 40 yard judgement and a 5 sec cool down 30 yard Holy shock. What do people think? I tried it on our last attempt before respawns but got two shotted right at the beginning, by a 15k hit from Kelseth and 28k hit from Valanar.

Next Saturday, I am inclined to try it in tanking gear at first but switch to holy if I fail too much at picking up the purple balls. Ideally, I'd like to wear tank gear (for hps) with holy spec (for ranged tools) but I think that would leave me starved of mana (no salv, constant dp or spiritual attunement, nor a decent mana pool).

Thanks for any advice!
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Talaii » Tue May 25, 2010 5:54 am

econ21 wrote:Keleseth Keleseth Keleseth


I've never actually tanked him on the paladin, not sure how hard the pickups would be. In tank gear, you can actually live with 2-3 orbs easily enough, though obviously you want as many as possible.

Keleseth no longer melees at all, so just go up and whack him to get some threat between orb spawns. You're probably going to struggle for aggro on him in holy gear/spec, so I'd just stay prot. Just make sure you save all your ranged moves (HoReck if it works, exorcism/judgement/shieldtoss) to pick up orbs and you should be fine. Oh, and try and use a cooldown as he empowers, to give the healers time to adjust to the transition (doubly important if you're way off in the middle of nowhere).

Honestly, I've done the fight as both Keleseth tank (on my DK), and tanking both of the others. If the Keleseth tank is fairly good about keeping a big pile of orbs on him, the other tank takes a lot more damage, and his incoming damage is very spiky. Make sure the warrior is very proactive about watching his health and using cooldowns, especially during Empowered Shock Vortexes; since he can take a lot of burst very suddenly if he has a bad run with avoidance.
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Belloc » Tue May 25, 2010 1:03 pm

No melee from Keleseth. Use exorcism and avenger's shield to pick up loose dark nuclei. If they're on CD, run in and use judgement. If someone damages them, they take control of them -- damage it back. Do not stand within cleave/aoe range of your melee, or else you will lose your nuclei.

For threat purposes, use hammer of wrath on Keleseth, since he'll be at 1% for most of the fight.

But, in all honesty, this fight shouldn't be difficult for you. Start it by running up, blowing wings, and putting as much threat as you can into Keleseth. When the wings are gone, go pick up the first and second Dark Nuclei. Throw a hammer of wrath at Keleseth and go pick up the 3rd Nucleus. Keep picking up every Dark Nucleus that spawns and your healers will barely have to worry about you. You should have plenty of threat at this point and, if not, your dps don't even have to touch Keleseth if your threat is an issue.

Just make sure you don't run into a vortex and get flung out of healer range. Also, don't lead Empowered Conjured Fires to other players... that is a bad move.
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Mert » Tue Jun 01, 2010 5:28 am

Getting a Holy (or Ret, if spec'd for it) to Shadow Aura Mastery through Keleseth's empowerment can help in the early stages when you don't have so many orbs up as it's basically the as having a bunch of additional orbs on you for six seconds. This can be especially useful if Keleseth is the first to get empowered after the health switch as it'll mean there's generally fewer potential orbs on his tank.

Aura Mastery is often one of the most undervalued and easily overlooked raid cooldowns but it's increadibly useful in so many places in ICC, especially if your Rets spec into it as well. Plus Crusader Aura Mastery is the best thing ever :D
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby NeoArmada » Sun Jun 20, 2010 3:30 pm

Araiken wrote:Since I didn't see a thread started on this boss I though I would take the honor of posting it.

My guild is currently working on this right now, but does anyone have tips for the ranged tank on holding aggro on the dark nuclei. We have a lock doing it but he is having trouble having all three on him.

Feel free to post all other info/questions concerning Blood Prince Council here too.


To comment on the first post:

You dont necesarrily have to have a ranged tank hold agro on Kel. In my group I tank him (pally tank) and it works out fine. The only thing for holding the dark nuclei that I have found is to damage them in some way, taunting also works if they are not on someone else. The only thing that you really have to be careful of if you do this with a normal tank is to watch the AoE. A few times we have wiped because the AoE killed the nuclei that I had on me and then I got one shoted by empowered Shadow Lance. As long as you hold off on AoE when it switches to Kel, then it is perfectly fine and easy to do and allows you to have one extra dps on the other bosses. We has the main tank hold the other two guys by himself. This fight is really just about Raid awareness to look for the switchs and abilities that they cast.

Good Luck!
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Petrus » Sat Jul 24, 2010 12:05 am

I have to say that while it is MUCH easier tanking Keleseth with a ranged class (I've now done it on both 10 and 25 with my mage), good timing and awareness of the orbs can make it easy for us to do it as well. Smart Avenger's Shield use can reallly really help when you have to pick up a stray orb or two to get your shadow resist stack back up.
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby NeoArmada » Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:22 pm

Yeah I think the extra dps helps a lot and since my off-spec is Holy PVP and our other tank can hold both of the other guys I am pretty much useless unless I am tanking Keseth lol. I have done it quite a few times now and as long as you have at least 3 orbs (I recomend more for some breathing rooms) and have a Pally healer then you can rotate Aura Mastery with Shadow Resistance and usually he only gets empowered once and will either die before or die during his second empowerment.

Thanks.
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Re: [25/10] Blood Prince Council

Postby Dianora » Thu Jul 29, 2010 2:17 pm

Remember, Hand of Reckoning does damage, and the purple orb sticks to the last thing that damages them. So you have 4 different spells to try to get them. Exorcism, Hand of Reckoning, Avenger's Shield and Judgement. Use them.
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