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Itching to try a 0/40/21 Threat spec.

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Moderators: Fridmarr, Worldie, Aergis, lythac

Postby Worldie » Wed Jun 04, 2008 11:00 am

steadypal wrote:i would like to see how worldie would react to pulling stuff in kara/za and in heroics?

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=23737
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby Caelus » Wed Jun 04, 2008 11:02 am

Worldie wrote:
steadypal wrote:i would like to see how worldie would react to pulling stuff in kara/za and in heroics?

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=23737


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Postby steadypal » Wed Jun 04, 2008 11:08 am

Worldie wrote:
steadypal wrote:i would like to see how worldie would react to pulling stuff in kara/za and in heroics?

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=23737



so you go into the heroics/10mans with quite a few stacks of those eh?
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Postby Worldie » Wed Jun 04, 2008 11:46 am

I got 30-40 since i use em on Felmyst, but on heroics i usually just bodypull.

If that's 3 packs, BETTER.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby steadypal » Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:22 pm

Worldie wrote:I got 30-40 since i use em on Felmyst, but on heroics i usually just bodypull.

If that's 3 packs, BETTER.



okay so if i can do without frisbee throw, should i worry about healers not keeping me up w/o ardent defender? LOL im so wanting to try out this spec, but i dont want to cause wipes if i go down :P
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Postby Worldie » Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:39 pm

Well, as i said somewhere else, that's a "overgeared tank" spec.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby steadypal » Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:57 pm

Worldie wrote:Well, as i said somewhere else, that's a "overgeared tank" spec.


im decently geared.... just healers fall asleep at times LOL
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Postby Tzuma » Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:49 pm

steadypal wrote:
Worldie wrote:Well, as i said somewhere else, that's a "overgeared tank" spec.


im decently geared.... just healers fall asleep at times LOL
Id say your current stats wouldnt make you "overgeared" for kara, perhaps "well geared".

Since your main concern is trash, I dont see why you cant keep the "normal" spec, and swap out some SD gear. You could try and squeeze out more threat from your group makeup too (shaman, etc).
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Postby shifttusk » Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:12 pm

Oh
My
God

Ok so I took your spec almost identicaly, I right now took kings since I run alot of 10 man content as the only pally. What I found though was that for heroics I kinda want shield spec but don't see the need VS bosses. Do you do any AOE tanking anymore?

PS, doing 650+dps in heroics and upwards of 950TPS easily with 390SD is AWESOME!
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Postby Snake-Aes » Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:14 pm

I Still aoe tank without shield spec(I do'nt spec for sanctity yet tho. <3 me my AD), so far it's been no biggie for me. I lost maybe 70 block value from the spec.
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Postby Worldie » Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:31 pm

shifttusk wrote:Oh
My
God

Ok so I took your spec almost identicaly, I right now took kings since I run alot of 10 man content as the only pally. What I found though was that for heroics I kinda want shield spec but don't see the need VS bosses. Do you do any AOE tanking anymore?

PS, doing 650+dps in heroics and upwards of 950TPS easily with 390SD is AWESOME!

I still aoetank like before.

My gear has like, 200 block value anyway, so /care of shield spec.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby Talmus » Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:44 pm

I went with this spec as a fun thing to do until I move up in progression from Kara. I never had spell warding (was 0/47/14 with 1 in imp. judgements and 3 in PoJ) so to get to 0/40/21 I dropped Kings, AD, and AS. For that I added Imp. JotC, Crusade, and Sanc. Aura. I'm not as geared in the spell damage department as a lot of people here...I can hit the high 400's unbuffed in sub-optimal tanking gear (which is nice for older content...you actually take some damage). I'll say I've seen a BIG difference in TPS and damage output. I'd highly recommend it any time you're going to be outgearing content for awhile. AD just isn't that important if you've got something on farm and Kings is nice but non-critical in 5-mans and someone else will usually have it in a raid. Yes, Avenger's Shield is definitely missed but especially if you do a lot of stuff with undead/demons (ie you're spec'ing this for Kara raids) you'll live without it and enjoy a lot more damage output.
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Postby shifttusk » Mon Jun 16, 2008 1:44 pm

Worldie wrote:
shifttusk wrote:Oh
My
God

Ok so I took your spec almost identicaly, I right now took kings since I run alot of 10 man content as the only pally. What I found though was that for heroics I kinda want shield spec but don't see the need VS bosses. Do you do any AOE tanking anymore?

PS, doing 650+dps in heroics and upwards of 950TPS easily with 390SD is AWESOME!

I still aoetank like before.

My gear has like, 200 block value anyway, so /care of shield spec.


So basicaly I should tell my shaman buddy to stop qqing about my extra 50dps taken in heroics while aoe tanking. Likewise I sit at a very low BV just because I tend to be an avoidance > useless BV person. Basicaly grabbing that back would let me fill reckoning back in some which would be nice. I Do think I'm still going to go only 2/5 reckoning instead of 3/5 like you and grab the extra point as BoK for my 1 pally Kara and ZA runnings.

I went with this spec as a fun thing to do until I move up in progression from Kara. I never had spell warding (was 0/47/14 with 1 in imp. judgements and 3 in PoJ) so to get to 0/40/21 I dropped Kings, AD, and AS. For that I added Imp. JotC, Crusade, and Sanc. Aura. I'm not as geared in the spell damage department as a lot of people here...I can hit the high 400's unbuffed in sub-optimal tanking gear (which is nice for older content...you actually take some damage). I'll say I've seen a BIG difference in TPS and damage output. I'd highly recommend it any time you're going to be outgearing content for awhile. AD just isn't that important if you've got something on farm and Kings is nice but non-critical in 5-mans and someone else will usually have it in a raid. Yes, Avenger's Shield is definitely missed but especially if you do a lot of stuff with undead/demons (ie you're spec'ing this for Kara raids) you'll live without it and enjoy a lot more damage output.


Exactly why I am doing it, my pally is an alt and runs alt friendly stuff like Kara/ZA/GL/ML where my issue really isn't getting gibbed down (14,997 unbuffed hp uncrush uncrit blah blah) but rather holding threat on the mains that come. I was thinking that dropping avengers would be the suck but really I barely use it. I use mana tap or exorcism on 95% of pulls and if in the rare case that it doesnt work I use ezthrow dynamite or body pull.
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Postby Harlequinn » Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:52 am

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=sZVbxIx0zRgoxxfx0hMz

This is the spec I've been using for months now. It maximizes threat and gets rid of the excess bullshit. Imp BoM can be swapped with Benediction if you are worried about mana, but that should never be a real issue. Shield throw is awesome for heroics and 10 man content, but I never had much use for it in 25 man stuff. My guild like most other guilds uses multiple tanks to clear trash so there was never a HUGE need to have me tanking 3 or 4 elite mobs when we have the extra tanks available.

Before they changed AD it was really useful, but 35% hp only is a 30% reduction is bullshit. Unless you have 25k + health I don't see it being too useful. If you stack health like that too you would be sacrificing a lot of your threat producing abilities too. It's a toss up really... Sanctity aura makes it easier to pump out threat with less overall spell dmg, at the same time if you have more spell dmg it allows you to do some crazy damage. With the added threat you have a lot more control in tight aoe situations, and makes farm content go so much faster.

If you haven't tried a 0/40/21 spec yet you don't know what you are missing out on...
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Postby Talmus » Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:04 am

Just an update...I spec'd out of this. Up until Monday's Kara raid I'd had the same 3 healers and AD never even triggered on Prince. Monday our regular paladin healer got stuck at work and we had to PuG a healer. They were a well geared druid but they must not have had it going on because I died 3 times before we gave up. Didn't eat a single crushing blow, had nearly 16k hp buffed (no warlock or it would have been more) and nearly 16k armor...uncrushable/uncrittable and over 300 block value. The healers just couldn't keep me alive and I *think* AD would have saved the fight the first time through (or at least it would have given me one more hit's worth of time for the LoH that I was mid-click on to take effect).

Moral of the story - 0/40/21 is a great spec...you'll make it so that even the best equipped guys in your raid can let loose a lot more. You just better have good healers because you're working without a safety net. And it doesn't matter how many hp's you have...Prince can burn you down fast if the healers fall asleep at the wheel.
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