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MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:37 am
by Schroom
Ok, maybe I'm just blind :) but I couldn't find anything on this. as we don't have our Glyph of seal of turth that gives us 10 Exp. I was wondering if Insight might be worth using again.

is the HoT any good or still just noise? is the bonus on the heal good enough to use for that big WoG?

I still suspect that SoT wins overall as more damage is always good, and healing yourself back up to 80 % instead of in example, 88%, does not really matter for your healers.

still maybe I'm wrong and SoI is the one to use from now on?

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:55 am
by daishan
SoT will be our default seal SoR for aoe (3 or more targets) SoI may be useful on very high damage fights if your healers are going oom.
Personally I doubt we'll be using SoI very often, as we'll be doing more dps as tanks now switching will cost the raid more dps than it did in the past.
http://i.wow.joystiq.com/2012/08/09/mis ... -paladins/ is a good basic guid.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:05 am
by Schroom
so, yeah in fact you just confirmed my suspicion :) perfect ^^

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:21 am
by daishan
I've not seen any solid numbers yet, so don't take it as fact :p
I'm guessing Theck will let us know just how much healing we get at the cost of how much dps, when he gets through the small mountain of data he has.
Might also depend on raid size, I can imagine I'll be more willing to switch to SoI in my 10 man than a 25 tank, as there will be only 2/3 healers so less random aoe heals for SoI to get lost in.
Will have to give it a try at the weekend when I've finished breaking my ui.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:55 am
by theckhd
SoI is about 16k HPS at 100k vengeance (~9k at 50k Veng), at a cost of around 3700 DPS (2500 @ 50k Veng).

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:11 am
by daishan
Thanks for the numbers.
16k HPS that's a lot more than I was thinking it would be, is that including bonus healing to WoG or just the SoI ticks?
If I remember right from the streams I watched healers where pushing 60K-100K HPS, even with a high overheal % from SoI it's looking like I might put SoI back on my keybinds.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:28 pm
by theckhd
That's just the SoI ticks. Remember that it's 15% of (SP+AP), and we have ~140k AP and ~70k SP with 100k Vengeance. So each melee heals us for ~31k.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 1:14 am
by Schroom
woooah that is A LOT more than i suspected. so I guess at least for now, SOI IS BACK! (damn expendables 2 in my head :lol: )


mh just thinking about it, does the healing modifier from SOI have any effekt on SS?

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 6:13 am
by theckhd
theckhd wrote:SoI is about 16k HPS at 100k vengeance (~9k at 50k Veng), at a cost of around 3700 DPS (2500 @ 50k Veng).

Correction: there was a bug in the code that was errantly applying Censure with SoI. Fixing that increased the stakes quite a bit - it's now a ~17k DPS loss for ~16k HPS @ 100k Veng

Schroom wrote:mh just thinking about it, does the healing modifier from SOI have any effekt on SS?

No, it doesn't. In fact, about the only thing it affects is WoG. It didn't even work on EF or any of the L90 talents when we tested them in the last few beta builds.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 11:57 pm
by Schroom
it's now a ~17k DPS loss for ~16k HPS @ 100k Veng


ok that so closer to the relation I suspected it to be. So it really depends on setup and boss mechanics if SoI is worthwhile. Also if 10 or 25 man makes a difference.

although I had some fun checking my logs from yesterday from the Ultraxion encounter, I used SoI the whole evening to check the numbers for myself.

I'm speaking of healing received, and we only use 1 healer for this encounter so it's easier to compare

SS was on place 1 with 27.4% and 35 ticks with an average of 12766.8, absorbing a total of 447189 damage.
SOI on place 2, 21.7% 93 ticks and 3808 avg
places 3 was my 2piece bonus and place 4 the lifeleech from Souldrinker HM, not a single WoG needed, making a total of 64.4% of my healing received, coming from myself.

66.4% of SOI went into overheal

only on No5 we see the first spell of your holy priest.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 3:59 am
by Nooska
That sounds stupidly overpowered - but I'll chalk it up to being balanced for levle 90, not 85.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 4:10 am
by daishan
Don't forget that's on Ultra and tanks often take less damage than the dps with our high cd uptime, and as you say no doubt 85 balance or lack of isn't helping.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 5:03 am
by Schroom
it's not really overpowered comparing to blood DKs IMHO

In LFR yesterday there was a blood DK who healed 5.6 Mio on spine.... but that is the new crazy vengeance that is OP.

PS: by the way I think I should tank bloods next time I get to spine.... 115k burst DPS on a tendon from a pallytank... (even though it seems to be normal mode) http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/av9k ... target=124

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 3:44 pm
by Phonic
So i haven't been keeping up lately... what will our health pools be up to when MOP drops and we hit 90?

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 5:12 pm
by Treck
fresh 90, like 400-450k i guess.
Fully geared, +550k

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 6:16 pm
by jere
In beta, in mostly 450 crafted gear, I am at 370k HP unbuffed if that helps.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 11:21 pm
by xstratax
In the 483 PvP Gear, Mastery Trinkets, no MoP JC Gems I have about 435k as Prot when alone. Heroic geared stacking Stam, I can see 550k Raid buffed being the norm.

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 3:29 pm
by Schroom
that moment when you killed stoneguard, you check your logs and reallize you did more HPS then DPS as a tank...

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2012 1:18 pm
by Nooska
And how was your dps compared to the, you know, dps'ers - likewise hps compared to actual healers?

*considers a 10 man prot paladin raid, SoI+GoBH*

Re: MoP what seal? SOI or SOT?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 2:35 pm
by Schroom
I raid 25 man.

our best healer did: 47k HPS
I did 32k HPS wihtout the battlehealer glyph.

our best dps was a cleving rogue with 70k

DK Tank did: 39 k
Warrior Tank did: 32k
I did: 30 k DPS

(Our Dk tank did 36k HPS by the way -.-)