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Divinity

Postby Iboughtpower » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:09 am

Okay, so often I'm finding Off tanks I'm running with are putting 3-5 points into Divinity. I'm just wondering if something has changed and this has become viable? I always assumed it was something you should never waste talent points on. I'm wondering whether or not I should say something to these tanks I'm seeing with divinity or maybe check to see if there is a reason behind getting it now.
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Re: Divinity

Postby KysenMurrin » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:23 am

Nothing has changed - it's still a pretty poor investment for the points spent. You often see tanks that don't look into the theorycraft behind this stuff speccing into it, though.
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Re: Divinity

Postby Khayne » Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:18 am

If you dont want reckoning or DG, there isn't really better slots to use the 3 floaters at. If they got all of those, then it's debatable.
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Re: Divinity

Postby Malthrax » Fri Jan 22, 2010 2:27 pm

Nothing has changed - it's still a pretty poor investment for the points spent. You often see tanks that don't look into the theorycraft behind this stuff speccing into it, though.

Here's the thing: You MUST spend a total of 30 points on talents in tiers 1 through 5, before you can unlock tier-6 talents. The "cookie-cutter" prot build leaves you with 3 floaters that you have to spend somewhere before you can take any talents past Blessing of Sanctuary.

You can put 'em in Divinity, in Reckoning, in Imp HoJ, or in DS/DG, or some combination of those... but you MUST spend them SOMEWHERE.

If someone has 3pts in Divinity, I wouldn't question it. Five points? yeah, something's being misunderstood.
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Re: Divinity

Postby Levantine » Sat Jan 23, 2010 3:02 pm

Really? I'd sure as hell question the tank. Those floating points should either be in DS/DG if they're tanking anything serious or in Reckoning if they aren't and the threat can be put to better use. Divinity is just flat out bad at this point in the game.
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Re: Divinity

Postby Barathorn » Mon Jan 25, 2010 5:01 am

Levantine wrote:Really? I'd sure as hell question the tank. Those floating points should either be in DS/DG if they're tanking anything serious or in Reckoning if they aren't and the threat can be put to better use. Divinity is just flat out bad at this point in the game.


I have to agree to with Levantine, I personally cannot see any reason from current content why divinity should ever be considered as a viable choice for Paladin tanking other than to serve as a warning in advance if the person understands their class or not. This has never failed me as a check so far.

It is DS/DG or reckoning pretty much every single time as far as I am concerned and while we all play the game differently [take for example myself compared to say Wrathy or Meloree]some talents serve as nothing more than an indicator to the level of understanding the player has. Divinty is one of them.

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Re: Divinity

Postby Njall » Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:12 am

Levantine wrote:Really? I'd sure as hell question the tank. Those floating points should either be in DS/DG if they're tanking anything serious or in Reckoning if they aren't and the threat can be put to better use. Divinity is just flat out bad at this point in the game.


I was finding Improved HoJ was useful if only for the interrupt during things like Faction Champions and so forth. I just never remember to use my raid-wall effectively but I'm only a middling to fair tank.
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Re: Divinity

Postby Khayne » Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:16 pm

I'm planning on dropping my 3/3 crusade and 1/5 conviction for testing 4/5 divinity next week. I do agree nowadays that if you just use 3 floaters it should propably be DG which i run myself too due to the obscene amounts of aoe damage in ICC not to mention that a free -20% personal cd never hurts(i did run imp. hoj back in ulduar as half of bosses had stunnable adds but no such luck now).

Threat is non-issue to me these days and if we go all out, biggest thing that decides do i or our best warrior hold threat, is who the rogues decide to pop their TotT's on (actually on last rotface i pulled threat standing 30 yards away from boss while waiting for slimes because 3 rogues all forgot their TotT's on me at pull).

it's merely a question of:
200-300 dps vs. fail-weaksauce-healing-increase, i'm willing to test the waters on the healing part abit..
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Re: Divinity

Postby Awyndel » Mon Mar 01, 2010 8:02 am

Well I think the +healing is a lot better in icc then before, but I just don't see myself giving up crusade or DG for it atm. On last word it doesn't cost you dps though, it actually gives you some more.
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Re: Divinity

Postby Arjuna » Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:09 am

I've seen some far progressed pallytanks use divinity, most notably from Paragon and Ensidia...do they know something we don't?

(although, the Ensidia pallytanks doesn't have imp devotion aura in their specs so I'm not sure I follow their logic...)
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Re: Divinity

Postby Fridmarr » Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:15 am

Arjuna wrote:I've seen some far progressed pallytanks use divinity, most notably from Paragon and Ensidia...do they know something we don't?

(although, the Ensidia pallytanks doesn't have imp devotion aura in their specs so I'm not sure I follow their logic...)

Maybe one of their holy pallys brings it? It does seem a little odd to skip Imp devo and grab divinity.


EDIT: Though I forget the amount of armor Imp Devo provides off the top of my head, it's also possible that it is fairly insignificant with our current armor levels.
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Re: Divinity

Postby theckhd » Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:33 am

Fridmarr wrote:
Arjuna wrote:I've seen some far progressed pallytanks use divinity, most notably from Paragon and Ensidia...do they know something we don't?

(although, the Ensidia pallytanks doesn't have imp devotion aura in their specs so I'm not sure I follow their logic...)

Maybe one of their holy pallys brings it? It does seem a little odd to skip Imp devo and grab divinity.


EDIT: Though I forget the amount of armor Imp Devo provides off the top of my head, it's also possible that it is fairly insignificant with our current armor levels.

My guess would be that they have a shaman dropping stoneskin totem, as I don't believe the two stack with one another. A resto druid in the raid covers the healing buff as well.

Taking a look at Lazeil (from Paragon), he's gone with a full survivability build, probably mostly for LK and hard-mode progression. He's given up a chunk of threat from Crusade and even Touched by the Light to pick up Divinity. That makes sense, since Crusade and TbtL are the only two places he can pull points from that are solely threat talents. Divine Strength would be a slightly smaller threat loss, but would also reduce his BV.

His off-spec just trades 2/3 TbtL for 1/3 TbtL and 1/2 Imp HoJ, which is a LK-specific spec allowing him to perform the first stun every Valkyr.

Note that he has Imp. Devotion as well, though if he had a tree and an extra shaman for Stoneskin he could have traded that for Divinity instead. Chances are he has a tree, but they might not be running with enough shamans to make Stoneskin a logical choice.
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Re: Divinity

Postby Arjuna » Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:44 am

But the totem isn't as much armor, is it?

its about 1300 vs 1800 afaik fully talented in both cases...
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Re: Divinity

Postby theckhd » Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:48 pm

Arjuna wrote:But the totem isn't as much armor, is it?

its about 1300 vs 1800 afaik fully talented in both cases...

I honestly don't know. I thought they were identical when fully talented, but I could be wrong.
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Re: Divinity

Postby Argali » Mon Mar 01, 2010 1:59 pm

I still believe that stoneskin and devo still stack, one of the rare cases that buffs that are functionally the same still stacking. Pretty easy to test though.
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