Playing Catchup!

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Playing Catchup!

Postby Saeverud » Tue Jul 21, 2009 9:41 pm

I've been following the tankadin news closely, but I only vaguely am aware of the theory crafting and information behind the scenes. So I figured it's by time to catch up, as well as get a few questions answered. Also not being lazy, I know a lot of different people here have these same questions, so it's nice to have them in once place.

First up is the hand of Reckoning change! It's basically like Hand of Reckoning is having exorcism added to it? As I have 4-5k attack power depending on gear and raid buffed. So it's like 2k holy damage + taunt effect?

With the SHoR nerf, is threat evened out with the buff to Seal of Vengeance? And Seal of Vengeance is still the main tanking seal is it not? I've spent the last week testing threat/dps from both Seal of Vengeance and Seal of Righteousness. With Seals of the Pure and Two Piece t8 set bonus, Vengeance does a bit more threat than Righteousness(About 130 tps more), however Righteousness does a bit more damage. (SoV=182 per 1.6 seconds/610 per judge on average. SoR= 210 per 1.6 seconds/730 per judge on average.)

And as far as I'm aware the damage formula for the seals haven't changed, so the above should stay the same, but SoV is getting a 33% weapon damage added to it as well, which should make it the clear winner. As based on my wowlogs on average my swing does 650 rounded down, which means 33% of that is 195 damage which scales a bit with haste and certain buffs.

Right now I'm using Blade Ward, but what is the recommended weapon enchant? I don't see many of them really being too useful. The extra parry is nice, and it's alittle bit more threat, but it's hardly noticeable. The Blood one heals at most 2k damage when you fall below 35% so it's not very useful either is it? Would that mean Mongoose or Potency or the Titanium Weapon chain being the preferred ones still?

How much avoidance are we looking to lose during this coming patch? We lose quite a bit of dodge, but we gain some of it back from the increase from Parry Rating. Also, how much block will be normal? Right now I'm at about 1400 completely unbuffed, when the patch comes I'll be at about 1500 unbuffed with only the earthshaker ring from XT having blocked on it. Though my block set I can reach up to 1900 unbuffed, which will be probably 2500+ come patch.

Now with stat issues asked, what about talents? I've looked them over, and made this spec based on my personal preferences. I know reckoning has been pretty much been useless up until now, because it does nothing for SoV, but now that SoV does damage after 5 stacks are up, this would effectively double that damage every so often. (Unsure the percentage of reckonings uptime) Right now I'm running the 0/53/18 with three points in crusade. If there's a spec that's clear and cut better, I'd appreciate being let known.

And last but not least is a personal issue. I'm being told by a Resto Druid in my raid, that I'm much harder to heal than our warrior tank. I've been finding this hard to believe as I out gear him a bit, as well as having much more avoidance, block value, and health. I keep a tight 969696 rotation, and always have holy shield, divine plea and sacred shield up(if there's no holy pally) so I should have waaay more mitigation than him as well as more health/EH.

So I'm curious if I'm gearing wrong, or lacking some where? Or is there any other reason for this? Or is she just imaging things? Ignis is a big one for her apparently. I take a ton more damage than the warrior tank. I thought it was because of the shield reflect, but he says he doesn't reflect anything in that fight.

Thank you all in advance for the information! I know it was alot to read and answer, so I appreciate it!
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Re: Playing Catchup!

Postby Jedah » Wed Jul 22, 2009 4:22 am

Saeverud wrote:I've been following the tankadin news closely, but I only vaguely am aware of the theory crafting and information behind the scenes. So I figured it's by time to catch up, as well as get a few questions answered. Also not being lazy, I know a lot of different people here have these same questions, so it's nice to have them in once place.

First up is the hand of Reckoning change! It's basically like Hand of Reckoning is having exorcism added to it? As I have 4-5k attack power depending on gear and raid buffed. So it's like 2k holy damage + taunt effect?


yes, but only if the mob isn't attacking you already, which makes it slightly less desirable than the way exorcism works in 3.1.

Saeverud wrote:With the SHoR nerf, is threat evened out with the buff to Seal of Vengeance? And Seal of Vengeance is still the main tanking seal is it not? I've spent the last week testing threat/dps from both Seal of Vengeance and Seal of Righteousness. With Seals of the Pure and Two Piece t8 set bonus, Vengeance does a bit more threat than Righteousness(About 130 tps more), however Righteousness does a bit more damage. (SoV=182 per 1.6 seconds/610 per judge on average. SoR= 210 per 1.6 seconds/730 per judge on average.)


Theck has math'd it out in the Advanced Training section, and SoV is still well ahead of SoR

Saeverud wrote:Right now I'm using Blade Ward, but what is the recommended weapon enchant? I don't see many of them really being too useful. The extra parry is nice, and it's alittle bit more threat, but it's hardly noticeable. The Blood one heals at most 2k damage when you fall below 35% so it's not very useful either is it? Would that mean Mongoose or Potency or the Titanium Weapon chain being the preferred ones still?


from my understanding, agility on weapon is currently superior, but with the changes to the value of parry rating in 3.2, I believe Blade Ward pulls ahead. (someone double check me on this one)

Saeverud wrote:Now with stat issues asked, what about talents? I've looked them over, and made this spec based on my personal preferences. I know reckoning has been pretty much been useless up until now, because it does nothing for SoV, but now that SoV does damage after 5 stacks are up, this would effectively double that damage every so often. (Unsure the percentage of reckonings uptime) Right now I'm running the 0/53/18 with three points in crusade. If there's a spec that's clear and cut better, I'd appreciate being let known.


I can't look at your spec (I'm at work) but the latest discussion about Reckoning is that it is still not worth it, and you should keep the points in crusade.



Saeverud wrote:And last but not least is a personal issue. I'm being told by a Resto Druid in my raid, that I'm much harder to heal than our warrior tank. I've been finding this hard to believe as I out gear him a bit, as well as having much more avoidance, block value, and health. I keep a tight 969696 rotation, and always have holy shield, divine plea and sacred shield up(if there's no holy pally) so I should have waaay more mitigation than him as well as more health/EH.


Due to current shield block mechanics, warriors take spikier damage than paladins, so inherently, they should be harder to heal compared to an equally geared paladin. Although, I can't look at your gear so that's all I can really tell you.


Edit: Sorry my response isn't perfect in so much that I can't cover every aspect of every question you had, but it seems like you were looking for some quick advice, so I did my best given the circumstances :)
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Re: Playing Catchup!

Postby Panzerdin » Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:04 am

Blade Ward blows, Blood Draining or Mongoose for survivability and potency for threat,
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Re: Playing Catchup!

Postby amh » Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:08 am

Accuracy unless hit-capped for threat.

/o/
I used to play a paladin.
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Re: Playing Catchup!

Postby Khayne » Wed Jul 22, 2009 6:55 am

You might take more damage if the warrior uses his trinkets and/or cd's more while you might be keeping them for "if shit hits the fan", and/or no one keeps demo shout effect for you.

Overall if boss has same debuffs and you got same buffs, and trinket cd's are saved for bad stuff (more adds pile up or something, healer bites it). You should take less damage all things equal.
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