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Divinity after 2 nights in Ulduar

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Re: Divinity after 2 nights in Ulduar

Postby Ancalimë » Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:19 pm

So, bump here with a bit of a dilemma.

My 25-man is raiding in Ulduar tonight, and we're going to attempt IC hardmode with Steelbreaker up. We've done it with Runemaster Molgeim, but tonight is Steelbreaker. I'm on the big ugly bastard because a)I can cleanse myself so the healers don't have to burn a GCD and b) I've managed to become the highest health tank with a respectable amount of avoidance.

First or second attempt, I don't recall, I get killed kiting Steelbreaker out of a Rune of Power, which pretty much means the heals just didn't land when they needed to, right? Raidleader (an extremely competent Holy pally) is lookin' for what went wrong and incredulously asks me why I don't have Divinity. I tried to explain that the 5% wasn't as good as it sounded (unsuccessfully, as he simply said, "Its...more...healing...), especially as it would cost me DS/DG and Crusade. A portal is opened to Ironforge so I can respec. I don't die while kiting Steelbreaker, but, you know what? I didn't die while kiting him last week when we tried this, either.

I can understand respec'ing for a hardmode fight, but, I don't run with 2 tank specs and it isn't like the raid stopped after IC for me to go back and pick up my preferred talents. I just don't see Divinity as worth it compared to DS/DG and Crusade...sure, I don't have any threat issues and sure my own shield isn't going to stop a lot, but...can anyone make a case for Divinity here? I'm just not seeing it/am kind of mad. Talking about it in guild afterwards, the healers are all like, "What's the problem, that's great" while our DK tank understood it is a situational thing that might stop a 400 damage overkill, or do nothing on a 12k overkill. I'm pretty sure I'm correct here, but I'd like to have some more ammunition before arguing with the RL about it. Any help would be much appreciated.
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Re: Divinity after 2 nights in Ulduar

Postby Palthazora » Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:37 pm

Your GL is obtuse and you should have directed him to read facts on places like this and tankspot.com.

Divinity will not help or save a raid like the threat from Crusade or the movement from PoJ (think steelbreaker movements, hodir moves, Vezax, Ignis adds, etc etc).
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Re: Divinity after 2 nights in Ulduar

Postby Kenedy » Thu Jul 23, 2009 1:51 pm

Ancal, that is a perfect example why the Divinity argument isn't over. Your RL is "right" Divinity very well could have saved you there and as a Main Tank I would advocate at least a point or even all of them in there. The argument against it is that that 5% is just so minor. That Holy Pally may heal you for 10k heals all the time and with 5 in Divinity that's really only 10.5k. However, if you look at it from a healer standpoint, very few Holy Pallies (not totally true with the way Pallies generally stick to Holy Lights and high intellect) will spec without Divinity and it only increases their healing. It's not like you are increasing the healing from 1 healer, you are increasing all healing on you, if that is 3 healers thats increasing each of those 3 healers by 5% and that is a huge buff. If a priest had a talent that increased healing from 3 healers by 5% they would take it in a second.
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Re: Divinity after 2 nights in Ulduar

Postby Braundo » Thu Jul 23, 2009 2:13 pm

Kenedy wrote:If a priest had a talent that increased healing from 3 healers by 5% they would take it in a second.

The analogy would be more accurate as "a priest talent that increased healing from 3 healers on a single target by 5%.
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Re: Divinity after 2 nights in Ulduar

Postby Kenedy » Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:27 pm

Braundo wrote:
Kenedy wrote:If a priest had a talent that increased healing from 3 healers by 5% they would take it in a second.

The analogy would be more accurate as "a priest talent that increased healing from 3 healers on a single target by 5%.



Lol yes thank you Mr. Nit Pickerson.
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Re: Divinity after 2 nights in Ulduar

Postby Braundo » Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:31 pm

Call it nitpicking if you want, but the difference between a talent that "increases all healing done by 5%" and "increases all healing done by 5% as long as you're healing a certain person" is approximately 25x.
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Re: Divinity after 2 nights in Ulduar

Postby Noradin » Sat Jul 25, 2009 7:33 am

This is no threat and no utility talent. If we take it as tanks we take it as survival talent and thus should rate it by its usefullness to decrease our chance to die.

We die if a boss hits us for more than our current health.
If the hit is for more than our max health there is no way a healing talent would save us if not by increasing a DA proc (disc priest healer).
If the hit is for more than our current health but less than max health it might save us if it helps healers to get us back to full health after the last hit befor this one lands. For big heals it wont help much most of the time since those tend to be far in between and tend to produce situations where the tank dies just as the next heal is about to hit. For small frequent heals like hots it is far more usefull as it increases the time we spend at full health.

Divinity is strong if you are healed by druids (increases time spent at full health), usefull when healed by disc priests (fast heals and DA procs) and wont help you if you are healed by holy priests or holy paladins most of the time.
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