Advice on starting your own Guild

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Advice on starting your own Guild

Postby honorshammer » Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:43 am

I'd like to hear from people who started their own guilds.

What went right, what went wrong, what would you do differently if you had it to do over again.

Where'd you get a website, where do you get your vent?
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Postby Vanifae » Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:56 am

I didn't start my guild, but I am the raid leader. I purchased the vent from www.maximumvoice.com; I enjoy running the show, I try to be fair, keep things moving and keep people informed. it can be a little draining at times, but you have to foster a good atmosphere first and foremost.

Once the guild members trust you, and see that you have their best interests in mind when it comes to raids and handing out loot, it gets easier. there will be drama but best to tackle it on quickly, before it gets out of hand.

Your officer's need to be on the same page. I can't stress that enough.
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Re: Advice on starting your own Guild

Postby Baelor » Wed Aug 01, 2007 10:51 am

Honorshammer wrote:I'd like to hear from people who started their own guilds.

What went right, what went wrong, what would you do differently if you had it to do over again.

Where'd you get a website, where do you get your vent?

This is technically the 2nd guild I've started in my time playing WoW on Runetotem. I won't go into the situation with the first one, as it is a long story stretching over several months and needs a lot of backstory.

I started <Adaptation> in March of this year after the collapse of my last raiding guild, <Prophecy>, due to the leadership bailing to join a hardcore guild and jump from Karazhan to Gruul's/SSC immediately. I was not fond of many of the other raiding guilds on my server when this happened, so I said "I've led guilds before... if I played my cards right, I can make it work. Why not me? I'm starting a guild."

There were several things I didn't like about <Prophecy> that I set out to change in my own guild. First, the loot distribution. All previous guilds were operating on a DKP policy, most recently Prophecy using a zero-sum system. I scrapped it entirely, as DKP tended to reward only the hardcore and leave the semi-serious in outdated gear. It also bred resentment, as there would be an elite group of raiders who were at every raid and had all the gear, and then the rest felt like the filler. Also, that top group would be pushing for more content faster, as they got what they needed out of, say, Karazhan, and wanted to move on to Gruul's or SSC or whatever while the others still need most of the stuff from Kara.

So, I scrapped DKP entirely, threw it out the window, and made a resolution to use a /roll system with a loot council flare. I limited my recruiting of new members to people I felt had a positive attitude, were of good humor, and would not roll on gear just for shits and giggles. This way I could have a level of trust between the members, and between myself/officers and the membership at large, making looting much simpler and a little less painful. People get angry when they lose rolls, but they do not experience disappointment on a regular basis for lack of points to spend. Plus, it allows members who don't raid every single raid night to acquire gear still, and prevents caster classes wearing full sets of tailor'ed gear from hoarding points for later. For situations where someone does roll on something they won't be using in raids, I reserved the right for my officers and myself to confer and award the loot to another - since I've discussed gearing up with almost everyone in my guild, and they all trust me and my logic, it usually is not disputed.

Next, I slimmed the raid schedule down to 3 nights a week from 4, and got rid of any attendance tracking. I try to create a casual feel to the guild, and bring people in who want to be in raids and won't avoid raiding just because they've got the loot they need or what-have-you. Plus schedules change and such... I didn't want people feeling like I was measuring them down to a percentage point. I am measuring them, but only in a general sense - if raid bosses keep dying and I've got 25 of a good class mix, then I'm happy. If raid bosses don't die (or we don't make progress toward them dying), or we don't have 25, then I start getting analytical.

As for our Ventrilo and website, my webmistress took care of all that, I don't get involved on that front.

I could probably go even more in depth about how I've formed my guild, but I don't want to bore you all and I'm at work so I can't write a paper about it at present...
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Postby Kelador » Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:30 pm

Just a self promotion of the guild I am in. I am an Officer in the guild and have been in it about 10 years now. We are 11 yrs old, 12 this year.

I don't do this often, but will do this once only =)

The Syndicate book

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Postby Vanifae » Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:44 pm

Oh god before I even finished reading I figured you were in the Syndicate.
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Re: Advice on starting your own Guild

Postby Steve » Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:53 pm

Baelor wrote:...and got rid of any attendance tracking...

...and I've got 25 of a good class mix...


How much at odds are these, in your experience? Consistent attendance would seem to be required to have at least 25 people on consistently with a good class mix.

This, to me, is the single biggest change for raiding in TBC. You can no longer afford to just go with whoever logs on. You need to recruit for raid roles, and you can't really know what you need to recruit without consistent attendance.

I'd be interested in hearing about a guild situation which may disprove my line of thinking.
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Re: Advice on starting your own Guild

Postby Baelor » Wed Aug 01, 2007 2:09 pm

Steve wrote:
Baelor wrote:...and got rid of any attendance tracking...

...and I've got 25 of a good class mix...


How much at odds are these, in your experience? Consistent attendance would seem to be required to have at least 25 people on consistently with a good class mix.

This, to me, is the single biggest change for raiding in TBC. You can no longer afford to just go with whoever logs on. You need to recruit for raid roles, and you can't really know what you need to recruit without consistent attendance.

I'd be interested in hearing about a guild situation which may disprove my line of thinking.

Those 2 things tend to be at odds often, which is why I've tried to recruit very, very carefully, looking for people who can make our raid times consistently. That is almost the one thing I stress over attitude - attendance. Wanting to raid. Showing up most of the time. I don't need to track attendance and reward good attendance if people want to and are present. It's a problem sometimes, yes. I don't formally track attendance, but I do keep an eye on who shows up and who doesn't. If I notice certain people not showing up, I ask them about it. It's usually a genuine issue, like a computer blowing up, vacation, hard week at work, etc. Most of my current attendance problems are because of vacations/work related trips. However, the other part of the problem was my desire to keep the guild small and trim so there's not much arguing over raid spots. With <35 raiders in the guild, it's sometimes a burden with a few people not online to get a raid going. We managed to clear the tier 4 content in this manner though, so it's at least partially working.
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Postby fuzzygeek » Wed Aug 01, 2007 2:53 pm

Figure out what kind of guild you want. Hard core? Social? Somewhere in the middle?

Figure out what you want to do. Lead raids? Stick to raiding and let someone else do raids, while you do guild stuff?

Figure out how much time you want to spend on administrivia. Guess how much time you'll spend dealing with crap. Then double it.

Figure out what your guild structure is going to be -- class officers? Just an officer cadre? Loot council?

Figure out how you're going to organize. Get a website. Get a vent server. I hosted and wrote my own guild management application and got vent service from pure-voice.net or something; there are a bunch of different vent providers. It'll cost you like $20/mo or something. You could hack together a livejournal and Google Calendar to do all your guild stuff if you really wanted to. It's not terribly difficult if you have folks with skills.

Leading a guild is a lot of work. It will take away from the time you have to actually play the game. Make sure it's what you want to do before you start doing it.

In my case, I didn't have to start from ground zero; it was a guild that reformed when the GM needed to take a break. We reorganized very quickly and barely missed a step in our progression. This is back in the 40 man raid days, so the numbers of people I was dealing with are very different from today's guilds; I imagine it's considerably easier nowadays.

If I were to do it again today, I would have made some personel changes. I would have retooled things a bit so raiding was less serious business and more fun ... after all, this is a game -- and if you're not enjoying yourself, why bother?

Some folks want to raid and treat the getting of purples with the seriousness of life and death. If that's the kind of guild you want to run, good luck to you.

But I think in a couple years you'll have more to show for it if you focus on having fun with a tightknit group of folks who happen to kill internet dragons together, instead of running some boiler room purple making factory.

But that's just me.
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Postby Daedallus » Wed Aug 01, 2007 3:34 pm

Tips for making your own guild.

1) State your rules and goals clearly... whatever they are. preferably in some semi-permanent form, such as a web page.

2) enforce them.

3) ....

4) profit.

The vast majority of people that play this game want to have things handed to them, and they will seek out like-minded folks and organizations that will give it to them. If you want your guild to be successful, you need to be consistant. People will join, some will agree and follow, some will leave, and thats a good thing too, as you only want those who want to follow your rules and goals.

Don't despair, don't try to leapfrog... absorbing other guilds that are breaking up is a usually a mistake, drama ensues.

The best advice i guess i can give, is to keep it simple. keep it within your scope, and only do it if you have the time to commit. Guild leading can rapidly become a full time job, if you let it. That is why I eventually disbanded my own guild. You can only control so much.
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Postby Sabindeus » Thu Aug 02, 2007 8:19 am

I don't have the time right now to write out my thoughts on creating a guild properly. But I can help you with the technical front fairly quickly.

Go to:
www.nrgservers.net

For cheap you will get a Ventrilo server AND a good amount of webspace with CGI/PHP and a MySQL database. So if you're able to hack some web stuffs, then you can get a forum set up pretty quickly. They won't make a website for you though.
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Postby Igrado » Thu Aug 02, 2007 9:46 am

Starting/Leading a guild is not the same as raiding or playing. It's a second job. It will be stressful, and it will take a Lot of your time. IMO, if you want to raid, you're better off looking for a guild that fits you, even if it involves transferring servers. DO NOT equate raiding with guild leading in any way.

that aside...
Where'd you get a website, where do you get your vent?

http://www.guildlaunch.com/
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Postby honorshammer » Thu Aug 02, 2007 10:09 am

Igrado wrote: IMO, if you want to raid, you're better off looking for a guild that fits you, even if it involves transferring servers. DO NOT equate raiding with guild leading in any way.


I'm evaluating all my options. I'm not happy with my current situation, and I've been browseing the Guild Recruitment forums, but until I decide what I'm going to do, it'd be a waste of everyone's time to go apping to guilds.

So I can
A) Wait, and hope the situation improves
B) Start my own guild
C) Go to another guild (likely will mean transfering servers)
D) Reroll

I'm looking at starting my own guild because the kind of guild I'm looking for might be difficult to find.

Right now, I'm still waiting to see if the situation improves.

I didn't want to make a "Here's my situation, what do you think I should do thread" because I felt a thread about starting your own guild would be helpful to more people. Ultimately, I and I alone have to figure out what course if best for me.
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Postby Ills » Thu Aug 02, 2007 10:20 am

If you were sitting on the right side of the faction fence, I'd ginvite you.

I won't describe my guild because I don't want this to sound like a recruitment post. :)
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Postby Maranus » Thu Aug 02, 2007 10:36 am

A good guild is a self regulating social circle, rather then a heavily administrated organization. The hard part is keeping it together through raid stagnation.
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Postby cyndeace » Thu Aug 02, 2007 6:11 pm

Igrado wrote:Starting/Leading a guild is not the same as raiding or playing. It's a second job. It will be stressful, and it will take a Lot of your time. IMO, if you want to raid, you're better off looking for a guild that fits you, even if it involves transferring servers. DO NOT equate raiding with guild leading in any way.

that aside...
Where'd you get a website, where do you get your vent?

http://www.guildlaunch.com/


I agree with this 100%. I was an officer then a raid leader in EQ. When I became a raid leader I was on workers compensation, so I had a lot of free time to do research, and I did it. We were doing new content(on my server) so there was a lot of researching how other guilds on other servers did things, and also what bosses/zones were like.

I was an officer way back doing Vex Thal(for EQers) where it took the guild 4 months of constant farming to get keyed to go into a zone. Keeping people happy and wanting to progress was tough. The really hard part was when we went from 72man raids to 54man raids. Trying to sort out who could go when was tough.

When I went back to work I had to step down from leading raids as I didn't have the time to do the proper research on the newer content, there was that much time involved. Granted, WoW raids don't seem as complicated as EQ ones were(just an assumption not having been there) I would imagine there would be a ton of things to do, not including the general day to day ingame things.
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