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[25] Mimiron Hard Mode

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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Joanadark » Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:15 am

Consistantly reaching p4.

Enrage is a huge factor. Had to completely change strats to compensate. The winning raid comp runs 6 healers and 2 tanks or 7 healers and 1 tank. You need the DPS. If you have healing troubles have the whole raid flask Resistance.

There are basically two potential options for Bloodlusting. There have been kills with both.
1) Lust in p2. This eases healing by burning through p2 faster, but is much slower overall. There is a massive fight-wide DPS requirement using this method. Most of the kills where lust was used in p2 had victory pretty much simultaneous to the room exploding at the enrage. A good example of this strat are the Method and Ensidia kills.
2) Lust in p3. Essentially you utilize good positioning, clever p1 fire placement, and tools like Divine Sacrifices from paladins to survive P2. Upon reaching p3, you blow up all Emergency fire bots before they can put out any fires, keeping the number of fires in the room at the cap so no more spawn and the set up remaining the way you had it at the end of p2. Ranged DPS gets on the head, and melee quickly kills two assault bots. When the second assault bot is at 40%, blow Bloodlust and nuke it down, then drop the head to the floor two consecutive times and blow it up to dead while it takes 200% damage. P3 should be over within 45 seconds.
Good examples of this strat are the Fusion and Premonition kills. Fusion has a good video on their website.
Last edited by Joanadark on Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Rehlachs » Mon Jun 08, 2009 6:29 am

So, what are the time limits for the particular phases in your opinion after you changed your raid setup like that?
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Joanadark » Mon Jun 08, 2009 8:42 am

To win, you need about 3 minutes 15 seconds or so in phase 3 with your whole raid up. Any extra is an added bonus, but if you can manage just above 3 minutes, you should be able to manage it.

So, given Lust strat 2, I'd say approximately:

Phase 1- 1 min, 30 secs
20 second transition
Phase 2- 3 mins, 30 secs
20 second transition
Phase 3- 45 seconds
20 second transition, AOE adds
Phase 4- 3 min, 15 secs
HARD ENRAGE

The problem with strat 1 is the fact that it just means phase 3 takes way too long.
Utilizing the Lust in phase 2 just doesnt provide a big enough kill speed increase. You make up time off the enrage in strat 2 because youre utilizing the 200% damage taken of the head while Lusted. Thats the key element of the strat.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Laz » Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:20 am

Fridmarr wrote:Right, but that's just because of timing (affected by latency) not because there's something magical about walking. Surely we've all been run over by a boss while standing completely still before? They don't have the code for positioning the specific to each model combination, so you get some "buggy" behavior. Most of the time it does not matter and you can readjust, but on mimiron those bugs mattered.

I normally run with sub 50ms of latency and I get odd mob repositioning behavior all the time. I seriously doubt it is a latency issue. What I do know is that walking works. It worked on Grobbulus, it works on Thorim, pre-nerf Mimiron and any other repositioning mob I can think of.

I can't think of a single instance where mobs shuffle like they do now prior to 3.x. Something was changed. It's almost like the boss is trying to extrapolate where you're going. Who knows. Try walking!
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby moduspwnens » Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:48 am

I am very much a fan of the "double-magnetic-core Bloodlust" strat and will hopefully be applying it to Mimiron10's hard mode tonight.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Fridmarr » Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:03 am

Laz wrote:
Fridmarr wrote:Right, but that's just because of timing (affected by latency) not because there's something magical about walking. Surely we've all been run over by a boss while standing completely still before? They don't have the code for positioning the specific to each model combination, so you get some "buggy" behavior. Most of the time it does not matter and you can readjust, but on mimiron those bugs mattered.

I normally run with sub 50ms of latency and I get odd mob repositioning behavior all the time. I seriously doubt it is a latency issue. What I do know is that walking works. It worked on Grobbulus, it works on Thorim, pre-nerf Mimiron and any other repositioning mob I can think of.

I can't think of a single instance where mobs shuffle like they do now prior to 3.x. Something was changed. It's almost like the boss is trying to extrapolate where you're going. Who knows. Try walking!

It is definitely a timing issue and latency will affect it. There's a difference between where your client and the server thinks that things are. The reason walking works on Grob and others, is because it slows down the timing making that calculation more accurate. So when Grob thinks he has to move, he doesn't think he has to move far, and he's got a better idea of where you are.

Yes there was a universal change to boss hit box sizes not long after WotLK shipped. It fixed a lot of issues, but the smaller box does tend to cause the boss to reposition more often, and so there is more shuffling.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Joanadark » Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:13 am

A note about phase 1.
Regardless of strat, the boss should be dead before the 4th plasma blast. Thats your DPS benchmarker.

In phase 3, emergency fire bots can be Slowed by Mages (using the actual spell Slow, mages should be arcane anyway for the burst and the damage reduction), and Chains of Iced by DKs. They can also be Death Gripped.

Regarding the Fire "cap"; the cap is based of area of the room covered, not numerical quantity of fires. Imagine if the entire room is divided into little blocks to make a grid. To throw a random number out, the Cap on fires might be 60 of those grid squares, out of 100. It doesnt matter if that is composed of only 3 fires snaked all over the place, or 12 little seperate fires scattered all over the room.
This is why killing emergency fire bots is so important. Coming out of phase 2, the vast majority of fires should be concentrated in 2 quadrants of the room. If you kill the fire bots, even if you are below fire cap, if new fires spawn they will quickly cause you to reach and stay at cap, preventing those new fires from spreading out at all, and just remaining as little tiny patches. Once you are at flame cap no new fires can spawn. This will conserve you a nice open space to conduct p3, and ensure you wont have a fire spawned right on top of the head as you drop it and prevent the melee from DPSing. It will also give you a good compressed area to work with in p4, and pretty much ensure that the first frost bomb will spawn away from your group.
P4 just becomes a game of moving to each area cleared by a frost bomb as the bomb explodes and staying alive.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Joanadark » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:14 pm

After tonite's progress we called it after getting several clean transitions to p4 with everyone alive and almost 4 minutes on the timer remaining. People were tired though and performance started to slip so we're putting off what should be the kill until tomorrow.

Our best attempt:
Image

Only thing we need to figure out left is how to handle the Hand Pulse in p4, and he will die. We're going to spend all of Monday finishing it off. We're letting Freya, Vezax, and Yog rot if necessary.

We are running 1 tank, 6 healers (2 druids, 2 paladins, 2 holy priests), and an even split of ranged and melee.
Last edited by Joanadark on Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby amh » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:16 pm

Is that Cooldown-window from oRA2 or something else?
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Joanadark » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:18 pm

amh wrote:Is that Cooldown-window from oRA2 or something else?


Close, its actually ORA3.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Joanadark » Mon Jun 15, 2009 8:07 pm

6/7/4% wipe
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby moduspwnens » Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:11 pm

Not sure if it has any merit, but our RL tonight in Mimiron10 claimed that wearing the level 70 quest reward FR ring noticeably decreased his fire damage taken. I'm a little skeptical to say the least, but he says it takes his fire ticks from around 8k to 4-5k. For next week, we're planning on trying Flask of Chromatic Wonder and Arcanum of the Flame's Soul on our "frequently deads" (mage, priest, shaman, DK) to see how much that helps. That's +35 Arcane Resist (for P2) and +60 Fire Resist to help healing thoughout the fight with minimal cost to healing and DPS.

EDIT: Oh, left this part out. We also plan to, if this is effective, consider putting that on the entire raid (minus me) and having one of our healers DPS instead.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby Joanadark » Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:28 pm

Lesser Flask of Resistance is far better than Chromatic Wonder.
Half our raid uses them, and many of the casters use the fire enchant to cloak. Anything more than that is overkill.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby nutron » Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:24 am

We finally got our kill tonite on our first week of attempts and used 6 healers + 2 tanks.
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Re: [25] Mimiron Hard Mode

Postby moduspwnens » Tue Jun 16, 2009 6:22 am

Joanadark wrote:Lesser Flask of Resistance is far better than Chromatic Wonder.
Half our raid uses them, and many of the casters use the fire enchant to cloak. Anything more than that is overkill.


Is that a WotLK one? I'll look it up as soon as WoWhead finishes its downtime.

EDIT: It must be, because it's not on WoWWiki.

EDIT: Just checked on Thottbot, and that's pretty nice. That'll make +50 Arcane Resist and +50 Fire Resist (or +20 from cloak enchant, or +25 from helm enchant).
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