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Should I go for furies deck?

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Should I go for furies deck?

Postby Crittoris » Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:21 am

I got the Ace of furies the other day, and figured i'd wait til i found the rest of the cards at discount and post the deck on AH.

I don't have an epic mount, and that would put me well on my way. However, I wouldn't mind having that trinket. I'm not completely sold, though, as I probably won't be able to raid in it for a long time because I'm still majorly crushable. I've also already got a 45 stam trinket, and i"m not sure that negligable threat and 6 stam are worth so much money...

Any thoughts?
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Re: Should I go for furies deck?

Postby Morpheren » Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:10 am

I'm at work, and can't check your armory (damn filter), but I'd say sell it. Run heroic Mgt and get the Commendation of Kael'thas, and Moroes Pocketwatch.
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Postby submerged » Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:15 am

Personally I wouldn't bother. I didn't pick up furies deck until I had my epic flyer and an excess of gold I had nothing to do with, and even then I just picked it up for my "epeen" stam set because I already had condemnation. It's a decent threat trinket, seems to proc pretty often for me, but personally I'd go for a flyer first just because it speeds you your income more than you'd think.
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Postby Lookit » Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:47 am

I would *definitely* get your epic flyer first. I bought mine 3 weeks ago, and already have another 4200g, with no time spent farming and minimal time spent doing dailies. It really speeds everything up drastically. Plus since I no longer take taxi flight paths, I come across a ton of ore on my way to instances.

I bought the furies deck before the Commendation was known about, and I probably wouldn't have bought it had I known it was about to be made obsolete. It's still great for high stam, but unless you've got the cash to spare, I would just sell the ace. The epic mount will have an overall much larger impact on your gameplay :D
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Postby Dorvan » Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:03 pm

At this point I'd recommend skipping the Furies deck and just going for the Commendation. Although I still keep my DMC:V around, I haven't used double stam trinkets since 2.2 came out.
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Postby Morpheren » Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:51 pm

submerged wrote:It's a decent threat trinket, seems to proc pretty often for me, but personally I'd go for a flyer first just because it speeds you your income more than you'd think.


Well considering its a 10% proc on being hit, and you've got roughly 50% avoidance, that means about once every 20 hits it will proc @ a 2 sec avg swing timer and ~120 (still at work no official info behind web filter) dmg thats

120 dmg *1.9 RF = 228 threat/40 seconds = 5.7 tps

Only time I even use mine anymore is farm content when I want the EH vs avoidance so i get mana.
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Postby Aerfalle » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:18 pm

I'm happy I bought mine but it'll get replaced soon with the JC trinket.

If you don't intend to wear 2 stam trinkets, then don't bother. Even if you did want to, you could get the Kael one and pair it with your +45 and no one would fault you for it.
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Postby Ariashley » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:38 pm

Morpheren wrote: Run heroic Mgt and get the Commendation of Kael'thas, and Moroes Pocketwatch.


It really isn't that simple. I can barely handle regular Mgstr Terrace and I am uncrushable, mainly because my health pool just isn't deep enough to handle groups of 5 casters blasting away, even with cc. How could someone with 11.5k unbuffed health possibly complete heroic Mgstr's, which is really intended for those at a ZA/Gruul's level? Imo, Commendation of Kael'thas is totally out of reach for both him and me at this point.

Also, we have 2 tanks in my guild who went to Kara every week for 8 months before that watch dropped....

To the OP: You are 11.84% from uncrushable. Might sound like a long way, it really isn't given your rep and such. I got from that 11% or so to uncrushable in about 20 hrs played, which might take you a week or a month - depending on how much playtime you have. I spent a good bit of that time looking for groups.

As for the Darkmoon Card deck, I chose to get it and use it. I did take about a month to get the deck together, and got most of the cards very inexpensively. Right now, I could really use the stam, and my main had plenty of money (she's a JC and Leatherworker) and an epic flyer.

However, there are other reasonable trinket options that you can get from drops or from quests. Dabri's Enigma from a quest in Netherstorm has a nice amount of block rating on use along with 30 defense passively. That's a guaranteed item you can get, without relying on any drop. I got to uncrushable with the 2 stam trinkets, but gemmed about half of my sockets (about 3 of them) with dodge and enchanted my cape with dodge also. I determined that it was a more reliable way to get the avoidance at this point.

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Postby Crittoris » Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:49 pm

Ariashley, you made a lot of the points I was going to make about the commendation. However, I don't think that I will be able to wear two stam trinkets for a long time, and at that point I probably will be able to do heroic MgT.

Between the 45 stam trinket instead of a def trinket, the belt of the guardian instead of the quest blue belt, and the gavel instead of the boe sword with block rating, I'm missing out on around 4% of possible pre-kara chance to block (iirc). I'm also working on getting arena points for the s2 shield, and the lack of any avoidance on that, even from defense, makes me about another 1% away from 102.4. I can definately reach the magic number, but I might have to switch a gem or two around and I need all the pre-kara items on my list to do it.

Things started rolling for me today when I did heroic SP. It was ugly and took a while with a bunch of wipes, but now that I know the layout and dangers of the instance better I know I can do it with a decent healer and 1 cc.

If worse comes to worst, I'm friends with one of the best tankadins on the server, and I could easily pay him to summon me in for the last boss fight til I get teh commendation. It would probably cost me a fraction of the price of the vengeance deck.
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Postby Sparti » Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:56 pm

The furies deck, to be honest, as someone who has had one for nearly six months now, is in no way worth the monetary investment, especially these days. The proc is more or less meaningless - there are better threat options - and the stamina benefit can be easily replicated. In the pre-karazhan levels you have three passable options ; Stamina jewelcrafting trinkets, the 350 Engineering trinkets, and the Alchemist's Stone. (while granted the alchemist's stone only has 15 stamina, it also increases healing and mana potion benefit, which are things we actually use at this point of content) Post-karazhan you have the violet badge and the commendation of kael'thas. Again, the violet badge is by no means as good as the furies deck, but here's the clincher: It's free!


I got my furies deck for under 1k gold; if you can make one for under a thousand, by all means get it. It's a great trinket. But on most servers it can cost nearly as much as an epic flyer to put the deck together. It's simply not worth that kind of money.
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Postby Lookit » Wed Apr 23, 2008 4:40 pm

Ariashley wrote:It really isn't that simple. I can barely handle regular Mgstr Terrace and I am uncrushable, mainly because my health pool just isn't deep enough to handle groups of 5 casters blasting away, even with cc."


Well there's your problem. Mobs in heroics can't crush, so you don't need to worry about uncrushability. For heroics you want to stack as much stamina as you can while maintaining decent avoidance and block value.

Heroic MgT is really about execution and NOT brute force. It might seem to you "unrealistic and outrageous" that I would even suggest it, but just get 2 mages and a rogue - easiest instance ever.

You just strike me as the type that makes everything harder than it has to be. Sure, you're not going to spam the LFG channel saying "Need 2 mages, a rogue and T6 healer for h MgT nao!!" and get a group together in 3 mins, but if you have a decent guild and maybe post on your guild forums saying "So I want some hot heroic MgT loots, but I'm a bit undergeared for it. However, it would be totally doable with the right group, so let me know if you're a CC class willing to run it with me, and we'll get a run together."

To you, doing something like that might seem unreasonable ("schedule a run more than 5 minutes before I actually want to do it??? This is supposed to be a game, not a full time job as a coordinator!!") but in my mind, it's the easy and stress-free way to do it.

To recap:

Focus more on stam than uncrushability for heroics

Don't try to pug heroic MgT

Set up a decent group with great CC

Familiarize yourself with the trash AND bosses. There is definitely a hard way and an easy way to do both.


After that, enjoy your leet epics =)


Edited to add:

You might also say "Well, it's easy for you, you're already decked out in epics!" Let me just point out, that of my 17 gear slots, only *four* are from raiding. The other 13 are all from 5-mans. I have 3 Kara drops and 1 drop for TK that was complete luck the first and only time I ever set foot in the instance.
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Postby Aerfalle » Wed Apr 23, 2008 5:21 pm

H MgT is completely manageable without any kara drops. I didn't have any when I tanked my first run, and we killed every boss.

You really just have to learn the mob abilities and cc like a non-pally tank would. You're not supposed to tank 5 at a time. This place has "sorry pallies, no dice" written all over it.

Shadow priests are great, because you can have their MC tank another mob and take out 2 per pull. Then if you have a mage or a rogue, or both, you're tanking practically no mobs at all. Same with a warlock's enslave.
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Postby spelltank » Wed Apr 23, 2008 5:23 pm

Lookit wrote:
Ariashley wrote:It really isn't that simple. I can barely handle regular Mgstr Terrace and I am uncrushable, mainly because my health pool just isn't deep enough to handle groups of 5 casters blasting away, even with cc."


Well there's your problem. Mobs in heroics can't crush, so you don't need to worry about uncrushability. For heroics you want to stack as much stamina as you can while maintaining decent avoidance and block value.

Heroic MgT is really about execution and NOT brute force. It might seem to you "unrealistic and outrageous" that I would even suggest it, but just get 2 mages and a rogue - easiest instance ever.

You just strike me as the type that makes everything harder than it has to be. Sure, you're not going to spam the LFG channel saying "Need 2 mages, a rogue and T6 healer for h MgT nao!!" and get a group together in 3 mins, but if you have a decent guild and maybe post on your guild forums saying "So I want some hot heroic MgT loots, but I'm a bit undergeared for it. However, it would be totally doable with the right group, so let me know if you're a CC class willing to run it with me, and we'll get a run together."

To you, doing something like that might seem unreasonable ("schedule a run more than 5 minutes before I actually want to do it??? This is supposed to be a game, not a full time job as a coordinator!!") but in my mind, it's the easy and stress-free way to do it.

To recap:

Focus more on stam than uncrushability for heroics

Don't try to pug heroic MgT

Set up a decent group with great CC

Familiarize yourself with the trash AND bosses. There is definitely a hard way and an easy way to do both.


After that, enjoy your leet epics =)


Edited to add:

You might also say "Well, it's easy for you, you're already decked out in epics!" Let me just point out, that of my 17 gear slots, only *four* are from raiding. The other 13 are all from 5-mans. I have 3 Kara drops and 1 drop for TK that was complete luck the first and only time I ever set foot in the instance.


QFT. HMGT isnt really that much harder on heroic for the tank, assuming you have good CC.

I tanked it successfully with 12k health, full blues besides tankatronic goggles and gladiator shield, and it went smoothly (although no commendation or cudgel dropped for me :( )

The key to the instance is good CC. WIth 2 mages/rogues and a lock/spriest, you can turn the 5 pulls down so that you only need to doubletank two meleers, and even the five pull isnt too challenging. My group was two mages and lock, and with two sheeps, and enslave, there was very little i had to do, except for the first two bosses, and CC makes the third boss trivial as well.

If you can find a group of guildies willing to help you, i'd go for it, gear doesnt seem to make it THAT much easier (we only wiped when we pulled an additional group, haveing 3k more health wouldnt have stopped the wipe)
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Postby Discus » Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:40 am

"You just strike me as the type that makes everything harder than it has to be."

No he isn't. He's just like 99% of WoW players - the silent majority of us who aren't raiding BT every night and able to farm heroics. When you're a top player it's easy to forget that not everyone has the time, skill and dedication you have.
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Postby Seloei » Thu Apr 24, 2008 6:31 am

Tbh, before i even set foot in any t5/6 instance i only ran heroics for badges. Since badge loot was "zomg! almost like raid drops". Altho, i did do a fair deal of kara but mostly as a healbot since they didn't believe palas can tank. Epics don't matter, if you don't have the skill to go with it.

Point being, if you are trying to aoe tank a place which you can't, you will wipe. Tanking is not all about being able to take the beating from as many as possible but also using CC when it is needed, and heroic MagT needs CC badly if you are undergeared. Sure you can aoe tank it when you are t4+ geared and the healer/dps are the same level but before that it's not possible/easy.

The people who fail with tanking that place are either running with bad dps/healers (who don't know what "agro" is and how not to attack a cc'd mob) or the tank is unaware how to tank single mobs.

As almost Everywhere

skill >>> gear, only thing is gear makes it easier, with skill you can tank heroic mag t even in full greens (and loads of cc)

But to the OP

If you feel it's a too big of a challenge to try to get a very good group going (which, i'd rate is on the same toughness as early t5) then you have 2 other choices. The badge from the Kara quest (stamina and Arcane res) or the heroic trinket from underbog (not a good droprate). If i had a deck now, i'd rather sell it and get an alternative. It's just not worth the money invested. And in MH (the only place in a raid where you tank 10+ and this might be beneficial) you will most probably be wearing avoidance or block rating trinkets to get passive uncrush as high as possible
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