Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests Here)

Get help with your character's gear

Moderators: Fridmarr, Worldie, Sabindeus, Aergis, lythac, Digren, majiben

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Schroom » Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:49 am

Hi, we are starting HMs ToT tonight and I'm quite of undecided.

at the moment I go for an allround-set of Stamina/CoHa means: I gem
Red: Exp
Yellow/Blue: sta+Ha

usually I run with the Ji-kun trinket reforged into haste and "Lei Shen's Final Orders" NM.

here is my armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/z ... m/advanced (don't mind the Loa-Shen trinket imagine Lei Shen's final Orders in here)


now my question is this. for the HMs should I rather stay as I am, go to full out Hastegems and use stamina trinkets or should I got full out stamina with gems/trinkets and so on?

PS: doing 10 man btw
User avatar
Schroom
 
Posts: 637
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:03 pm
Location: Luxembourg

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby daishan » Wed Apr 03, 2013 1:48 am

For Jin I don't think it matters which gearing strat you use, though I was struggling to make the most of my dps without pulling aggro back while off tanking in the water, ended up turning RF off and on.
On Horridon it's all down to SotR timing if your on the boss, get that right and there's no need to have more than 700k fully buffed (I ran with haste/armour elixirs as uasual).
It's a little hard for me to double check on my phone but are you sure using exp/haste hybrids wouldn't allow for more efficient reforges?
Daishan
"I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it." -- Terry Pratchett
User avatar
daishan
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 433
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:04 pm
Location: UK

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Schroom » Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:02 am

daishan wrote: are you sure using exp/haste hybrids wouldn't allow for more efficient reforges?


instead of? the pure Exp gems? maybe... if you mean the haste/sta gems, I just like stamina ^^ it saved my lifes several times when I thought o sh*** damn down to 3% healt -> LoH instead of being dead :>
User avatar
Schroom
 
Posts: 637
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:03 pm
Location: Luxembourg

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby daishan » Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:08 am

Ye ment in the red sockets, should allow you to move more mast/avoidance into haste I think.
Same as you I like a little stam in blue sockets, plus it's hard enough getting under hit cap without gemming it.

Edit:
I've not done many pulls on Tortos and Ji'kun yet but feel Tortos for sure and maybe Ji will want more stam than I run, depending on which tactic we use. I've been thinking Tortos might even benefit from an avoidance set with 8 bats up for a good % of the fight.
Daishan
"I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it." -- Terry Pratchett
User avatar
daishan
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 433
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:04 pm
Location: UK

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Schroom » Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:15 am

mh have to try. I just went to ask mr robot (which I rarely use.. I prefer other sources) to double check and they also suggest full Exp gems. I remember doing what you mean about 2-3 weeks ago and I ended up having to reforge haste into exp. (especially after replacing the ji-kun trinket, I'm waiting for Horridon and lei Shen to be nice and give me their trinkets)
User avatar
Schroom
 
Posts: 637
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:03 pm
Location: Luxembourg

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby daishan » Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:21 am

I like AMR but often find I can squeeze out a little more of the stats I want by gemming by hand then using reforger lite, make sure to hit the show button several times as it doesn't always get it perfect first time.
Daishan
"I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it." -- Terry Pratchett
User avatar
daishan
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 433
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:04 pm
Location: UK

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Sagara » Wed Apr 03, 2013 7:51 am

Seapking of which: I'm currently balls to the walls with Stam, but I'm wondering about shifting priority slightly to haste (haste gem for yellow, haste/exp for red and ahste/stam for blue). BTW, we're progressing in 25 men, now at Iron Qon.

Worth it?

Here's the armory if the link below fails.
When that day comes, seek all the light and wonder of this world, and fight.

Worldie wrote:I used to like it [mean] back on Sylvanas.

Queldan - EU Stormrage (H) - Good night, sweet prince.
User avatar
Sagara
 
Posts: 3272
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 1:04 am
Location: Belgium

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Klaudandus » Wed Apr 03, 2013 8:03 am

is it safe to assume that the cloak to get from valor points is the haste/mastery one?
The Element of Forum Hyperbole
Image
---
Flüttershy - Draenei Protection Paladin, Aerie Peak
Klaudandus - BE Protection Paladin, Feathermoon (Semi-retired)
User avatar
Klaudandus
 
Posts: 9362
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 7:08 am
Location: Texas' Armpit

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Sagara » Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:23 am

Yeah, the other is dodge/hit
When that day comes, seek all the light and wonder of this world, and fight.

Worldie wrote:I used to like it [mean] back on Sylvanas.

Queldan - EU Stormrage (H) - Good night, sweet prince.
User avatar
Sagara
 
Posts: 3272
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 1:04 am
Location: Belgium

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Hayt » Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:01 am

Hi Everyone

Long time lurker and I find myself in need of a quick reality check (or a full fledged restructuring of perspective :/ ) because the haste/control build is sexy but also not in my comfort zone theory-wise.

I am MT for my guilds 2nd 10 man group and never do 25m content....mostly because we are an empty server and 2-night casual raiders.

My darling: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/b ... t/advanced

I am trying to follow the control/haste method and have a deep dread that I am just doing it all wrong. The fact that my entire guild does not seem to agree/accept that haste is valid for us does not help my nerves.

Anyways - my three questions are

Am I hurting myself by using haste instead of haste/stam?
Am I hurting myself by not focusing on exp 15% hard cap?
Am I asking the right questions?

Thank you for your time!
Hayt
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:36 am

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Sagara » Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:22 am

Hello there and welcome aboard!

You've been mentionning 10 man and I wanted to ask an extra question (so, you could indeed ask a better one, but we can't answer it for you):
What is killing your raid right now? Is it the enrage timer, or is it tank death? Or, to a lesser extent, other player's deaths where one of the "source events" was a dangerous tanking situation - like dipping low on Horridon and 3-4 seconds later losing a DPS to Jalak's AoE.

Theck has been pretty active about your precise problem recently on Sacred Duty, and the basic gist is:

If you want to ease your healer's life more, go for more stamina. When you're satisfied or can't push much further, you can consider any secondary stat good for you, with hit/expertise leading the pack (so, yes, expertise hard cap is really good). Haste is the weakest on TDR and average at best on spikes, but offsets its weakness with the control and DPS it provides, while Mastery is very strong on control, and Dodge/Parry being strong for pure TDR.

If you instead want to shorten a boss fight (which is incidentally helping your healers, to a lesser extent), it's reasonable to find a Stamina plateau you're comfortable with, and then focus on capping hit and expertise, then move on to haste.

As to why haste helps us so much - it's all in Sanctity of Battle. Our main HoPo generators are affected by haste. More Haste -> more HoPo -> more ShotR -> less damage. The double whammy is that the HoPo system makes that extra defense available on demand. The triple whammy is that haste increases ou DPS considerably, and as you may have noticed, a good tank's DPS is not weak by any stretch of the imagination (we can thank Vengeance for that), reducing fight times, and by extension, reducing the damage intake and amount of risky situations.
When that day comes, seek all the light and wonder of this world, and fight.

Worldie wrote:I used to like it [mean] back on Sylvanas.

Queldan - EU Stormrage (H) - Good night, sweet prince.
User avatar
Sagara
 
Posts: 3272
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 1:04 am
Location: Belgium

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Klaudandus » Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:31 am

Slightly dumb question. Is the shadopan expertise trinket a good choice to get?

I need to spend some vp, and i refuse to buy gloves/pants
The Element of Forum Hyperbole
Image
---
Flüttershy - Draenei Protection Paladin, Aerie Peak
Klaudandus - BE Protection Paladin, Feathermoon (Semi-retired)
User avatar
Klaudandus
 
Posts: 9362
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 7:08 am
Location: Texas' Armpit

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Hayt » Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:20 am

Sagara wrote:Hello there and welcome aboard!

You've been mentionning 10 man and I wanted to ask an extra question (so, you could indeed ask a better one, but we can't answer it for you):
What is killing your raid right now? Is it the enrage timer, or is it tank death? Or, to a lesser extent, other player's deaths where one of the "source events" was a dangerous tanking situation - like dipping low on Horridon and 3-4 seconds later losing a DPS to Jalak's AoE.


Hi And thank you!

I tend to be the last person alive when my group wipes and have even had a couple of first-kills where it was just me and 2 dps left alive(Tank healer joygasm). My main healer has told me I am extremely easy to heal compared to my monk counterpart except for 'random times'; which, after reading Theck's recent analysis of SS, I believe to be the times I experimented with Eternal Flame.

So I guess the main reason for group wipes is low dps and tactical failures; however it has always felt irresponsible to me to cast blame on others instead of trying to improve my own character/play.


I also feel like my tank DPS is way below par except on certain fights where we tankadins get to shine on all the meters.....but I believe that to be poor play on my part rather than a gearing question.

I hope I answered your question effectively. Thanks for help :)

Edit: I also have the same Q as Klaud since I have two stam trinkets and feel like I could replace one of them to get the last bits of exp I need.
Edit 2: sentence structure
Hayt
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:36 am

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Fenrìr » Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:42 am

Klaudandus wrote:Slightly dumb question. Is the shadopan expertise trinket a good choice to get?

I need to spend some vp, and i refuse to buy gloves/pants



I use it atm in my default tank set up. I like it, but others don't. so it's really up to you.
Image
Fenrìr
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 1137
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:41 am

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Zothor » Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:09 pm

First, if you need to dump VP... get the cape!! Haste/mastery "dps" cape is outstanding for tanking.

There is a tipping point where the ilvl jump is so high that yes, you should switch to an expertise DPS trinket... but it's not obvious that tipping point exists yet.

There is, from what I can tell, little reason for any tank to not running double-stam trinkets 95% of the time (and yes, as I say this my armory isn't doing so). Stamina trinkets are weird when it comes to item budget: an equal level stamina trinket has 50% more stamina than an equal level secondary stat trinket. So your 476 Relic has almost exactly the same Stamina as your 522 expertise trinket.

But, I need more expertise, you say. Get it elsewhere: either by enchanting your gloves for expertise (so many people miss this option!) or by switching gems. Because when you trade an equal ilvl stamina trinket for expertise, you lose 1/3 of the stamina in itemization budget... but when you trade a stamina (240) gem for expertise, you GAIN 50% of that in expertise (320). Which is bananas, but is currently how the game is built. Gemming is one of the least efficient ways to add stamina, and trinkets are basically the best way to do it. Too bad the Lei Shen trinket is going to be a pain in the butt to get for most people.

I don't think you need to be gemming for Expertise though, especially not straight red expertise. Your gear level is plenty high that an optimal reforge should be able to hit the hit and hard expertise caps pretty accurately; are you using ReforgeLite or Ask Mr. Robot to do those calculations? I personally swear by Reforgelite because I like my numbers to be in-game, but AMR works well for that process if you're more comfortable with the website.

Finally, a word of caution: you suggest that YOU'RE not sure that you're doing control-haste right. If you mean you're not sure that the build is viable and pragmatic, let us assure you that it is. But there is a huge caveat: you have to be running your priorities optimally and button mashing like a champ to make it worthwhile. Haste builds are all about shortening your GCD so you get more holy power generation, but that means if you start pushing your holy power generators back you're undermining your own build. If you're confident with your rotational flow, rock the haste. If you're not, there's no shame in Mastery. It's still pretty good these days.

Also, I dig the Xmog. I was pairing that exact weapon/shield combo until I upgraded both last week, because I keep ending up with the weirdo dark looking DK-set-lookalike pieces... but I digress.


TLDR: Stamina trinkets are awesome; drop stamina gems for expertise if you need to drop stam. Hit/Exp hardcap before you stack haste. Don't forget expertise enchants. Haste/mastery cape is awesome.
Zothor
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2009 1:39 pm

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Klaudandus » Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:15 pm

already got the haste/mastery cloak.
The Element of Forum Hyperbole
Image
---
Flüttershy - Draenei Protection Paladin, Aerie Peak
Klaudandus - BE Protection Paladin, Feathermoon (Semi-retired)
User avatar
Klaudandus
 
Posts: 9362
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 7:08 am
Location: Texas' Armpit

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Fenrìr » Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:34 pm

That's quite a long post to which I'm assuming is directed at Klaud whom I know doesn't need such a rough post.

Everyone has their thoughts on trinkets and there's a flip side to your "There are several reasons for a tank to not run double stam trinkets". The most foremost one is they and their healers are fine with the tank's health and so the tank is trying to push higher dps. However, no one denies stam's usefulness; especially when one such as Theck has laid it out quite nicely over on Sacred Duty.

I for one, only like running one and find my health just fine and my healers are never stressed to the point they're asking for more. We've never wiped to a death in which was related to not having enough health to survive a few hits. However, others fine double haste trinkets the route to go and are more 'bleeding edge' than I. It also really plays into what kind of content your guild is rocking ~and~ your gearing strategy.
Image
Fenrìr
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 1137
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:41 am

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Kalimaa » Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:06 am

Hi everyone

Long time lurker since BC in fact where this site confirmed me in that walking the path of the light and standing in front of the boss receiving hitting was the way ahead (expect for certain trash in BT where you tanked with your back to the mobs :))

I have the need for some gearing advice for my tankadin
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/s ... a/advanced

I try to follow a control/haste strategy with quite a bit stamina, and would like to know whether or not I'm ready to raid ToT (yes I know that depends on the healers :))

My plan is to get a new pair of gloves crafted and was also thinking on crafting a pair of boots if the haunting spirits get cheap enough (thinking on 10k a piece here). My question about the boots is whether to go for
http://www.wowhead.com/item=94265 or http://www.wowhead.com/item=94267

Also given that I loathe LFR what other options do I have to improve the gear?

Thanks in advance
Kalimaa
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:14 am

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby daishan » Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:47 am

If you have the gold go for the haste/mast boots, for my money they beat all normal mode drops even the thunder forged ones, and no good boots drop from the easier heroics. So those crafted ones should last you most of the tier.
As long as you can time SotR for the telegraphed attacks half the bosses in ToT have, your current gear shouldn't stop your team clearing normals.
I'd say the vp cloak should be your next purchase, there's good bracers on Jin and horridon. Only thing I'd change on your gear is switch your glove enchant to sha armour kit as that's a more efficient place to get stam than with gems.
Gl in ToT
Daishan
"I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it." -- Terry Pratchett
User avatar
daishan
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 433
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:04 pm
Location: UK

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Gab » Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:23 am

With your current gear the Hit boots would probably be better since you are still gemming/reforging for hit and expertise. I went with the Haste boots because I'm swimming in hit; neither pair are a bad choice.

IMO the only better boots are Heroic Thunderforged drops. You should get pretty good mileage out of crafting some.

Your gear should be fine for ToT normal although most guilds/pugs might be critical, we cleared with our "retired" druid tank a few weeks ago and his gear is about the same ilvl as yours not to mention paladin active mitigation is generally stronger than druid's in ToT. The most important thing for personal survival in ToT is using Shield of the Righteous and cooldowns appropriately.

You could hit that 60 str bonus in your legs by traiding any of the three Guardians that you have in your prismatic sockets with the Solid in the legs. Free stats are free stats... Pretty minor though.

Edit: A little slow apparently.
User avatar
Gab
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2010 10:54 am
Location: Wish you were here

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Klaudandus » Sat Apr 20, 2013 5:43 am

Question, what is better -- an upgraded LFR kilrak with the 500 str and the prismatic socket or http://www.wowhead.com/item=95632 with the prism socket?
The Element of Forum Hyperbole
Image
---
Flüttershy - Draenei Protection Paladin, Aerie Peak
Klaudandus - BE Protection Paladin, Feathermoon (Semi-retired)
User avatar
Klaudandus
 
Posts: 9362
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 7:08 am
Location: Texas' Armpit

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby econ21 » Sun Apr 21, 2013 2:29 am

Looking at Theck's weapon comparisons in his matlab thread, it's going to be really close in terms of their dps. He does not sim the upgraded LFR Kilrak, but you can interpolate based on the unupgraded LFR and normal ones. From eyeballing the numbers, it seems to depend on whether you evaluate at weapon caps (sim 3) or not (sim 1). I'd be inclined to evaluate at weapon caps, but then you'd have to factor in the extra dps from whatever extra haste you free up if you switch to the 502 weapon. All too complicated for something that's like to be really close. Theck says upgrade your Kilrak if get something 10 levels or more higher, so the 502 weapon might just nudge ahead on dps.

In terms of other stats, it's also close. But given that Kilrak gives you unreforgable parry (via strength) and mastery, whereas the 502 weapon is hit/expertise, I'd be inclined to favor the latter.

TLDR: Never mind the maths, feel the ilevel!
econ21
 
Posts: 1217
Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2008 8:53 am

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby mort » Sun Apr 21, 2013 3:55 pm

I've been really unlucky with shield drops so I've been using the raid finder version of the MSV shield for months. Today I got http://www.wowhead.com/item=95515. Is the loss of strength worth the gain in mastery, haste, stamina and armor? Looks pretty obvious to me but I thought I'd ask.
mort
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:48 pm

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Gab » Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:38 am

I'd say it's worth it.

2642 armor, 453 stamina, 419 haste and 403 mastery in exchange for 566 str, 230 parry and 368 dodge. When reforging parry and spirit to haste and a haste gem in the SoTD.

It'll be a little weird but thats a TON of armor and quite a bit of stam not to mention better secondaries. Go for it.
User avatar
Gab
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2010 10:54 am
Location: Wish you were here

Re: Gear Check/Advice Thread (All Specific Advice Requests H

Postby Schroom » Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:08 pm

mh... although I was hoping for the token, my Bonus roll on Twins got me http://www.wowhead.com/item=94981 today.

although i am wearing http://www.wowhead.com/item=95142 atm which I guess is still better than Moonjade. but that one got such a tasty socket for a nice Exp/Hastegem and 90 Stamina socketbonus.

so... which one? stay with the Battletag or take the Moonjade?
User avatar
Schroom
 
Posts: 637
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:03 pm
Location: Luxembourg

PreviousNext

Return to Gear Discussions and Advice

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Who is online

In total there is 1 user online :: 0 registered, 0 hidden and 1 guest (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 380 on Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:28 pm

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest