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4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

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4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby KevinG81 » Mon Oct 11, 2010 10:23 am

so i have been passing on the tanking rings in icc... mainly cuz i have not seen the armor one drop yet.

i just noticed on the ptr the two rings i have Clutch of Fortification
http://www.wowhead.com/item=47731 and Band of the Twin Val'kyr
http://www.wowhead.com/item=48027


are now only with 152 armor... wtf

why would blizz do this? anyone seen any blue post, nevermind it looks like most the armor stuff that i picked up b/c it ahd armor has lost a lot of the extra armor.

Cataclysmic Chestguard
3817 Armor
+123 Strength
+207 Stamina
Yellow Socket
Blue Socket
Red Socket
Socket Bonus: +12 Stamina
Equip: Increases defense rating by 108 (21.96 @ L80).
Equip: Increases your expertise rating by 82 (10 @ L80).

switched to
Cataclysmic Chestguard
2978 Armor
+123 Strength
+207 Stamina
Yellow Socket
Blue Socket
Red Socket
Socket Bonus: +12 Stamina
Equip: Increases your dodge rating by 108 (2.39% @ L80).
Equip: Increases your expertise rating by 82 (10 @ L80).


this makes me wish i went with the teir items and picked up the drops that i passed on.
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Flex » Mon Oct 11, 2010 12:52 pm

Armor change = Making it better gear than non-armor stuff at that current tier level but not making it better gear than a tier or two down the road. ToGC10 Ring being ideal for ICC25 hard mode progression is a tad wacky.
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Koatanga » Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:37 pm

My issue is that they took the armour out but didn't increase any of the other stats to compensate.

An item of X level has Y budget for stats. Since they took stuff away and didn't add it elsewhere, this item must now be under stat budget for its ilvl.

That's not a nice thing to do for an item that a heck of a lot of us have and use.
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby KevinG81 » Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:00 pm

Koatanga wrote:My issue is that they took the armour out but didn't increase any of the other stats to compensate.



yes! exactly the issue... along with the fact that they did it to 264 gear as well.

hoping it changes by the time it goes live
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Flex » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:14 pm

If they changed how much armor costs per point of extra armor they don't have to give anything back.
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby fuzzygeek » Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:07 pm

Flex wrote:If they changed how much armor costs per point of extra armor they don't have to give anything back.


Ah, but did they? I'm assuming they have, since the armor on most items (even items without bonus armor) has also changed.

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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Barathorn » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:13 am

It has been well documented that bonus armor would be subject to change and while it will affect those of us who went the armor route [ie most of us] it is consistant across the board for all tanks to make things balanced with the new changes to stats.

It really isn't a big thing, in 7 weeks you will be replacing most of your gear anyway unless you are in ICC25 Heroic Gear and even then it won't be long before you are replacing that.

Change is good, it keeps things fresh.
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Koatanga » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:40 am

Change is good if it makes things better.

Change for the sake of change is not good.

Cata will present new challenges, new raids, etc. which is good. Nerfing armour now? Not as good. As you say, it'll all get replaecd by 85 anyway, so what does it hurt to leave the armour on it?
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby yappo » Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:11 am

Koatanga wrote:Cata will present new challenges, new raids, etc. which is good. Nerfing armour now? Not as good. As you say, it'll all get replaecd by 85 anyway, so what does it hurt to leave the armour on it?


This is just me guessing, but anyway.

Rather than making armour protect you less per point they simply reduced it across the board in order to enable starting with a clean slate. If the numbers had stayed the way they are today, then it follows naturally that level 83 - 84 blue gear (not talking item-levels but level required to equip the slot) would need bigger numbers and the first lvl 85 epics even more absurd numbers.

Now, arguably, they could just pump up the numbers and lower the actual benefit, but I don't see most of us really liking the "one ring to rule them all" -system with armour and stamina being the holy grail of stats.

While we should always give correct advice about what gear (ie stats) are best for the tankadin, that doesn't mean that we should be happy with a situation where stacking three tanking stats means you're the epitome of picking bad gear.

I for one prefer a situation where I soak less, still knowing that a back to back hit won't automatically kill me, and thus prefer to weigh the dice in my favour (stacking avoidance) without being called out for being a moron. I like chatting with my healer pre-pull in order to agree upon what damage-behaviour said healer prefers for a given fight, which translates in carrying along different gear sets that are actually different.

Ok, I'm rambling, and your mileage may vary, but there you have my take on it ;)
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Barathorn » Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:12 am

I would imagine the reason it is being changed now is so that the model Blizzard have chosen to use for this expansion stays constant from the new patch forward. That makes perfect sense to me. It enables Blizzard to make sure that they get it exactly right this time and we don't end up with Dragonarse Radience etc.

Crying foul now really doesn't achieve anything, the horse has long since bolted. Embrace the changes.
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby yappo » Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:23 am

Barathorn wrote:we don't end up with Dragonarse Radience etc.


Dragonarse Radiance:

The high temperature and sulphurous air softens all armour, giving a 20% penalty to all armour values.


Reaction: WTF!

Blizzard answer: But it's different. We didn't nerf avoidance!

Second reaction: /facepalm
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Barathorn » Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:34 am

yappo wrote:
Barathorn wrote:we don't end up with Dragonarse Radience etc.


Dragonarse Radiance:

The high temperature and sulphurous air softens all armour, giving a 20% penalty to all armour values.


Reaction: WTF!

Blizzard answer: But it's different. We didn't nerf avoidance!

Second reaction: /facepalm


You didn't label your post as a Spoiler, please do so in future :wink: .
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Feanorion » Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:53 pm

Barathorn wrote:I would imagine the reason it is being changed now is so that the model Blizzard have chosen to use for this expansion stays constant from the new patch forward. That makes perfect sense to me. It enables Blizzard to make sure that they get it exactly right this time and we don't end up with Dragonarse Radience etc.

Crying foul now really doesn't achieve anything, the horse has long since bolted. Embrace the changes.


Embrace a change that puts my armor at Ulduar levels? Screw that. Screw WoW. Screw Blizzard.
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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby fuzzygeek » Tue Oct 12, 2010 9:45 pm

Feanorion wrote:Embrace a change that puts my armor at Ulduar levels? Screw that. Screw WoW. Screw Blizzard.


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Re: 4.0 =lost armor value...WHY?

Postby Vrimmel » Wed Oct 13, 2010 4:38 am

Feanorion wrote:
Barathorn wrote:I would imagine the reason it is being changed now is so that the model Blizzard have chosen to use for this expansion stays constant from the new patch forward. That makes perfect sense to me. It enables Blizzard to make sure that they get it exactly right this time and we don't end up with Dragonarse Radience etc.

Crying foul now really doesn't achieve anything, the horse has long since bolted. Embrace the changes.


Embrace a change that puts my armor at Ulduar levels? Screw that. Screw WoW. Screw Blizzard.


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