4.2 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Get help with your character's gear

Moderators: Fridmarr, Worldie, Sabindeus, Aergis, lythac, Digren, majiben

Re: 4.0.3a Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Cosain » Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:15 pm

Thanks! OK, as a follow-up... From a Stage 3 perspective, does this put either of the crafted breastplates above (Hardened or Deathplate) Chestplate of the Steadfast and Beauty's? If possible I would love to save the JP on Steadfast and avoid relying on RNG for Beauty's. That way I can concentrate on saving for the T11 chest.

Thanks again!
Cosain
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: 4.0.3a Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby yappo » Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:20 am

Cosain wrote:Thanks! OK, as a follow-up... From a Stage 3 perspective, does this put either of the crafted breastplates above (Hardened or Deathplate) Chestplate of the Steadfast and Beauty's? If possible I would love to save the JP on Steadfast and avoid relying on RNG for Beauty's. That way I can concentrate on saving for the T11 chest.

Thanks again!


Assuming you're doing your daily random, well, daily, 'saving' JP really isn't an issue.

Theck will probably come up with some hard numbers after he's ceased steaming (he swapped from dumping numbers to venting frustrations in another thread in a way I've never seen before) about the unannounced change to HP-generation. Anyway, now when that change IS upon us, the crafted chest is no longer AS disgustingly horrible as it was before. The gem-slot, as I've stated earlier, mitigated this even further.

All in all my personal (key word 'personal') feeling is that if your gear-level has you making picks between the crafted chest and the JP one, then it's probably a toss-up right now.

As a comparision I've abstained from the crafted chest (and have since then amassed enough VP to shop the T11), but when I saw the BoE with hit-rating on the AH for 6k gold, I bought it immediately. While hit-rating is worse for handling HP-generation compared to expertise, I felt a bigger need of a tanking piece that once and for all fixed those fights where I risk having to handle interrupts while tanking. I still don't have the crafted chest, even though I am a BS and have learned the plan a long time ago.
yappo
 
Posts: 867
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:15 pm

Re: 4.0.3a Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Cosain » Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:33 am

Thanks for the help!
Cosain
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: 4.0.3a Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Dem » Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:33 pm

A lot of us have been managing on less than 3% hit to focus on damage mitigation whilst healers gear up. Even in 10 man, it's easily possible to assign dps to interrupts. Probably the most important fights for tank interrupts are Chogall (adds) and Maloriak. In both cases dps can interrupt and where they can't you have shield throw, hammer and now rebuke + arcane torrent if you're horde.

With this in mind hit rating still isn't critical if you're having survival problems and the tier chest and 4 set bonus is still very strong.
Dem
 
Posts: 76
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2008 5:39 am

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Cosain » Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:10 am

Sorry to be a pain. But I just picked up Shard of Pirouetting Happiness (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/item/68172) from the seasonal fight and reforged the Hit to Mastery. That gives it 168/252 Str/Stam along with 128 Dodge/51 Hit/34 Mastery. My question is... I now have enough justice points to get The Lustrous Eye but it seems to me that the seasonal drop is slightly better. It isn't on the list that I saw (prob due to the seasonal nature). Where does this neck fit in? Should I save the points for a diff piece?

Thanks for the help!
Cosain
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Håvard » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:25 am

Hey, correct me if I'm wrong, but I haven't seen any mention here of the TB commendation axe added in 4.06:

[Darkheart Hacker]

Imo it seems to be a direct upgrade to the Twilight Highlands quest mace, and a logical next step for people who don't want to wait for particular drops.
Havard, 80 Blood Elf Paladin, US Moon Guard
Håvard, 60 Human Paladin, US Moon Guard
Håvard
 
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Digren » Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:03 pm

Cosain wrote:Sorry to be a pain. But I just picked up Shard of Pirouetting Happiness (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/item/68172) from the seasonal fight and reforged the Hit to Mastery. That gives it 168/252 Str/Stam along with 128 Dodge/51 Hit/34 Mastery. My question is... I now have enough justice points to get The Lustrous Eye but it seems to me that the seasonal drop is slightly better. It isn't on the list that I saw (prob due to the seasonal nature). Where does this neck fit in? Should I save the points for a diff piece?

Thanks for the help!

Now that it drops I need to put it back on the list. It falls right around the Elementium Guardian or Mountain's Mouth - i.e. tied for second place.
User avatar
Digren
Moderator
 
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:41 pm

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Cosain » Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:35 pm

Thanks! I'll save my JP for the Chest then...
Cosain
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: 4.0.3a Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby 99sitr » Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:20 pm

Dem wrote:A lot of us have been managing on less than 3% hit to focus on damage mitigation whilst healers gear up. Even in 10 man, it's easily possible to assign dps to interrupts. Probably the most important fights for tank interrupts are Chogall (adds) and Maloriak. In both cases dps can interrupt and where they can't you have shield throw, hammer and now rebuke + arcane torrent if you're horde.

With this in mind hit rating still isn't critical if you're having survival problems and the tier chest and 4 set bonus is still very strong.



If I recall correctly Hammer of Justice no longer interrupts npc's that are immune to stun. This was changed when Blizzard gave us Rebuke in 4.0.6.
99sitr
 
Posts: 36
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 11:55 am

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby th3m » Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:07 pm

Digren what do you think of Tia's Grace Trinket?

http://www.wowhead.com/item=56394

Provides good junk of mastery, and you have like constant 340 agility up.
I think it should be somewhere in the list :D
th3m
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 6:55 pm

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby econ21 » Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:26 am

th3m wrote:Digren what do you think of Tia's Grace Trinket?


I am not Digren, but to chime in - I think it's a wonderful trinket. The 10 stacks of agility work out at around 1% dodge and as you say, in practice, they are effectively up all the time. It's very close to the best 346 trinket for melee damage reduction and I suspect it may be the best of all trinkets for constant CTC. (You may get more on average from trinkets that have proc or on use features, but I think with CTC constant uptime is particularly important - the whole point is to avoid damage spikes.)

I use it for my default 5 man gear, where I place a premium on CTC. For raiding, I would tend to use a stamina trinket and the stamina/resistance one from TB. But if I were ever to get into spitting distance of 102.4% CTC, I would be using this.
econ21
 
Posts: 1217
Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2008 8:53 am

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Digren » Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:20 am

th3m wrote:Digren what do you think of Tia's Grace Trinket?

http://www.wowhead.com/item=56394

Provides good junk of mastery, and you have like constant 340 agility up.
I think it should be somewhere in the list :D

It's a good trinket. Non-alchemists should be carrying it to end game, where it can be used along side a Baradin's trinket in a CTC-focused gear set. As I recommend one mastery and one stamina trinket in a "typical" base set, non-alchemists should see it just behind the Baradin's mastery option(s) as next best in slot.
User avatar
Digren
Moderator
 
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:41 pm

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Digren » Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:19 pm

Ok, with Chardev working, I've created models for gear at every stage. All that are missing are a few threat models (showing how a survival set can be turned into a threat set by substituting a few key pieces) and maybe a block-capped model for stage five end-game.

I welcome feedback and bug corrections.
User avatar
Digren
Moderator
 
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:41 pm

Re: Tank Stage 3: Geared to Start Raiding

Postby Gaxby » Sun Feb 20, 2011 4:32 am

Digren wrote:Threat (Expertise Rating)

[Left Eye of Rajh] : Expertise + Avoidance : Halls of Origination (Heroic) Rajh
[Magnetite Mirror] : Expertise + Threat : The Stonecore (Heroic) High Priestess Azil
[Left Eye of Rajh] : Expertise + Avoidance : Halls of Origination (Normal) Rajh


You listed Left Eye of Rajh twice at the end of the Stage 3 Tank section.
Gaxby, Energizer Pally of Grim Batol
User avatar
Gaxby
 
Posts: 76
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 4:31 am

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Syncognition » Sun Feb 20, 2011 10:43 am

He listed the normal and heroic versions.
Syncognition
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Mon Jul 05, 2010 2:32 pm

Re: Tank Stage 5: Heroic Raider

Postby Marblehead » Sun Feb 20, 2011 11:36 am

Digren wrote:Neck
    1. [Ironstar Amulet] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Atramedes
    2. [Don Rodrigo's Fabulous Necklace] : BoE Dungeon Drop
    3. [Necklace of Strife] : The Bastion of Twilight () Valiona
    4. [Rage of Ages] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Nefarian

    Digren says, "Unlike the normal version, the heroic Ironstar Amulet is best in class. That said, the Don supplied a close second choice for the rich and unlucky."

I don't understand the ranking here. I'll use Digren's methodology.

Code: Select all
                             Str    Sta    Dodge   Mas   Hit   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)     163    322     215          109
Rage of Ages (Heroic)        215    322            143   143 


Stamina is the same. Subtracting strength.

Code: Select all
                             Str    Dodge   Mas   Hit   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)             215          109
Rage of Ages (Heroic)         52            143   143 


Reforging dodge to mastery on Ironstar, cause it provides more CTC than reforging the hit, since hit is less than 55% of dodge. Reforging hit to dodge on Rage.

Code: Select all
                             Str    Dodge   Mas   Hit   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)             129     86   109
Rage of Ages (Heroic)         52      57    143    86 


Subtracting common values. Converting strength to parry to dodge. Discarding hit as irrelevant with survivability.

Code: Select all
                             Dodge   Mas   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)       72       
Rage of Ages (Heroic)          13     57 


Subtracting again.

Code: Select all
                             Dodge   Mas   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)       59       
Rage of Ages (Heroic)                 57 


Using Digren's assumptions, it should take around 45 mastery rating to equal the damage reduction potential of 59 dodge rating for heroic raiders.

Code: Select all
                             Mas   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)      45 ish 
Rage of Ages (Heroic)         57 


As I see it, Rage of Ages is better than Ironstar Amulet, yet they rank 4th and 1st respectively. Am I missing something here?
Image
Life is not difficult, people are.
User avatar
Marblehead
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 9:28 pm
Location: Bloodhoof (EU)

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby inthedrops » Sun Feb 20, 2011 1:28 pm

Probably the reforge of dodge to mastery is the issue. Here's a breakdown converting the hit on the Ironstar Amulet into mastery instead of the dodge.

Note: I'm totally not a math person so check my work.

Code: Select all
                             Str    Sta    Dodge   Mas   Hit   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)     163    322     215          109
Rage of Ages (Heroic)        215    322            143   143 
------------------------------------------------------------
                             Str    Dodge   Mas   Hit   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)             215          109
Rage of Ages (Heroic)         52            143   143
------------------------------------------------------------
                             Str    Dodge   Mas   Hit   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)             215     44    65
Rage of Ages (Heroic)         52      57    143    86 
------------------------------------------------------------
                             Dodge   Mas   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)       158           
Rage of Ages (Heroic)           13    99 
------------------------------------------------------------
                             Dodge   Mas   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)       145           
Rage of Ages (Heroic)                 99
------------------------------------------------------------
                             Dodge   Mas   
Ironstar Amulet (Heroic)              110 ish           
Rage of Ages (Heroic)                 99
------------------------------------------------------------


If this is correct, then I'm going to remember this as an argument to a huge pet peeve I have with tanks ignoring avoidance for "Combat Table Coverage".
inthedrops
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 639
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 9:19 am

Re: Tank Stage 5: Heroic Raider

Postby Treck » Sun Feb 20, 2011 2:43 pm

Digren wrote:Tank Stage 5: Heroic Raider

T11.5 gear requires an Essence of the Forlorn token, which is used to buy a slot-specific token from the Valorous quartermaster.

Essence of the Forlorn only drops from alakir, and can be used to buy the t11 372 parts (all 5)
Legs/Gloves/chest/Head/shoulders are all specific tokendrops that drop from the same bosses each week, where the legs/gloves/chest require the lower lvl tier part to allready have been obtained (this goes even if your using an Essence of the Forlorn), while head/shoulders doesnt require you to have them.
(Drops from Maloriak, Magmaw, Halfus, Nefarian and Chogall, in that order)


Digren wrote:
    Head
      1. [Daybreak Helm] : Bastion of Twilight (Heroic) Valonia
      2. [Dragon Bone Warhelm] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Maloriak

      Digren says, "Like its normal cousin, the heroic tier helm wastes too much itemization in threat to top a list of survival gear. After a buff in 4.0.6 the Daybreak Helm is clearly best in slot."

0.8% avoidance vs 1% block, sure its a win, but clearly? I wouldnt say so.


Digren wrote:Neck
    1. [Ironstar Amulet] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Atramedes

    Digren says, "Unlike the normal version, the heroic Ironstar Amulet is best in class. That said, the Don supplied a close second choice for the rich and unlucky."

Your forgetting [Caekestraz's Will] Clearly BiS. Think its BiS for most str dps classes aswell.

Digren wrote:Feet
    1. [Molten Tantrum Boots] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Magmaw
    2. [Gryphon Rider's Boots] / [Boots of Sullen Rock] : Wildhammer Clan / Dragonmaw Clan (Exalted)

    Digren says, "Only one set beat the durable faction boots"

What about these 2 then?
[War-Torn Crushers]
[Massacre Threads]
War-Torn is BiS, and Massacre is worth atleast a spot next to Gryphon Riders.


Digren wrote:Weapon
Survivability
    [Mace of Acrid Death] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Maloriak
Threat
    [Mace of Acrid Death] : ?Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Maloriak
Mixed Survivability / Threat
    [Mace of Acrid Death] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Maloriak

Fix't

All in all i think your valuing stamina to low.
Sta might not make you take less dmg, but it will make you survive most shit better than going all out for mastery.
166k hp is sometimes to low for comfort in heroic raids imo.
Taking as little damage as possible might be more of an approach if your doing hardmodes months behind everyone else, but when your faced with a new boss you have no clue about, sta is imo the best way to make sure you survive as long as possible.
User avatar
Treck
 
Posts: 1431
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:10 am

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Marblehead » Sun Feb 20, 2011 4:32 pm

inthedrops wrote:If this is correct, then I'm going to remember this as an argument to a huge pet peeve I have with tanks ignoring avoidance for "Combat Table Coverage".

You're correct. I see it now. While Rage of Ages provides more CTC, Ironstar Amulet provides more damage reduction if reforged from hit to mastery.

However, this raises the question of whether going for more damage reduction is more efficient than getting block capped, thus normalizing damage intake. I don't know if this is an appropriate thread to discuss that though, and probably both sides of the argument have many supporters which comes down to a matter of personal preference, like the stamina vs. mastery debate.
Image
Life is not difficult, people are.
User avatar
Marblehead
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 9:28 pm
Location: Bloodhoof (EU)

Re: Tank Stage 5: Heroic Raider

Postby Digren » Sun Feb 20, 2011 5:16 pm

Marblehead wrote:Reforging dodge to mastery on Ironstar, cause it provides more CTC than reforging the hit, since hit is less than 55% of dodge.
As I see it, Rage of Ages is better than Ironstar Amulet, yet they rank 4th and 1st respectively. Am I missing something here?

My ratings are for maximum damage reduction, not combat table coverage. Always convert the threat stat. That switches the order.
User avatar
Digren
Moderator
 
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:41 pm

Re: Tank Stage 5: Heroic Raider

Postby Digren » Sun Feb 20, 2011 5:34 pm

Treck wrote:
Digren wrote:[1. [Daybreak Helm] : Bastion of Twilight (Heroic) Valonia
2. [Dragon Bone Warhelm] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Maloriak

Digren says, "Like its normal cousin, the heroic tier helm wastes too much itemization in threat to top a list of survival gear. After a buff in 4.0.6 the Daybreak Helm is clearly best in slot."

0.8% avoidance vs 1% block, sure its a win, but clearly? I wouldnt say so.

I see them as:
Code: Select all
Item                          Armor   Strength   Stamina   Parry   Expertise    Mastery
Daybreak Helm (Heroic)        2891    325        653       257                  247
Dragon Bone Warhelm (Heroic)  2891    293        698       20      81           379

including non-meta gems, gem bonuses, and reforging.

Wiping common stats, converting extra strength to parry, dropping value-less threat:
Code: Select all
Item                          Stamina   Parry   Mastery
Daybreak Helm (Heroic)                  245                 
Dragon Bone Warhelm (Heroic)  45                132

Previously the two were tied, and my comment reflected that. The 4.0.6 buff made one of them measurably better so I updated the ranking. I agree, though, that the difference between first and second in this slot remains smaller than in other slots. I'll adjust the comment.
User avatar
Digren
Moderator
 
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:41 pm

Re: 4.0.6 Tank Stages and Cataclysm Gear Guide

Postby Digren » Sun Feb 20, 2011 5:42 pm

Marblehead wrote:
inthedrops wrote:If this is correct, then I'm going to remember this as an argument to a huge pet peeve I have with tanks ignoring avoidance for "Combat Table Coverage".

You're correct. I see it now. While Rage of Ages provides more CTC, Ironstar Amulet provides more damage reduction if reforged from hit to mastery.

However, this raises the question of whether going for more damage reduction is more efficient than getting block capped, thus normalizing damage intake. I don't know if this is an appropriate thread to discuss that though, and probably both sides of the argument have many supporters which comes down to a matter of personal preference, like the stamina vs. mastery debate.

Personally, I'd love to see a block cap set. I tried to build one in Chardev yesterday and just couldn't do it. Please take a look at my stage five model and suggest changes. What unbuffed ctc is needed to hit the cap?

The rankings use a consistent formula for gear from stage 1 through 5. However, if stage five players have a completely different ranking method due to the ability to block cap, I can accommodate that. (Though, to be honest, almost no one ever comments on my end-game gear rankings. I usually assume this is because most people wearing heroic gear can figure out what they want to wear without the help of a guide, so my guide goes mostly unread.)

I think Vexryn's gear list is based on CTC over MDR. He certainly has some things ranked differently, including these neck items. So both options are available in guide form. :D
User avatar
Digren
Moderator
 
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:41 pm

Re: Tank Stage 5: Heroic Raider

Postby Digren » Sun Feb 20, 2011 5:49 pm

Treck wrote:
Digren wrote:Neck
    1. [Ironstar Amulet] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Atramedes

    Digren says, "Unlike the normal version, the heroic Ironstar Amulet is best in class. That said, the Don supplied a close second choice for the rich and unlucky."

Your forgetting [Caekestraz's Will] Clearly BiS. Think its BiS for most str dps classes aswell.

Digren wrote:Feet
    1. [Molten Tantrum Boots] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Magmaw
    2. [Gryphon Rider's Boots] / [Boots of Sullen Rock] : Wildhammer Clan / Dragonmaw Clan (Exalted)

    Digren says, "Only one set beat the durable faction boots"

What about these 2 then?
[War-Torn Crushers]
[Massacre Threads]
War-Torn is BiS, and Massacre is worth atleast a spot next to Gryphon Riders.


Digren wrote:Weapon
Survivability
    [Mace of Acrid Death] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Maloriak
Threat
    [Mace of Acrid Death] : ?Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Maloriak
Mixed Survivability / Threat
    [Mace of Acrid Death] : Blackwing Descent (Heroic) Maloriak
[/list]

Fix't


Looks like I have some missing stuff to include. I'll get them in there. Thanks!

All in all i think your valuing stamina to low.
Sta might not make you take less dmg, but it will make you survive most shit better than going all out for mastery.
166k hp is sometimes to low for comfort in heroic raids imo.
Taking as little damage as possible might be more of an approach if your doing hardmodes months behind everyone else, but when your faced with a new boss you have no clue about, sta is imo the best way to make sure you survive as long as possible.

This is a good point. A lot of the consensus on Maintankadin has been that mastery is way better than stamina. This is even stronger on Tankspot. There, the recommendations are for paladins to use pure mastery gems in yellow slots, mastery/sta in blue, and parry/mastery in red.

I don't go that deeply into mastery. I think you'll find that my guide values stamina more than the other guides here. That's because I use mastery/sta gems in both blue and yellow slots, and parry/stamina in red. Value wise, I rate one point of stamina as the equivalent to 0.7 points of mastery. Does that still leave stamina too low? Maybe. A recent thread here noted that a lot of end game tanks are very heavy into stamina, much moreso than was predicted given the theory calculations.

On the other hand, the posts just above your were discussing how I rank mastery too low, because my guide doesn't recommend people reach the block cap. Do you aim for the block cap as a way to ensure damage reduction? Why did you pick stamina stacking over that?

I'm obviously not an end-game tank. I'm just willing to maintain a guide. :) I'd like to hear more opinions about this from heroic raiders to see where they stand.

Thanks!
User avatar
Digren
Moderator
 
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:41 pm

Re: Tank Stage 5: Heroic Raider

Postby Digren » Sun Feb 20, 2011 5:55 pm

Treck wrote:166k hp is sometimes to low for comfort in heroic raids imo.
Taking as little damage as possible might be more of an approach if your doing hardmodes months behind everyone else, but when your faced with a new boss you have no clue about, sta is imo the best way to make sure you survive as long as possible.

For a point of comparison, I see that your (actual, not model) stamina is 177k and your combat table coverage is about 87.6% unbuffed. From that to my model (166k, 92.2%) is as little as a single trinket swap, so really I don't think our models are all that different. If you have a model that points out your end-game goals, I'd love to look at it.

Thanks!
User avatar
Digren
Moderator
 
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:41 pm

Re: Tank Stage 5: Heroic Raider

Postby Treck » Mon Feb 21, 2011 5:49 am

Digren wrote:Do you aim for the block cap as a way to ensure damage reduction? Why did you pick stamina stacking over that?

While block capping is awesome for reducing dmg taken, i dont find it all that neccesary to mindlessly stack for.
During our progression the healers noticed that pure mastery gemming was a bit more unpredictable when healing (due to aoe effects leaving you lower than otherwise).
They mainly wanted a bigger buffert to heal, rather than me taking less dmg.
Its not ofthen your not topped up still pretty fast as a tank, and while healers might leave you hanging on about 70% or so when they are conserving mana, they still want 70% to be as high as possible.
Block capping yourself would make you a pretty easy target to heal on bosses that do exclusivly meele hits, but even without blockcapping, you wouldnt be that hard to heal eather.
Theres been few tankdeaths that i can remember that have only been hit after hit after hit, without a dangerous other component.

This was done before progress was over, and with a lot less gear than i currently have, im could try next reset with all out mastery and see if my healers like it or not.

This has a lot to do with the healers, and obviously every healingteam is not the same, making "my" way of gearing less attractive to some others with different healers.
And i wouldnt be suprised if block capping might be a lot higher prio in 10man than 25man, since those healing teams are a lot different in different sizes.

Also keep in mind, Gearing isnt really doesnt make that much of a differance these days imo.
You can survive very well with pretty much whatever your using, gear is of pretty low prio for tanks as of now (we gave dpsers and healers prio on gear over tanks, and tanks basicly took up whatever was left for us since their gear mattered a lot more on their performance than ours did)
If you die, most times its cuz of you lacking a CD, with that CD, you might have survived, but without it, it wouldnt really matter if your stacking stamina or mastery, you would most likely be dead in any case.


Digren wrote:
Treck wrote:166k hp is sometimes to low for comfort in heroic raids imo.
Taking as little damage as possible might be more of an approach if your doing hardmodes months behind everyone else, but when your faced with a new boss you have no clue about, sta is imo the best way to make sure you survive as long as possible.

For a point of comparison, I see that your (actual, not model) stamina is 177k and your combat table coverage is about 87.6% unbuffed. From that to my model (166k, 92.2%) is as little as a single trinket swap, so really I don't think our models are all that different. If you have a model that points out your end-game goals, I'd love to look at it.

Thanks!

Id love to hear some comments from the other endgame tanks aswell, but during progress we all keep to ourselves xD

Actually, i dont useually run with the baradin hold trinket.
For 9/13 bosses i run with the Valiona trinket, giving me about 187k hp with CTC of 83%ish.
And obviously the BH trinket is nice with its mastery, but even without all that mastery id still use it over any other trinket for the last remaining fights, beeing Alakir, Nefarian, Chogall and Sinestra, just cuz of the nature of those fights.
That trinket ensures survival on those fights like no other trinket
User avatar
Treck
 
Posts: 1431
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:10 am

PreviousNext

Return to Gear Discussions and Advice

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 1 guest

Who is online

In total there are 2 users online :: 1 registered, 0 hidden and 1 guest (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 380 on Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:28 pm

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 1 guest