Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

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Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

Postby Serinia » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:48 pm

Hi, I have been a prot pally for bc, and been mostly ret for wotlk however I have been building up my prot set and lately almost every gem combination I get from RAWR has been a combination of agility. Another paladin laughed at me saying pallys dont need agility your bad etc... I know I could gem all stam like the old days but can someone please explain why rawr is choosing gems like

+20 agil, +15 stam/+10 agil, +def/stam Its not like I am undercapped in defense at all I am stacked around 595 right now. I guess people want to see tanks with 50K+ HP and not lesser but have a ton of mitigation. Basically your looked at like being a undergear pally if you dont have a ton of HP.

I just want to know anyone experienced with rawr know why it seems to choose a ton of agil / defense lately, did I miss a patch or something? Did some mechanic change? When I use rawr I almost always choose overall as I dont have 3 sets of gear for survival, mit, threat.

My gear is on me right now, including the gems mostly on the advice of RAWR. In the past it was hit the DEF cap and then stack stam til the cows come home.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... &n=Serinia
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Re: Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

Postby Epimer » Tue Mar 30, 2010 2:17 pm

Rawr is an excellent tool for optimising DPS, but is (certainly on default settings) a bit iffy for tanking. You have to be very careful on how you configure it and understand what it's telling you in relation to the parameters and options you've put in. Or you can just not use it for anything other than DPS toons, which is what I choose to do :)
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Re: Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

Postby Fridmarr » Tue Mar 30, 2010 2:28 pm

Serinia wrote:Hi, I have been a prot pally for bc, and been mostly ret for wotlk however I have been building up my prot set and lately almost every gem combination I get from RAWR has been a combination of agility. Another paladin laughed at me saying pallys dont need agility your bad etc... I know I could gem all stam like the old days but can someone please explain why rawr is choosing gems like

+20 agil, +15 stam/+10 agil, +def/stam Its not like I am undercapped in defense at all I am stacked around 595 right now. I guess people want to see tanks with 50K+ HP and not lesser but have a ton of mitigation. Basically your looked at like being a undergear pally if you dont have a ton of HP.

I just want to know anyone experienced with rawr know why it seems to choose a ton of agil / defense lately, did I miss a patch or something? Did some mechanic change? When I use rawr I almost always choose overall as I dont have 3 sets of gear for survival, mit, threat.

My gear is on me right now, including the gems mostly on the advice of RAWR. In the past it was hit the DEF cap and then stack stam til the cows come home.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... &n=Serinia
Agility gives dodge, armor, and crit so it can be weighted a bit more than expected, especially when you are looking at it purely from a mitigation perspective and Rawr is also weighing in with threat. I use agility/stam gems to meet my meta requirement or on red sockets where the bonus is a decent amount of stamina, the rest are pretty much all stamina.

While Agi doesn't provide as much raw dodge, as dodge rating, it does have those other benefits which to me makes it a very slightly better option. There was also quite a long thread here with some calculations on agi vs dodge, your friend may find it an interesting and educational read.
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Re: Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

Postby blakk » Tue Mar 30, 2010 2:53 pm

Serinia wrote:Hi, I have been a prot pally for bc, and been mostly ret for wotlk however I have been building up my prot set and lately almost every gem combination I get from RAWR has been a combination of agility. Another paladin laughed at me saying pallys dont need agility your bad etc... I know I could gem all stam like the old days but can someone please explain why rawr is choosing gems like

+20 agil, +15 stam/+10 agil, +def/stam Its not like I am undercapped in defense at all I am stacked around 595 right now. I guess people want to see tanks with 50K+ HP and not lesser but have a ton of mitigation. Basically your looked at like being a undergear pally if you dont have a ton of HP.

I just want to know anyone experienced with rawr know why it seems to choose a ton of agil / defense lately, did I miss a patch or something? Did some mechanic change? When I use rawr I almost always choose overall as I dont have 3 sets of gear for survival, mit, threat.

My gear is on me right now, including the gems mostly on the advice of RAWR. In the past it was hit the DEF cap and then stack stam til the cows come home.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... &n=Serinia

you should use the mitigation and threat sliders on the settings page to make survivability more prominent. i have threat at 0 and mitigation at about 35 or so and it tells me to socket for 9 stam bonuses which is what i like to do.
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Re: Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

Postby Digren » Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:34 pm

blakk wrote:you should use the mitigation and threat sliders on the settings page to make survivability more prominent. i have threat at 0 and mitigation at about 35 or so and it tells me to socket for 9 stam bonuses which is what i like to do.

That's the most succinct advice for using Rawr for tank gems I've ever seen.

Most of the time I just tell people "it's awful, don't use it" or "it takes a lot of tweaking to make it work for tanks". And yet, this never stops people from using it. Telling people how to use it might be more successful.
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Re: Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

Postby blakk » Tue Mar 30, 2010 6:21 pm

I don't use it I just know how luls
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Re: Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

Postby Dantriges » Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:01 am

Could be that the option for propose gems in right color for socket bonuses is active.
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Re: Rawr suggesting alot of agil / over cap defense lately

Postby æ » Wed Mar 31, 2010 5:35 pm

Epimer wrote:Rawr is an excellent tool for optimising DPS, but is (certainly on default settings) a bit iffy for tanking. You have to be very careful on how you configure it and understand what it's telling you in relation to the parameters and options you've put in. Or you can just not use it for anything other than DPS toons, which is what I choose to do :)


There is nothing wrong with RAWRS prot model aside from a bug here and there that should be reported. The problem is not RAWR at all. It is a tool that gives a nice front-end to many many formula.

The issue is people that use that tool. They look at Agi and are wide-eyes at the longer bar, ignoring that is is cut up into sections. If they are going to let simple stuff like that get by when doing an analysis, then what other more subtle things did they miss?

Dont blame the tool.
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