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ICC10: What to wear and why!

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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby Shathus » Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:48 am

Harven wrote:
No he's serious about this. It really gets kind of scary sometimes when he's running and the healers are working hard to keep him up but he swears by his SB set and has been griping over the lack of good SB pieces in ICC and ToC. I mention using an EH set and his response is often "what do we look like warriors?" and makes me want to bang my head on my keyboard.

Hell I've MT'd Anub in HM ToC in my EH set and I'm still less squishier than he is according to the healers.


I've been there. It took until ToGC for him to realize his survivability was a problem since healers were still able to keep him up during Uld/ToC.

Just to play a little devil's advocate, while I certainly don't agree with using 213-226 gear in ICC, just because it has block on it, using some of the 232-245 gear from the T9 tier isn't all bad either. While the Gunship10 shield has more stam and str than the ToC25 BV shield, because of all the physical damage going around, if you DO block, the BV from the shield isn't too bad either. 200 off a 10k hit is 2% reduction and can add up to be non-trivial over the fight. Looking at a parse from Saurfang 25 awhile back, me (stacking armor and stam with like 1300 BV) took about 1k+ less damage per unblocked hit than the other tank. However, when I factored in attacks that were blocked as well, average damage taken was actually pretty close. He was probably closer to 2100 BV at the time I think (plus a BV libram).

So, while you are subject to RNG in your blocks, awhile things like HP and armor are constant, over the course of a fight to does add up. I just wouldn't go out of the way to get the stat.

TL:DR; yah, he's still bad, but the stats on the whole aren't horrible, just how he's going about getting them.
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby Harven » Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:45 pm

Thanks for the replies everyone. I appreciate it.
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby Eneroth » Thu Feb 18, 2010 2:06 pm

Hello,

I just realy wanted to tahnk you for all the hard work in this thread. I just came back about twor or so months ago after my friend asked me to come back. Long story short I am glad that I am playing my paladin again. He was my main in all of BC, then forced to change over for a while.

Well anyways, most of my drops come from 10man ICC, I do get some from 25man, but the guild I am in is finnaly starting to set foot in there with having to bench some really bad players in the guild.

But as it goes, I am looking for my next set of upgrades, and I am really looking into getting the Kraken next as that seems like the biggest upgrade I can find. What I have to say I don't see anyting overly wonderful with the T10 sets bonus for us. Here is a link to my toon right now and his gear..

http://wow-heroes.com/index.php?zone=us&server=Baelgun&name=eneroth

So as you can see I do have the 25man ICC helm, but the rest of my gear comes from 10man ICC, with some t9 gear in there I am looking to upgrade.

After I get the gloves, I am thinking of picking up the t10 chest, since then I rather get the legs from Saurfang in 10man. I just hate the idea of having to wear a dress, and I am thinking I will just have the two set t10 bonus. The badge or drop gear is just so much better then the t10 gear.

Thanks in advance, and it's been a while since I really sat down to read some of the threads here.
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby agetro » Thu Feb 18, 2010 3:12 pm

Hey all. Just wanted to post a little here. I seem to be going on the right path as above. I'm thinking of saving up for the boots or leggings while going after the Frost Emblem stuff. Right now I got the Cloak, Belt, Bracers, Ring, and I'm going after the Trinket next. I'm still waiting on the necklace, weapon, shield and other ring to drop though; still no luck :( Here's my armory. Agetro

I had a question. I noticed when I plugged in the gear into the wowhead tool it shows to have about 155 hit. Is that good enough to be running around ICC10 and up? Right now I'm sitting at 162 hit and I've missed a couple times when having to taunt to switch between tanks; it happened with the Lady Deathwhisper. I'd hate for it to happen when going after the plague bosses. I was considering changing some gear around so I can max out at 263, but I would hate to lower my stamina. Do I just have bad luck? Or maybe should I gem for hit?
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby Lieris » Thu Feb 18, 2010 6:32 pm

Eneroth wrote:Hello,

I just realy wanted to tahnk you for all the hard work in this thread. I just came back about twor or so months ago after my friend asked me to come back. Long story short I am glad that I am playing my paladin again. He was my main in all of BC, then forced to change over for a while.


You are very welcome fellow Dexter fan. :)

Agetro wrote:Hey all. Just wanted to post a little here. I seem to be going on the right path as above. I'm thinking of saving up for the boots or leggings while going after the Frost Emblem stuff. Right now I got the Cloak, Belt, Bracers, Ring, and I'm going after the Trinket next. I'm still waiting on the necklace, weapon, shield and other ring to drop though; still no luck :( Here's my armory. Agetro

I had a question. I noticed when I plugged in the gear into the wowhead tool it shows to have about 155 hit. Is that good enough to be running around ICC10 and up? Right now I'm sitting at 162 hit and I've missed a couple times when having to taunt to switch between tanks; it happened with the Lady Deathwhisper. I'd hate for it to happen when going after the plague bosses. I was considering changing some gear around so I can max out at 263, but I would hate to lower my stamina. Do I just have bad luck? Or maybe should I gem for hit?


155 hit is plenty, we have 2 taunts available to us in case the first resists and if it's really making you anxious you can always glyph for it. Hit really should be a non-factor in your gearing choices, it's nice to have but you should never gem for it. On some level you've got to accept that taunt resists happen to all tanks (albeit rarely), you can do things to minimise them but sometimes you just get unlucky. Thems the breaks.
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby agetro » Thu Feb 18, 2010 9:32 pm

you talkin about RD? what glyph. thanks for info btw :)
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby Lieris » Fri Feb 19, 2010 7:17 am

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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby Kaelandros » Fri Feb 19, 2010 11:55 am

I could use some help here. My guild only raids 10 man, but I've been fortunate enough to find a few PuGs to pick up a 264 piece here and there. Last night the Boneguard Commander's Pauldrons dropped for me, which was clearly an upgrade over my Liadrin's Shoulderguards of Conquest. However, I am now faced with a choice. My intention had been to get the tier shoulders and helm for the two set bonus, but with these offset shoulders now in my possession I feel like I should probably get either the tier gloves/legs/chest to still have the two set bonus. I've compared the tier pieces with the cata chest, the kraken gauntlets, and the pillars, but I just can't decide which is the least amount of sacrifice.

Any thoughts?
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby theckhd » Fri Feb 19, 2010 11:57 am

I would say the 264 Gloves are the "next best" option. Chest is slightly behind that due to the lack of defense, and legs are behind that due to the lack of armor.
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby Kaelandros » Fri Feb 19, 2010 12:48 pm

Thanks for the reply theck!

However, I wouldn't be looking at the 264 pieces, I'd be looking at the 251 pieces as my guild is raiding 10s and I'm not very likely to see a mark of sanctification anytime soon.
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby theckhd » Fri Feb 19, 2010 1:45 pm

Kaelandros wrote:Thanks for the reply theck!

However, I wouldn't be looking at the 264 pieces, I'd be looking at the 251 pieces as my guild is raiding 10s and I'm not very likely to see a mark of sanctification anytime soon.

Oh, right, ICC10 thread. Oops.

Assuming you were going with Cat/Pillars/Kraken before, then I'd still say the gloves are the weak link. Legs lose you 1k armor. Gloves lose you 197 armor and 9 stam (and 39 STR). Chest loses you 227 armor and 16 stamina, though you actually gain 21 STR in the process.

This comparison may be helpful if you want to look at other stats.
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby sabedoriaclark » Wed Feb 24, 2010 3:43 pm

It's subject to RNG of course, but it recently occurred to me that it would be possible for a 10man raider like myself to PuG VoA25 and end up with the 264 legs and gloves. They are not strictly better than Pillars/Kraken, but it would open up the possibility of 4pc T10 with 251 shoulders & head. It is the only way I'm likely to end up with 4pc T10 since I'm not spending frost emblems on 251 gear with 264 gear available in that slot.

The downside of this is that you end up a hideous mongrel with the reddish 264 skirt and gloves, clashing with your green helm & shoulders. Add in the WWF Verdigris Chain Belt and you've got quite an obnoxious looking ensemble.
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby johnsonitis » Fri Feb 26, 2010 4:36 pm

Would the http://www.wowhead.com/?item=49475 be as good as the Triumph badge helm? It has more Stamina on it?
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby bldavis » Fri Feb 26, 2010 4:47 pm

http://www.wowhead.com/?compare=49475.0.3842.0.41380.40119;48634.0.3842.0.41380.40130

this is how i would gem/enchant them for EH
to me it looks like the judgement helm does come off as better with +57 stam and +84 armor, along with some avoidence
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Re: ICC10: What to wear and why!

Postby grafte » Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:37 am

I just wanted to comment on the Block Value(BV) discussion that was going on earlier. I made a BV set that I used a lot for ToC and ToGC until ICC10 and 25 gear finally compelled me to get out of it. When the trinket procced and with full raid buffs HoC and Kings/salv it topped out at about 4300 BV. It knocked ToGC 10 Anub'arak's damage consistently down to 16000-17000 per hit after the block is taken in to account. My calculation show that I was taking 19% to 21% less damage on every single physical damage hit.

EH was my secondary gearing, and also what I gemmed for entirely given strengths poor translation to BV. Using this system, I still had 51000 raid buffed hp (without CS/BP, we had no locks or warriors). I tanked every boss in TOGC 10 with this setup, including tanking both Valkeryie on the Twin Valkyr fight and we got regular Tribute to Insanity. Certainly the raid as a whole should be given credit for these achievements, and the healers did a great job. But the healers, who also all have regular 25 mans, all said I was by far the easiest tank to heal.

I think that when gauging a gear set its important to realize the effects of the gear as a whole. For example that level of block value had a trade off value, it cost me about 10% avoidance stats and about 1500 hit points. I felt this was worthwhile because I was trading 10% possible avoidance on each hit for 20% guaranteed mitigation. I also took in to account that I was guarenteed to always get hit at least 3 times before the damage could kill me. I was assured of getting at least 3 blocks before I died from full HP, thus the BV added its value 3 times minimum to my EH. I am also using heroic Anub as an example because he is pretty much the hardest hitting mob pre ICC.

Now as to why I switch now, it is less because the mobs hit significantly harder in ICC, there are few mobs in regular ICC 10 that hit much harder than Anub. It is a matter of the items in ICC10 having enough item points in other places to outweigh the BV. Where as before I was sacrificing 1500hp and 10% mitigation, now the hp difference is more like 4k and the mitigation is much higher, especially with the 20% dodge nerf in ICC. I also fully expect hard modes bosses to hit hard enough that 4k BV will not be that significant a reduction. For ICC I am still gearing Sta explicitly, but now trying to get armor in bunches for guaranteed damage reduction.
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