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[Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Ret, Holy, PVP, etc

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[Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Isetnefret » Mon Aug 10, 2009 6:50 am

How exactly does this work?


I have a mix of 7, 7.5, and 8 holy gear, enough to make a full set with Ulduar-worthy stats.

Do I just don this in my standard prot tanking spec?
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Jasari » Mon Aug 10, 2009 6:59 am

Here's the spec I use: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#sxudxhZxGzAruMhssufb:Rbj

It's awesome in PvP, particularly the arena because you have ridiculous survivability an can put really good pressure between 20sec HoJ and a powerful, silencing, slowing AS. Ideally you have 4pc T8 with the rest of the slots filled in with PvP gear but it works well even if you don't have access to that.

The idea is basically that you keep pressure on the other team's healer with AS and HoJ and help finish off DPS with HoW. Generally, bless BoSanc, especially if they put a pet on you and seal wisdom and you'll never go oom.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Joanadark » Mon Aug 10, 2009 8:16 am

You might be thinking about the Touched by the Light spec that theres been a lot of (imo too much) talk about on EJ lately and some testing in raid settings.

Basically the concept is the spec compensates for all the efficiency and longevity losses Holy recieved in the patch.

The TbtL spec is essentially a FoL spec, and follows all the same rules for FoL builds tested in the past.
You stack spell power to the exclusion of all else. Gem it. Double spell power trinkets. Flask Frost Wyrm instead of Distilled Wisdom, etc. The goal is to beef up your FoL's HPS as much as possible to compensate for how weak a heal it is baseline, and spamming only FoL to then take advantage of it's efficiency. Where a pure Holy paladin would alternate selectively between using Flash of Light, Holy Light, and Holy Shock, a TbtL paladin casts FoL only, because HL is too expensive for them and they don't have HS.

FoL-based builds are one of those things that people keep trying to raise from the dead every time theres a patch, and it isn't any more viable now than it has been in the past. The reasons why the TbtL healing spec is not competative for PvE are:

1) They simply do not put out enough healing.
Even stacking spell power, and with the spell power gain through TbtL from stam, the spec only has a very small spell power advantage over a pure Holy build, because it loses the spell power gains the holy build recieves from Int. Additionally, the prot build misses out on 15% casting haste from Judgements of the Pure, which is a massive gap to overcome in healing output that the prot spec simply cannot compete with. The flexible healing spec is actually better at spamming FoL than the FoL-spec is.

2) The FoL HoT from Sacred Shield on the target does not roll.
If the FoL HoT was able to roll, meaning that the healing amount of additional FoLs casted on a target already with a HoT on them would get added to the remaining value of the HoT, increasing it's individual ticks to a larger size, there would be a potential arguement for FoL-spam. As it is, the HoT is NOT capable of rolling, and can merely be overridden by a larger sized FoL than the original one that created it, if, for example, a new FoL crits.

3) It goes against the Developer's stated design intention with Holy.
The whole point of the Holy changes in 3.2 was twofold. To get Holy paladins to cast more than 1 spell, and to get Holy Paladins to start healing more than one target. Finding some clever way to go right back to spamming one spell on one target only is not only boring, ineffective, but directly contrary to the stated design goals.

4) Holy's longevity isn't that bad to begin with.
Paladins are lasting pretty much just as long as they were before, certainly just as long as every other healer type, and theres nothing justifying a search for a new more efficient spec. If things were that bad, it would justify fixes to the Holy tree, not some funky prot build.

and perhaps most importantly...

5) Beacon of Light is just so incredibly powerful.
It really is. This ability is so completely overpowered. Holy paladins are now basically 2 healers at once. Holy Shit. The output a skilled paladin is capable of producing using this ability is staggering.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Isetnefret » Mon Aug 10, 2009 9:42 am

Hmmmmm, I was thinking it had something to do with survivability.

I would never heal a raid like this, but maybe an arena or in a BG.



If I'm ever called upon to heal, I switch to my ret spec and put on my healing gear.

With a 35% crit chance, the HoT from all heals in the ret spec makes a pretty decent spot-healing build, for those fights when we need that 1 extra healer, and only 1 tank.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Jasari » Mon Aug 10, 2009 9:53 am

Yeah, I wouldn't recommend it for raiding. It's definitely the way to go in 2v2 though, and it's probably a toss up in 3v3 whether it's worth the loss of beacon and holy shock. I also like it in BGs because you make an excellent flag carrier and a great node defender.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Joanadark » Mon Aug 10, 2009 10:17 am

As far as prot healing in arena, check out the armory of my alt paladin for a good guideline.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... r&n=Rhaige
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby fafhrd » Mon Aug 10, 2009 11:40 am

Joanadark wrote:As far as prot healing in arena, check out the armory of my alt paladin for a good guideline.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... r&n=Rhaige



You have an alt pally? to your main pally o.O?
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Jasari » Mon Aug 10, 2009 12:09 pm

Can't say I didn't see this coming, even though it's disappointing.
Ghostcrawler wrote:We are going to fix the specific scenario where a PvP paladin with a Prot build but spell power gear can heal for more than a Holy build in the same gear. We want to do this without messing up the Prot paladin trying to tank in PvE.

We will probably not make this change before the end of the current Arena season, but you can be thinking about your teams for season 7 with this change in mind.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Isetnefret » Mon Aug 10, 2009 1:26 pm

I have 2 paladins lol. There are more than 4 viable and fun builds, so two is not enough IMO.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Joanadark » Mon Aug 10, 2009 1:57 pm

You have an alt pally? to your main pally o.O?


yes. yes i do.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Isetnefret » Mon Aug 10, 2009 1:59 pm

My guild gives me shit all the time for having not only 2 paladins, but 2 druids.

I'm a glutton for punishment.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby lusisia » Mon Aug 10, 2009 2:10 pm

Jasari wrote:Can't say I didn't see this coming, even though it's disappointing.
Ghostcrawler wrote:We are going to fix the specific scenario where a PvP paladin with a Prot build but spell power gear can heal for more than a Holy build in the same gear. We want to do this without messing up the Prot paladin trying to tank in PvE.

We will probably not make this change before the end of the current Arena season, but you can be thinking about your teams for season 7 with this change in mind.



I'm not disappointed at all. The build was fucking stupid and stupidly OP. There is no sane reason why TbtL needs to have the Flash of Light component at all. There's no reason at all that TbtL can't simply reduce the effectiveness of direct healing spells (i.e. FoL and HL). We don't cast them while we tank.

I'm one of these people who gets fucking pissed with goddamn bullshit PvP stuff fucking with PvE. I swear I'm going to nerd-rage even more if some stupid fucking arena monkey gets prot nerf'd somehow because of this.
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Isetnefret » Mon Aug 10, 2009 2:23 pm

I feel dizzy and light-headed after reading your reply.


I agree, this is a shitty way to go.

Back in 2.3, I would arena as prot in holy gear, just for the survivability (prior to TbtL).

I would be okay with a nerf to TbtL.....as long as it doesn't affect my ability to do what I did in 2.3.

Why not just have the TbtL bonus SP not work in Arenas?
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Threatco » Mon Aug 10, 2009 4:12 pm

Prot healing is for PvP is this case. It's not the exact same spec. You pick up some pvp stuff in prot. And get 15 points in holy.

I do it. Did it recently up to 1700 in 4 peice t8.5 holy gear and rest pvp holy gear.

The lock down + survivability + regen was amazing, and made my 2v2 a lot easier.

3v3 was a bit tough without beacon of light of instant heals. But I manage all right.

I have yet to try it since patch (been so busy raiding and heroics) but I will soon.

2v2 still gives arena points and gear til end of season right? :twisted:

Tip: Aura mastery is OP. Since no instant heals, having a periode of time where you can't be interupted/silenced is very handy to handle their cc/burst

Sacred shield is totaly OP with prot talent bonus + t 8.5 bonus + 2500ish SP (from prot talent aStamina = bSP)
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Re: [Prot] Prot Healing? What?

Postby Earantur » Mon Aug 10, 2009 7:40 pm

Threatco wrote:Prot healing is for PvP and Vezax is this case.

Fixed.
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