[RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Ret, Holy, PVP, etc

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[RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Shoju » Fri Jun 19, 2009 6:14 am

So as I'm looking at the current changes to SoV, combined with a newer, faster, CS, I'm really thinking that SoV is going to be a great bonus in PVE. You first couple of hits wont be all that impressive, but with the 5 stack, you will have a chance for 2 DoT's on the target + more Holy Damage added to your attacks.

Am I correct in thinking that SoV is currently looking to be 'the' Ret PVE seal?



And WTB Glyph staying the same. I don't think that it will, but I wish it would. I would stop going after DPS leather with Expertise on it.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Rorran2011 » Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:07 am

This is all speculation at this point, since 3.2 hasn't even hit the PTR yet, but...

If you use the proposed SoC/SoV, after a 5-stack, you get an additional 33% weapon damage done as Holy damage. You additionally get double damage crits.

Considering this, Crusader Strike will become pretty potent after a 5-stack of Blood Corruption.

New CS:
4-sec cooldown
75% weapon damage

Assuming the additional 33% from SoC/SoV applies to CS hits, every time you CS, you do 75% weapon damage (mitigated by target armor) plus 33% Holy damage (unmitigated). That's a total of 108% weapon damage done, down from the original 110%. However, consider that the original 110% can be mitigated by target armor, whereas now, only the 75% portion can be mitigated. Your CS will also do double damage when it crits. At a 4-sec cooldown, this may be a buff to DPS over the status quo.

Unless I'm totally misunderstanding how it works- which is possible, seeing as my main spec is Prot.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby ulushnar » Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:17 am

I think it'll be interesting. If the maths works out it'll be solid DPS but without the nubburst.

Of course I'm 99% sure this means they'll nerf the glyph, but I can dream, right? ><
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Lore » Fri Jun 19, 2009 8:22 am

Don't forget Seals of the Pure also for 15% more SoV damage.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Baelor » Fri Jun 19, 2009 8:34 am

Lore wrote:Don't forget Seals of the Pure also for 15% more SoV damage.

Oh sh*t son, that totally borks my spec. I forgot about that.

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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Lore » Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:01 am

Baelor wrote:
Lore wrote:Don't forget Seals of the Pure also for 15% more SoV damage.

Oh sh*t son, that totally borks my spec. I forgot about that.

Goodbye Divine Sacrifice/Divine Guardian, I will miss you.


Yeah I'm honestly more annoyed by it than anything.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Kelaan » Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:13 am

Rorran2011 wrote:If you use the proposed SoC/SoV, after a 5-stack, you get an additional 33% weapon damage done as Holy damage. You additionally get double damage crits.
Considering this, Crusader Strike will become pretty potent after a 5-stack of Blood Corruption.
Your CS will also do double damage when it crits.


I could be wrong, but I believe the "double damage" text refers only to the holy damage. So, crits will cause double the holy damage they normally would (whereas otherwise it might only do 150% holy damage, as a spell?). Again, i could be wrong, and testing is required.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Lore » Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:37 pm

Yeah, the holy damage crits for 200%, that's all it was saying.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Fedaykin98 » Fri Jun 19, 2009 1:53 pm

Lore wrote:Don't forget Seals of the Pure also for 15% more SoV damage.


Damn...I gave myself props for immediately thinking of the SoV glyph and figuring it was getting nerfed, but now I've got to give them back for not thinking of this talent.

Losing Divine Sac/Guard is a shame, because it felt to me like it was intended as Ret utility - who will use it now? Tanks can't use it while tanking, so you'd think they'd be in their dual spec on whatever fight that is. Holy doesn't go that far into Prot, if at all, AFAIK.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby Joanadark » Fri Jun 19, 2009 6:53 pm

The Aura Mastery spec is still completely valid though, and I use that in far more fights than I use the Divine Guardian spec.

You could also simply use Seal of Command and go back to the DG spec if it is necessary without it being too terrible a DPS loss, though we'll have to see how the numbers compare.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby defeated » Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:44 pm

From reading all the info above and also looking at the patch notes, what i think they are trying to do is make Seal of Command the PvP seal once again (since you don't need stacks) and Seal of Corruption/vengeance to be the PvE one, due to needing the stacks for the extra dps etc.

Also OMG if this is true, please omg please let them keep the SoV glyph the same, 10 expertise would be godly for ret, considering most of our gear doesn't come with much/if any (t8).
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby majiben » Fri Jun 19, 2009 10:24 pm

SotP will not remain the same, that much is obvious and they say as much when they stated that talents affecting changed abilities are prime candidates for additional changes. And the SoV glyph won't likely be in need of a nerf as badly as some are thinking. Plate gear has so much expertise that for many the glyph would be a waste for many gear setups but a valuable glyph for a new undergeared paladin. I could see them changing it though, to a spell hit bonus prehaps? Who knows But I hope they don't do something boring like 10% more damage or 50% less mana cost.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby defeated » Sat Jun 20, 2009 12:10 am

Same here, i am tired of the boring changes, we really need some better minor glyphs though, ours are horrible!

I really think the SoV glyph would be absolutely amazing for ret though, not needing an expertise weapon, able to get crit/haste or hit/crit on gear instead of crit/exp or haste/exp, if you look at my gear setup http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... n=Defiance If things were changed with expertise i could get a crit/haste weap or even armor pen or something along those lines, or hit/crit, and able to change many things to make it much more usefull, If you look at DK/Warrior gear, you see insane amounts of expertise, but if you look at ours, its very minimal at best.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby majiben » Sat Jun 20, 2009 12:49 am

You shouldn't be excited about using an agili, crit, haste or ArP weapon as those are all subpar dps stats. Additionally DK, warrior, and paladin 2H gear is the same besides tier sets, which are a relatively small portion of our gear and not the optimal gear for every person's set of gear.

Personally I'm overflowing with hit (melee) and expertise so additional of either would be a waste.
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Re: [RET-PVE] Anyone really interested in using SoV?

Postby defeated » Sat Jun 20, 2009 3:25 am

True, i go for the STR weapons, but most every weapon has 1 of those stats you mentioned, so if you got other stats from another place, you could easily re-gear to get much better stats i would think, even if they are not as optimal, i would say the weapon from Vezax hard would have to be best for us if we could use the SoV glyph as it is working now, and then restat for more STR (of course) crit (definitely) and then on any other good gear just use the stats on it like haste and arpen, which i think will both be a little more usable for ret in the next patch than previously if i am understanding the patch notes correctly, even though str will still be far superior to any stat altogether.

Look at the stats on the warrior dps gear, our gear has tons of hit, theirs has tons of expertise.
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