[DK] The DK Tanking thread

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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Skye1013 » Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:46 am

Ok, so I'm dusting off my DK, and while I'm primarily DW Frost, I'm still updating my Blood gearset. For tanking, which is a better 2h, Jeklik's Smasher or Axe of the Tauren Chieftains? I know ilvl/dps/threat would make the axe awesome, but I'm wondering for survivability, if the large amount of mastery on the smasher makes it the better choice.

Also, Stoneskin Gargoyle or Swordshattering? I'm assuming SG since it scales with gear, whereas 4% parry will always be 4% parry.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Shoju » Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:09 am

Skye1013 wrote:Ok, so I'm dusting off my DK, and while I'm primarily DW Frost, I'm still updating my Blood gearset. For tanking, which is a better 2h, Jeklik's Smasher or Axe of the Tauren Chieftains? I know ilvl/dps/threat would make the axe awesome, but I'm wondering for survivability, if the large amount of mastery on the smasher makes it the better choice.

Also, Stoneskin Gargoyle or Swordshattering? I'm assuming SG since it scales with gear, whereas 4% parry will always be 4% parry.


#1.) Swordshattering. Unless you are REALLY undergeared for the content. Which means either: Woefully badly geared in 5 mans, or pushing serious hardcore progression.

#2.) The debate on the two weapons is pretty interesting. Jeklik's Smasher will give you some avoidance as well as the mastery. The Axe of the moo cows gives you hit, which is pretty nice for a DK tank right now, and expertise, which is pure threat, and some mastery.

I could make a case for either one really. The Smasher is the more "survival" based weapon, as you end up with approx 1 more mastery (6.25% on the bloodshield), and approx .5% avoidance, while the moo cow axe will give you hit, meaning you are less likely to miss outbreak and need to use normal disease application, and more dps via higher ilvl, higher hit / expertise, while also not killing you in survivability.

While I wouldn't take the moo cow axe over another 378 (say..... the Pit Lord Destroyer) I would PROBABLY take it over the smasher if I had a healer that I was comfortable with, or running content that didn't scare me.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Nikachelle » Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:12 am

Shoju! Please tear this character apart (my own): http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/q ... i/advanced and tell me what she needs fixed (glyphs, gems, etc.)

I've taken an interest in DK tanking again and I like to have gear goals for my alts.

And what's this bajankle I hear about blood shield being different now? I haven't kept up with the changes and don't really know what's going on. I can tank... but I'm not overly sure I'm being effective.

Edit: As for my spec, tweak with it all you like, but I absolutely MUST keep the zero cost interrupt.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Shoju » Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:40 am

Nika.

There isn't much to tear apart :) nice looking alt TBH.

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Your Spec and Glyphs look good. I use the same spec. I'm playing around with 2 things.

Death Strike Glyph, since I find myself pooling my RP more often now with the threat changes, and I'm de-emphasizing the use of heart strike on anything but trash, It's an option to hit harder with DS. Not sure if its a noticable change or not.

I'm debating moving another point into disease length, just so I have some leeway in getting outbreak back up. But, like you have mentioned, the point will probably end up coming out of the free interrupt to do so, and at this point, I still find myself on interrupt duty fairly often.



As far as gear goes, you really just need some runs. You look gemmed and enchanted right, You could pick up a new cloak from doing the thrall quest line (but the new heroics drop a 378), and I would get mastery trinkets instead of stam trinkets.

Fire of the Deep from Valor POints right now is FREAKING AMAZING. TONS of mastery, and the on use coincides with the CD on Dancing Rune Weapon, so if you wanted, you could macro them together and end up with a fairly nice CD.

Blood Shield always happens now. You hit death strike, you get blood shield. It doesn't matter if you miss, or get dodged /parried. it just simply always happens.

It's a HUGE QOL change for both the seasoned and casual DK tanks.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby theckhd » Tue Mar 27, 2012 7:08 am

Question: Until I get beta access (if I get beta access?), I might fool around with leveling my DK. I'll be doing blood for main spec (and probably Unholy for off-spec?). Out of curiosity, what's my priority order for strikes. The EJ thread suggests that it's basically DS>RS>HS, while keeping diseases up (with IT/PS and/or Outbreak?). Does that basically cover it, or is the EJ threat out-of-date since Gravity quit?

Character link in case anyone wants to give suggestions, she's basically not set up yet. Also, I thought the name was a lot more creative before I realized there were 68 other characters with that name. :/
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Cogglamp » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:17 am

That's essentially the order of strikes that I do on my DK but I am by no means advanced.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Shoju » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:48 am

Your Priority:

Diseases up ->
Runes Open and not RP Capped -> Death Strike
RP Capped and not going to get pancaked for not DSing -> Rune Strike

Try at all times to keep 1 and only 1 blood rune activated so that your RE procs from Rune Strike are granting you back Death Strike Worthy Runes.

Also, you will need to time when to Bone Shield as it costs a "Death Strike Rune". Blood Tap is nice for that.

My blood spec Is a pretty common Blood Spec. My Glyphs, are probably debatable,but I prefer the DS glyph to the HS glyph, especially since I tend to pool my RP a little more than most DK's I've run across. The difference, in the hits is noticable, and both are pure damage glyphs.

While Leveling, especially in outland, Diseases aren't really worth it, but it's a bad habit to get into. (not using them). I know that I am currently tanking along on an alt DK with just DnD + BB + DS on trash, and only bothering with diseases on bosses, but you have to remember to break that habit.

At low levels, you will scream because you don't have a Taunt for another 5 levels, so if people get stupid, you will have to out threat them the old fashioned way. (shouldn't be hard).

I highly recommend getting a few addons.
A good disease timer
A good rune addon
And a Blood Shield Tracker

Learning how to time BLood Shields will take you from being a good tank, to a god. A good Rune addon (I prefer Runewatch, used on Compact mode) for my rune / RP / Disease management. And I believe the blood shield tracker I use is simply called "Blood Shield Tracker" or something else rather generic.

Another tip. I'm not sure how you have your hotkeys mapped on your paladin for CD's, but I find that my some of my CD's end up on more "common" buttons than I had on Shoju, probably because I have so many Cooldowns.

Looking over your spec, I would have put the points you have in Abom's Might into improved tap, and don't forget to pick up Blood Parasites. You can drop a point from Scent of blood. 2 points is really all you need.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Fenrìr » Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:17 pm

With my DK now at 85, is it a fair judgement to put parry/mastery gems in red, fractured in yellow, and mastery/stam in blue to meet all socket bonuses? Or are there certain socket bonuses to avoid?
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Shoju » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:51 am

Fenrìr wrote:With my DK now at 85, is it a fair judgement to put parry/mastery gems in red, fractured in yellow, and mastery/stam in blue to meet all socket bonuses? Or are there certain socket bonuses to avoid?



I have been gemming for all socket bonuses. If you were going to "pass" on socket bonuses, I would pass on Avoidance first, Stam Second, and NEVER Avoidance. Mastery (I shouldn't post when I'm dealing with a head cold)

but yeah, Normally I do

Fine Orange
Fractured Yellows
Puissant Greens

Solid BLues aren't.... "terrible" but I normally don't find it to be optimal.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Fenrìr » Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:57 am

Alrighty, that's what I've been doing. Cheers.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Arjuna » Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:02 am

So is there still a good DK resource site out there?
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Fenrìr » Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:47 pm

Arjuna wrote:So is there still a good DK resource site out there?



yea, it's called come here and bug Shoju.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Arjuna » Sat Jun 16, 2012 10:44 pm

Hahaha! Well, then I'll just do that...though I know most things already. The only thing I was wondering about was the gem priority, but I got that one answered above without me having to ask it even, perfect! :D
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Shoju » Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:11 pm

LOL.

Thanks guys. It makes me feel good to know that you would come and bug me.

@arjuna.

Mastery is our bread and butter awesome-sauce stat at least until 5.0 goes live. When that goes live, I'm afraid there will have to be a new Dk to haunt the off spec forums of MTadin.

If you are looking for "what would Shoju do" This is what I would do, and it should stay active on my tanking gear, (outside of wednesday night) from now until they remove my character from the armory (I don't get to tank as much anymore, since DS needs 2 tanks for a handful of fights).

For more challenging content (Read: H:Blackhorn and H:Madness) It is viable, to favor stamina more, because those two fights can hit like trucks, and Impale on H:Madness is the killer.

If you have any questions, feel free to PM me.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Fenrìr » Tue Mar 12, 2013 10:50 am

Welp, been playing my dk to gear it out for CM:Golds since no one seems to want a prot or ret paladin. Any of you got a DK alt / main for this patch that's decently heroic / raid ready?

Been trying to decide if it's worth it to go 7.5/7.5 into Mastery or just straight Mastery and let the hit/exp come from gear alone.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby JoeBravo » Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:34 pm

Fenrìr wrote:Welp, been playing my dk to gear it out for CM:Golds since no one seems to want a prot or ret paladin. Any of you got a DK alt / main for this patch that's decently heroic / raid ready?

Been trying to decide if it's worth it to go 7.5/7.5 into Mastery or just straight Mastery and let the hit/exp come from gear alone.


working on my horde DK alt as CM tank. planning on going all out on mastery 1st and 7.5/7.5 2nd.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Jackinthegreen » Sat Oct 12, 2013 12:24 pm

I recently started looking at DKs again and got thinking about the chance to Scent of Blood proccing from dodges and parries now as well as its interaction with the DR on dodge and parry. So far in my searching I've come across the likelihood that it's based on PPM now to discourage DW tanking. With a 3.6 speed weapon, but no faster, it supposedly has a 100% proc chance, which would suggest its PPM is at least 16.66_. Can anyone confirm this?

If it can be confirmed then it might require updating SimC a bit since I originally looked in the coding there to find its PPM only to discover it's referencing http://www.wowhead.com/spell=49509 and http://www.wowhead.com/spell=148211, which show it as being a flat 100% chance.

Even if WoWhead/SimC don't need to be updated and the spell IDs are indeed using the proper PPM stuff but aren't showing it, can we safely assume that that also applies to SoB's chance to proc on dodges and parries, which is to say that using a 3.6 speed weapon guarantees every dodge and parry will proc it? If so, does that have an internal CD on it just in case Blizz doesn't want DKs being flooded with RP while AoE tanking?

All this is to lead up to a question: Given players can still parry haste, is it perhaps better overall for DKs of an avoidance persuasion (after getting comfortable levels of mastery and stamina) to stack parry and ignore balancing the DR between dodge and parry since it would result in more SoB procs per time from parry-hasted attacks and thus lead to more RP/runes/survival?
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Skye1013 » Fri Nov 22, 2013 7:19 am

So... I dusted off my DK and leveled him up to 90 so I could solo stuff more easily... I did have a question though... what exactly is the little number that shows up on Death Strike (it builds up to a max of 5, either through use of abilities or taking damage, I'm not entirely sure which, then resets whenever DS is used...)

Also...trying to decide which talents I like best...

Particularly for the rune generation tier (Blood Tap/Runic Empowerment/Runic Corruption I think?) I was reading the icyveins page (for Frost DKs) and it suggested that BT was the best, followed by RE (if you prefer a passive that you don't have to think about) with RC being the worst... am I correct in assuming this holds true for Blood DKs as well?

First tier, I like the Blood Boil one, as it allows me to spread/refresh diseases with an AoE ability that I'm probably using anyway.

The other tiers (I don't remember exact order) I went with the 10% speed buff(which I need to remember to put on my bar... keep forgetting it has an active ability on top of its passive effect...), the AD clone that saves you from death, but you have heal yourself quickly or die anyway, the steal health from a minion, and Gorefiend's Grasp (which I might switch out, but for now serves as an extra interrupt on a lot of stuff.)
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Daeva001 » Fri Nov 22, 2013 12:43 pm

Skye1013 wrote:So... I dusted off my DK and leveled him up to 90 so I could solo stuff more easily... I did have a question though... what exactly is the little number that shows up on Death Strike (it builds up to a max of 5, either through use of abilities or taking damage, I'm not entirely sure which, then resets whenever DS is used...)


That's the number of Scent of Blood stacks that you have. You get one whenever you land an auto-attack or avoid a melee and each stack increases your Death Strike's heal by 20%.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby bldavis » Fri Nov 22, 2013 6:26 pm

i personally go with blood tap macroed with rune strike, fairly easy fire and forget button...not the best if you are a min/maxer but yeah

http://www.wowhead.com/talent#kDD|MR that is what i generally run with for just solo content, with a macro for lichborne that casts death coil on myself

death pact is nice, i can heal myself 95% if i use it and vamp blood at the same time
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Skye1013 » Fri Nov 22, 2013 10:23 pm

While I'm sure it's great, I've just never been a big fan of using the LB/DC combo... might just be because I started out as Frost back in the day and DC wasn't part of their rotation/priority... so largely became overlooked.
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby bldavis » Sat Nov 23, 2013 10:46 am

purgatory is great for raiding, but when you are just out soloing, you are probably going to die anyway
LB/DC also gives you another fear break
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Re: [DK] The DK Tanking thread

Postby Skye1013 » Fri Nov 29, 2013 11:07 pm

bldavis wrote:purgatory is great for raiding, but when you are just out soloing, you are probably going to die anyway
LB/DC also gives you another fear break

Soloing as Blood, I just need to DS after purgatory pops and 95% of the time it's enough healing to keep me alive (along with the bubble it gives for subsequent hits.)

As for fear break... unless I'm taking on warbringers, I don't generally encounter fear much while soloing, so my WotF tends to do the job.
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