[Holy PvE] Ulduar Gear Guide

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[Holy PvE] Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby sherck » Tue May 05, 2009 11:01 am

Honestly, some of you don't seem to comprehend the system. Post tagged. -Baelor

I am building this ranked list (best to worst, top to bottom in each category) based on these criteria:

1. I do not include any items with Spirit on it.
2. I do not include any items with Hit rating on it.
3. I have Critical Strike rating on all my gear.
4. It is all Plate & Mail items. All the Leather & Cloth I found in Ulduar has either Spirit or Hit on it.
5. I value Haste = MP5.
6. So my value system for comparison goes: Int = Crit > SP > Haste = MP5 (Stam is not a factor)

Ancient Iron Heaume , Plate, I-Level 226, Heroic Iron Council
Steamworker's Goggles , Mail, I-Level 226, Heroic Flame Leviathan
Conqueror's Aegis Headpiece , Plate, I-level 226, Heroic Thorim
Valorous Aegis Headpiece , Plate, I-Level 219, Regular Mimiron
Helm of Veiled Energies , Mail, I-Level 219, Regular XT-002
Faceguard of the Eyeless Horror , Plate, I-Level 219, Regular Yogg-Saron

Faceguard of the Succumbed , Tier 7 Best in Slot

Discussion - With the exception of the Faceguard of the Eyeless Horror, all are solid upgrades from my current I-Level 213 Faceguard of the Succumbed which was considered Best in Slot for Tier 7. I rate the Ancient Iron Heaume as Best in Slot because with the Yellow Gem slot instead of a Blue slot, you get a few more Intellect points, it has the 2nd highest Crit rating total, 2nd highest Haste rating and the highest amount of Stamina. It is just the superior helm but all are very nice choices for upgrade.

Pendant of the Shallow Grave , I-level 226, Regular General Vezax (HARD MODE)
Frozen Tear of Elune , I-Level 226, 19 Emblems of Conquest vendor
Pendant of Endless Despair, I-level 219, Regular General Vezax

Cosmic Lights , Tier 7 Best in Slot (Debatable, the EoE quest necks were better, but I was never able to win the dang roll for it)

Discussion - Yeah, three whole new neck pieces for Holy Paladin’s that follow my gearing criteria. The silver lining is that one of them can be purchased from Emblems of Conquest and is a very solid upgrade from any of the I-level 200 or 213 necks. The advantage of the Pendant of the Shallow Grave over the Frozen Tear of Elune and what makes it Best in Slot, is that it has a Yellow Socket so will end up having 16 more Intellect than the Emblem neck. Of note, all Heroic Ulduar Spell Power neck drops either have Spirit on them or lack Crit. All of them. What is up with that, Blizzard?

Conqueror's Aegis Spaulders , Plate, I-Level 226, Heroic Yogg-Saron
Amice of the Stoic Watch , Mail, I-Level 226, Heroic Auriaya
Pauldrons of Tempered Will , Plate, I-Level 219, Regular Ignis
Valorous Aegis Spaulders , Plate, I-Level 219, Regular Thorim

Valorous Redemption Spaulders , Tier 7 Best in Slot

Discussion – All are pretty much across the board upgrades from the Tier 7.25 shoulders I am using now that were previously Best in Slot with the exception of the amount of Crit rating on them. This is the first indication that Blizzard felt that Holy Paladins had too much Crit in Tier 7 because all Plate shoulder pieces decrease the amount of Crit rating on them from Tier 7. Not by much, but you will lose 7-12 Crit Strike rating to move up to Tier 8 (but will increase most other important stats). The Tier 8.25 piece is Best in Slot but not very accessible for many people. The Mail shoulders from Heroic Auriaya are an excellent piece if you can get them until you can get the Tier piece; there is absolutely nothing wrong with them.

Drape of the Sullen Goddess , I-Level 239, Heroic Freya (HARD MODE)
Pennant Cloak , I-Level 226, Heroic OS Sartharion + 2 Drakes
Drape of the Spellweaver , I-Level 219, Regular Zone Drop from Trash Mob
Cloak of the Dormant Blaze , I-level 219, Regular Zone Drop from Trash Mob

Pennant Cloak , Tier 7 Best in Slot

Discussion – Wait a minute! I thought this was an Ulduar loot list? It is, but I put the Pennant Cloak on there to illustrate that there are zero Item Level 226 Cloak drops from Ulduar that work for Holy Paladins. All either have Spirit on them or lack Critical Strike. All of them. I consider both of the Item Level 219 cloaks to be downgrades from my Shroud of Luminosity due to lesser amounts of Intellect or Critical Strike rating and would not take them if they dropped. It is sad that I have to continue to run Heroic OS + 2 for the only accessible upgrade in this slot. The Item Level 239 item is the obvious Best in Slot, but will not be available to most raiders for quite a while.

Breastplate of the Devoted, Plate, I-Level 239, Heroic XT-002 (HARD MODE) (Crit / Haste)
Chestguard of the Fallen God, Mail, I-Level 226, Heroic Yogg-Saron (Crit / Haste)
Conqueror’s Aegis Tunic, Plate, I-Level 226, Heroic Hodir (Crit / MP5)
Breastplate of the Shaper, Mail, I-Level 226, Regular XT-002 (HARD MODE) (Crit / Haste)
Lifeforge Breastplate, Plate, I-Level 226, Heroic Ignis (Crit / MP5)
Valorous Aegis Tunic, I-Level 219, Regular Yogg-Saron (Crit / MP5)
Firestrider Chestguard, Mail, I-Level 219, Regular Flame Leviathan (Crit / Haste)

Discussion – I would consider all of these pieces to be an upgrade to my Chestplate of the Great Aspect that I am using now. The biggest gain is that all of them increase the amount of Intellect and Critical Strike over Tier 7 at the cost of some Spell Power typically. That is a trade-off I will take every day. Here we have the first Hard Mode Heroic drop for Holy Paladins with the Breastplate of the Devoted which is a very good piece with three sockets in it. XT-002 in Hard Mode will be very difficult for a while until guilds get better geared, but this piece is worth the effort; it is heads and shoulders about any other choice. The mail drop from Heroic Yogg-Saron is better than the Tier 8.25 piece with greater amounts of Critical Strike and Spell Power. All of the Item Level 226 pieces are good; but I would take the mail piece until I could get a crack at the Best in Slot Breastplate of the Devoted.

Bindings of Winter Gale, Mail, I-Level 239, Heroic Hodir (HARD MODE) (Crit / Haste)
Wristguards of the Firetender, Mail, I-Level 226, Heroic Ignis (Crit / MP5)
Horologist’s Wristguards, Plate, I-Level 226, Heroic XT-002 (Crit / MP5)
Armbands of the Construct, Plate I-Level 219, Regular XT-002 (Crit / MP5)
Armbands of the Vibrant Flame, Mail, I-Level 219, Regular Ignis (Crit / MP5)

Discussion – Neither of the Item Level 219 choices are improvements over the Best in Slot for Tier 7 Bracers of Liberation. The Mail has too little Intellect and the Plate is a side-grade at best. I would take neither of them if they dropped. The other three choices, however, are all solid upgrades with both the Mail pieces being across the board improvements. It is a bit sad that the Best in Slot and 2nd Best in Slot for Holy Paladins are Mail pieces; but you take what you can get, I guess.

Gauntlets of the Thunder God, Plate, I-Level 226, Regular Thorim (HARD MODE) (Crit / Haste)
Gloves of Whispering Winds, Mail, I-Level 226, Regular Freya (HARD MODE) (Crit / Haste)
Gloves of Augury, Mail, I-Level 226, 28 Emblems of Conquest vendor (Crit / MP5)
Gloves of the Pythonic Guardian, Plate, I-Level 226, Heroic Kologarn (Crit / MP5)
Runeshaper’s Gloves, Mail, I-Level 226, Heroic Iron Council (Crit / Haste)

Discussion – The Tier 8 pieces do not have Crit on them, immediately throwing them off my list. The crafted Item Level 226 Plate gloves, Gauntlets of Serene Blessing also lack Crit. There appears to be zero Item Level 219 choices that fall into my gearing criteria. However there are 5 choices at Item Level 226 to pick from and it all depends on what you value most; high Crit or high Intellect. The Emblem of Conquest Mail gloves are a great choice if you want more Crit but they are lacking in Intellect when compared with the other choices. I gave the nod to the Gauntlets of the Thunder God from the Hard Mode of Regular Thorim as Best in Slot solely because it had two gems slots instead of one. But all are pretty on par with each other.

Girdle of Unyielding Trust, Plate, I-Level 226, 28 Emblems of Conquest vendor (Crit / MP5)
Blue Belt of Chaos, Mail, I-Level 226, Crafted (Crit / MP5)
Belt of the Fallen Wyrm, Mail, I-Level 226, Heroic Razorscale (Crit / Haste)

Discussion – Not many choices here. There appears to be nothing that drops from 10-man Regular mode that fits my gearing criteria. From Heroic mode, there is only one mail drop that has Crit on it. Happily, there are two other choices, one crafted (which will be VERY expensive for a while until Runed Orbs become plentiful on the AH) and one that can be purchased with Emblems of Conquest. The Girdle of Unyielding Trust is an excellent item and represents a clear upgrade from any of the Naxx gear you are wearing and is Best in Slot.

Frostplate Greaves, Plate, I-Level 226, Heroic Hodir (Crit / MP5)
Leggings of the Stoneweaver, Mail, I-Level 226, Heroic Kologarn (Crit / MP5)
Legplates of Flourishing Resolve, Plate, I-Level 219, Regular Freya (Crit / MP5)

Discussion – Like the Gloves, the Tier Legs lack Crit and are not on my list. Other choices are few and far between that have Critical Strike rating on them; most of the Plate and Mail leg drops are Haste & MP5. You will have to look carefully to find one of these few drops with Crit on them. The Frostplate Greaves get the nod over the Mail pants as Best in Slot due to a higher amount of Critical Strike rating on them.

Lightning Grounded Boots, Mail, I-Level 226, Crafted (Crit / MP5)
Greaves of the Rockmender, Plate, I-Level 226, Heroic Auriaya (Crit / MP5)
Greaves of the Earthbinder, Mail, I-Level 219, Regular Kologarn (Crit / MP5)
Sabatons of the Iron Watcher, Plate, I-Level 219, Regular Kologarn (Crit / MP5)

Discussion – Ugh, a non-Hard Mode Mail piece as Best in Slot. At least it is craftable; expensive, but craftable. Once you gem it with a Luminous for the Red Slot (Int/SP) and Dazzling for the Blue Slot (Int/MP5), then the higher Crit amount gives the nod to the crafted piece. Why is it that the crafted Plate pieces are so bad for Holy Paladin itemization but that the crafted Mail pieces are so good?

Val’anyr, Hammer of the Ancient Kings, Mace, I-Level 239, Quest Reward (Crit / Haste)
The Turning Tide, Sword, I-Level 226, Heroic Kel’Thuzad (Crit / Haste)
Pulse Baton, Mace, I-Level 219, Regular Mimiron (Crit / MP5)

Discussion – It is really disappointing that Blizzard has chosen not to put a single weapon in Heroic Ulduar that is itemized for a Holy Paladin. Apparently, if you want an upgrade, you need to convince your guild that you need to be the one to get the Legendary mace. It you got The Turning Tide in Naxx; hang onto it because you will most likely be using it upon entering Tier 9 raids. I am hoping that more weapons will appear in the databases or be added because the current selection leaves a lot to be desired.

Wisdom’s Hold, I-Level 239, Heroic Thorim (HARD MODE) (Crit / Haste)
Voice of Reason, I-Level 226, Heroic Kel’Thuzad (Crit / Haste)
Pulsing Spellshield, I-Level 219, Regular XT-002 (Crit / Haste)

Discussion – Ack, again with the lack of Item Level 226 Spell Power shields with Crit on them in Heroic Ulduar. There is an Item Level 239 shield which is a great item to shoot for, but I am honestly not that impressed with it over the Voice of Reason from Naxx. Look at these stats lines:

Wisdom’s Hold, Item Level 239, 8130 armor, 70 Stam, 48 Int, 75 Spell Power, 40 Crit, 47 Haste
Voice of Reason, Item Level 226, 7890 armor, 49 Stam, 49 Int, 74 Spell Power, 46 Crit, 31 Haste

The Voice of Reason has 1 more Intellect and 6 more Crit at the loss of 1 Spell Power and 16 Haste…plus 21 Stamina. Obviously, Wisdom’s Hold is a better overall piece, but it is not an overwhelming better Caster piece. If I could get my hands on a Voice of Reason, I would be happy taking it into Tier 9; just like my Naxx weapon.

The Pulsing Spellshield is an acceptable upgrade from either the Aegis of Damnation or the Protective Barrier of Lights which are the only Item Level 200 – 213 shields that have Crit on them.

Signet of Manifested Pain, I-Level 226, Heroic Kel’Thuzad (Crit / Haste)
Pyrelight Circle, I-Level 226, Heroic Ignis (Crit / Haste)
Ring of the Faithful Servant, I-Level 226, Heroic Auriaya (Crit / MP5)

Discussion – There are zero Item Level 219 rings that fit into my itemization. There are 25 rings in the database that are Item Level 226 and above; and only three that fit my itemization. The Best in Slot for rings remains the Signet of Manifested Pain from Naxx. It has a higher Intellect amount that the two Ulduar rings which makes it boss. The two Ulduar rings are very similar with one having Haste and the other having MP5.

Pandora’s Plea, + 108 Intellect, On Spell Cast, chance to gain + 850 Spell Power for 10 sec, Heroic Mimiron
Sif’s Remembrance, + 110 Spell Power, On Spell Cast, chance to gain 156 MP5 for 15 sec, Regular Thorim (HARD MODE)
Scale of Fates, + 110 Spell Power, On Use = + 432 Haste rating for 20 sec, Heroic Thorim
Eye of the Broodmother, + 83 Crit, On Spell Cast, chance to gain + 25 SP for 10 sec, stacking 5 times, Regular Razorscale
Energy Siphon, + 43 MP5, On Use = + 408 Spell Power for 20 sec, Regular Flame Leviathan

Discussion – Trinket selection is a very personal choice. I have a tendency to go with Spell Power trinkets because they have traditionally had better “on use” or “on cast” procs for healers. However, I have been known to equip both Critical Strike and well as MP5 trinkets as needed. Other than identifying what I believe is the Best in Slot trinket, the rest are really open to how you are geared and what you want out of the slots.

In my opinion, Pandora’s Plea is custom build for Holy Paladins. Another 108 Intellect all the time to power our Divine Plea, our Crit chance, our man pool, and our Replenishment? Heck yes and a nice gain to throughput when it procs. I love this trinket and want it badly.

Libram of Renewal, Decreases mana cost of Holy Light by 113, 15 Emblems of Heroism vendor
Libram of the Resolute, Increases spell power of Holy Light by 160, Heroic Auriaya
Libram of Tolerance, Increases spell power of Holy Light by 141, 25 Emblems of Valor vendor

Discussion – I have listed all of the healing Librams available for Tier 7 and Tier 8 raids. On average, the two Librams that add to my Holy Light amount healed are going to add less than 3% to the total amount healed. However, the Libram of Renewal purchased for 15 Emblems of Heroism is going to decrease the cost of a Holy Light spell by nearly 9%.

So, for every 11 Holy Light spells I cast (each averaging around 8,000 healed), I either gain the mana to cast one more Holy Light (doing another 8,000 in healing) with the Libram of Renewal -- OR -- I will have increased the healing amount of those 11 Holy Lights by 160 each for a total of an additional 1,760 healing done.

Hmmm…easy decision. The Best in Slot healing Libram remains the Libram of Renewal that you probably purchased before you first entered into Naxx.

Thanks for reading the guide. Let me know where I got it wrong.

Last edited by sherck on Tue May 12, 2009 10:43 am, edited 10 times in total.
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Re: Holy Paladin Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby randomjibberish » Tue May 05, 2009 1:51 pm

Item links would be incredibly helpful.

I think it would be a good idea to include the BiS pre 3.1 item on each of the listings. It's to show people where some of their old gear matches up to the new stuff. I know you discuss that in the discussion section, but I think it'll be better to just flat out throw the items on the list.

I disagree with int = crit, but I'm an int whore.
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Re: Holy Paladin Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby sherck » Tue May 05, 2009 2:04 pm

Good suggestions. I usually fail at item linking but I will work on it tomorrow.

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Re: Holy Paladin Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby Barathorn » Wed May 06, 2009 12:21 am

I know this is a gear guide, but I am unsure if this is the right place for the topic as it covers offspec/dualspec so I think it is better suited in that forum so I will move it over.

I will wait until the guide is finished and then link it in the main consolidated sticky. Thanks for taking the time to write it :wink: .

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Re: Holy Paladin Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby Pallymar » Wed May 06, 2009 8:05 am

Not to take anything away from the OP, here's a link to a Best-in-Slot guide that I posted up in the PlusHeal.com forums. I'm posting it here simply because its an alternative guide. Based on the OP's criteria, we have different priorities and styles for healing. Take for instance, I value MP5 far lower than I value Haste. I also value intellect higher than anything else (as is the primary EJ's train of thought) with Crit then Haste being relatively close, priority given to the crit.

Pallymar's Best-in-Slot Holy Guide
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Re: Holy Paladin Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby Kelaan » Wed May 06, 2009 10:35 am

As someone mentioned, links are useful. Can you give links to the Wowhead searches that yielded these? It makes it easier to tweak required item levels lower to include T7 stuff.

edit: the reason I ask is, when gearing an off-role, I'm unlikely to get Best in Slot stuff anytime soon, so I'd like to still see what the decent things are and how they compare. Especially since some T7.5 stuff is better than T8ish stuff.
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Re: Holy Paladin Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby Earantur » Mon May 18, 2009 3:52 pm

I'd honestly consider keeping the T7 4-piece right now and/or going 2T7-2T8 for set bonii.
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Re: [Holy PvE] Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby GothicPL » Tue May 19, 2009 1:01 pm

I'm collecting two sets for Holy PvE at this point - one optimized for longevity (4pc T7), and another for burst healing (highest iLvl sp/haste/crit pieces, basically). The former set would be used by default for trash, fights that have steadily high tank damage, and fights that I'm not very familiar with. The latter set would be used for fights that have known mana regen opportinities via SoW melee or fully used Divine Plea during phase transitions. With time, I'm finding extra opportunities to SoW melee mobs during the boss fights, so I think I'll be using the burst set more and more long term.

For example, I would use the burst set on XT (can get back to full mana through SoW melee/DP during the heart phase) and Razorscale (ditto during the first two landings), and I would use the longevity optimized set for Kologarn. Iron Council I'm not sure yet, I can maintain my mana healing the Fusion Punch tank, but after that boss is down there aren't many regen opportunities, but still lots of healing to do.

One pitfall is of course to be careful and not endanger the tank while you're busy doing the melee trick.

Frankly, I'm not impressed with T8 bonii for holy pallies at all - 2pc is basically a mana drain because the HoT activation consumes your mana, and 4pc is an uncontrollable damage absorb effect that only makes a difference on bosses with fast small hits. I will only be using Ulduar pieces because their ILvl is higher.

[Now, the ele shaman tier gear story is completely opposite - T7 bonii are utter junk, while T8 are good dps improvements.]
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Re: [Holy PvE] Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby kp3t3houg » Fri May 29, 2009 1:42 am

i still cant get it. How ppl cant understand the power ot 4p t8 bonus. WIth it, and 2 points in Divine Guardian, you have a single cast, with 1 min duration, absorbing 35 for 500 mana ? no overheal, no nothing, pure dmg absorb.

here are the maths, if you are interested

Sacred Shield - 12 % of base mana -> naked BE mana -5644. Mana from Intelect, when you are naked - 1530. 5644-1530=4114 0.12*4114=493.68 ~ 494 mana for single SS cast
Tier 8, 4 piece bonus - it means it can proc 15 times for 1 min, if its on the MT. Lets say we have a 2 sec swing, and we have to wait 2 secs after each proc ends, to get a new one - 10 procs min for 1 min. 15 max, 10 min -> ~ 12 procs each min
Divine Guardian, with 2 points in it - i assume this includes the bonus you get from Spell Power

Lets take Holy Pladin with 2500 SP raid buffed - totaly normal for a Ulduar healing paladin. Base SS absorb - 500 dmg + 75 % of the Spell Power -> 500 + (0.75*2500) = 500 + 1875 = 2375
Now lets get the bonus from the talent - 2375*1.2 = 2850 absorb from each proc. We said we will have like 12 procs each min -> 12 * 2850 = 34200 pure dmg absorb for 494 mana.

Sorry if my math is messy :)
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Re: [Holy PvE] Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby GothicPL » Fri May 29, 2009 1:16 pm

kp3t3houg wrote:i still cant get it. How ppl cant understand the power ot 4p t8 bonus. WIth it, and 2 points in Divine Guardian, you have a single cast, with 1 min duration, absorbing 35 for 500 mana ? no overheal, no nothing, pure dmg absorb.

Oh, I love the math behind SS. It is the most mana efficient way to prevent damage in theory.
In practice, however, many Ulduar bosses are hitting slow and hard, with high damage special abilities or AOE damage on top of that. This pretty much necessitates heavy Holy Light usage to consistently top off tanks that do not overgear the instance. The key point is that the SS damage absorb is neither big nor controllable enough to remove the need for frequent Holy Light usage, aka HL spam.

If there were bosses with very fast small hits (I define small as less than 9k post mitigation), I would absolutely switch to SS + FoL + occasional HL if FoL falls behind healing style. But there are no such bosses to my knowledge. Sure, some trash/adds are like this, but even for those, HL-focused gear/talent spec is working fine, while being much more powerful on slow hard hitting boss fights.

They are talking about maybe making FoL a more viable boss healing spell to compensate for an imminent change in mana regen mechanics. If that happens, I'll be happy to adapt. Until then, it's 4pcT7 + crit from the ret tree.

Don't get me wrong, I don't love HL spam at all, but this is what works at the moment with the current state of the class.

Flavor wise, I prefer the resto shaman style of ES + Riptide + LHW or HW or CH because it gives me the choice of three or four buttons to push to adapt to the fight mechanics. As holy paladin, it's not as interesting - keep SS/Beacon/Judgement up and time Holy Lights according to the fight, maybe Holy Shock / FoL people who take random target damage. If they move FoL in the direction of BC-era HL9 or, even better, resto shaman Riptide, and nerf HL accordingly so that it's not spammable (see BC-era HL11), then we would finally have a choice of direct healing spells to use, and more intelligent and fun playstyle.

Does all this make sense?
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Re: [Holy PvE] Ulduar Gear Guide

Postby kp3t3houg » Sat May 30, 2009 12:18 pm

agreed,but the point is elsewhere. :) cutting 3k (no overheal) from 30k hit is 10 % reduction,and this happens every 4-6 secs. Also SS proc dosnt go off on the first dmg like the druid proc (forgot the name), it acts like a shield - it stays till he absorbed all he can. So who cares if there is AoE or any kind of extra dmg, it is still absorb. Anyway, i just wanted to point the maths, everyone can make their own decisions :)
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