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Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Ret, Holy, PVP, etc

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Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby ninjatrigger » Thu Apr 16, 2009 6:01 am

My 25 man raid group has run into an issue; we have 6 tanks. However, there is a general agreement that we'd rather rotate the tank spots and have tanks when not tanking spec another spec than replace people from week to week. The problem is I have to get a dps set togather by friday this week and I really have nothing. My group really wants to stay togather and they say they'd rather have me (or any one offspecing) come in with bad gear rather than replace me for the week and break the great team work we've been having. I really don't want to let my group down, so I really need advice on some gear I can get my hands on.

So far I am revered with Ebon Blade, Exalted with Argent dawn, and revered in wyrmrest and sons of hodir. AH is also an option, but with all the new stuff I'm kinda of low on gold. My guildies will go with me through some heroics, but with only a day, may be two, I need heroics that are quick and easy but have a good amount of drops for ret. Any help?
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby Elsie » Thu Apr 16, 2009 7:14 am

This is me remembering 3.1, so it could be a bit outdated. None of it should be too hard to acquire. I'm not going to go into Naxx drops since they would usually be obviously worth a consideration. I will give you a "good, fairly easy item" then some non-Naxx alternatives. A lot of the preferred items listed are better than naxx 10 drops (helm, neck, gloves, cloak, pants, belt, boots).

Helm: Crafted. Even if you're low on gold it's second best in slot pre-3.1 (or third, depending on gloves... but you're not there).
Neck: Crafted is decent. Pre-3.1, the Malygos quest tanking one was near the top. If you lack that, get the badge one.
Shoulders: Crafted or Dungeon. Tier 6 isn't terrible.
Cloak: Cloak of Bloodied Water from the auction house. Otherwise, badges and
Chest: Tier 7.1 from badges. If you lack badges, get the chest from Sunwell (M'uru) is comparable, and Eck in Heroic Gundrack has a good one.
Bracers: BoE valor bracers. The Tier 6 bracers are better than the heroic HoS ones in my opinion. The crafted ones are either better or comparable to Tier 6.
Gloves: Oculus (plate) or Utgarde Pinnacle (Leather, lots of hit). The 7.1 ones from badges are good if you do not need the hit.
Belt: Ebon Blade one is very good, and the leather badge one is slightly better.
Pants: Heroic Utgarde Keep outstripes every alternative by a wide margin. I'd shy away from the Wyrmrest Accord reputation ones, there's probably a blue that's better somewhere.
Rings: Heroic Gundrak and Heroic CoS. The JC ones are pretty good, too (the blue one has hit as I recall).
Boots: Reputation (ebon blade, I think) are extremely good.
Libram: Venture Landing coin libram isn't bad. The borean tundra one is worse, badge one is useless, and deadly/h.naxx one probably out of your reach at this point
Weapon: My preference order is (1) Heroic HoS blue sword (2) Heroic HoL axe (3) Titansteel Destroyer, although (3) becomes best now if you're not hit capped. If you are really lacking money and get bad drops, the ebon blade sword is best after those (but has no stam, so watch your survivability).
Trinkets: Heroic Nexus is your top priority trinket. After that, there's the Meteorite Whetstone in Heroic Utgarde Pinnacle and an ArP proc one from a dungeon.
My advice: Don't shy away from leather and mail. If they have better stats, they have better stats. QED. The agility/AP on gear can far outstripe the STR on plate in enough quantities. The relative weight stats are in another thread here (The ones about the new value of hit iirc). They often also have a ton of hit/expertise which are the number one and three stats for retribution paladins respectively (and expertise isn't far behind STR).

Goals:
1) Hit Cap
2) Good weapon
3) STR and expertise cap
4) Lots of badges and more money

Remember you can get frozen orbs and, if an enchanter, abyss crystals from badges. If you can't make the money you should consider if selling badges would net you a bigger upgrade than the badge item itself. Never get a badge item unless you're out of time and can't get the instance drop or a good alternative from reputation is available (or the badge item isn't that hot)
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby ninjatrigger » Thu Apr 16, 2009 8:25 am

Cool, thanks for the great post! Too bad I have to wait till I get home to get started on it ><
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby Elsie » Thu Apr 16, 2009 8:35 am

ninjatrigger wrote:Cool, thanks for the great post! Too bad I have to wait till I get home to get started on it ><

To be fair, you can really just run two instances for 10 badges, then farm for 2 hours (~600g fairly easily) and buy at least one upgrade. The cloak shouldn't be over 50-100g, the titansteel destroyer is probably around 750-1000g, and the BoE bracers are anywhere from 500-1500g. The spiked titansteel helm is something like 400-600, and crafted bracers (there's two, one is much better than the other) is probably around 50-150g. That's maximally like... 10 hours of farming. Then belt/boots from reputation, trinket/gloves/chest from badges or whatnot. Then a few minutes doing a couple dailies in Grizzly Hills (libram)... etc. It's not hard to gear up at all in 2-3 days.
-Remember, it's almost always cheaper to buy the materials from trade chat and the AH and find a crafter. Trade chat is probably the easiest passive money gain in the gain since people will sell lower due to time or bulk. A lot of times by spamming WTB or watching WTS you'll find a lot of underpriced items either due to (1) bulk purchase (2) quicker turn around for seller (3) auction is overstocked and seller has surplus or (4) idiots.

If you spend an average 20 minutes per instance (good group), then you'll get ~4 badges per run, 12 per hour. That means you're making like.. 100g per hour or more just running instances on top of potential upgrades. Most people write off instances for monetary gain, but you can really work it if you're smart.

I also forgot to mention that the badge trinket Mirror of Truth is extremely good. 2nd or 3rd best in slot pre-3.1 depending on the fight. It's probably the best bang-for-buck upgrade you can get from 5-man badges.
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby Isetnefret » Thu Apr 16, 2009 8:51 am

You run with 24 other people.

Some of them have tradeskills, most likely.

See if you can put some feelers out so that you can get cheaper mats, someone with the skills to do the combines, etc.

Save your green drops. If one of them is an enchanter, see if they would't mind melting some stuff down into enchanting mats for you.

I'm a blacksmith, and I made a lot of stuff for guildmates and friends for free, and in the process, they gave me spare mats here and there.

Eventually I just ended up with enough left-over crap to make the crafted helm.

A friend of mine had 80 badges saved up, and didn't need anything he could buy with them. I traded him a stack of belt buckles and he converted all his badges into orbs for me.

Not a very good deal monetarily, but we're friends.
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby Isetnefret » Thu Apr 16, 2009 8:54 am

(1) Heroic HoS blue sword (2) Heroic HoL axe


HoL is so fast and easy. If I were you, and had the mats for my Titansteel Destroyer, I would just save them till the last possible minute. Run HoL and HoS a couple times first. If you get lucky, great. If not, you can do the combine/enchant an hour before the raid and be good to go.
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby atropos457 » Thu Apr 16, 2009 4:29 pm

Elsie gave you a fantastic list, but for completeness I'd also point out the sites from the sticky: http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=21498. There are several gear lists in there, ranging from quest gear to craftable to a full pre-raid gearset.

Just to second some posts here, the Cloak of Bloodied (Bloody?) Waters is an excellent investment - you won't replace it until Naxx25, and you can pick one up on the AH for ~50-100g on most servers. If you're struggling with the hit cap, that's a priority for sure. Vengeance Bindings are cheap and readily available on the AH, and are probably the best you'll find before high level BoE or Naxx.

The single best purchase if you can pick up a decent weapon, IMO, would be the Titansteel helm. Relatively cheap, close to Best-in-Slot, and heaps of hit rating. If you can't get one of the heroic weapons to drop, grab a Destroyer. Everyone has them for a reason.
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby Año » Fri Apr 17, 2009 8:05 am

Elsie wrote:Libram: Venture Landing coin libram isn't bad. The borean tundra one is worse, badge one is useless, and deadly/h.naxx one probably out of your reach at this point



Just fyi, the venture co coin libram got mega nerf, the borean tundra one is best in slot fo ret till the HNaxx/PVP one
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby honorshammer » Fri Apr 17, 2009 4:07 pm

Which Badge belt? I've heard the leather is good, but the plate has STR. Rawr and MaxDPS both say the Leather belt, but I'm not sure. STR is by far our best stat as PVE Ret.

Jorach's Crocolisk Skin Belt http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40694 v Verdungo's Barbarian Cord http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40688

Heres the comparison http://www.wowhead.com/?compare=40694;40688

40 Agi
116 AP
38 Expertise

versus

38 Sta
58 Str (more than 116 AP)
944 Armor
2 Crit
30 Haste

Which one do I buy?
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby majiben » Fri Apr 17, 2009 4:12 pm

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=43829 is a good trinket to start off with and beat the http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37390 if I remember correctly.
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby Elsie » Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:54 pm

Which Badge belt? I've heard the leather is good, but the plate has STR. Rawr and MaxDPS both say the Leather belt, but I'm not sure. STR is by far our best stat as PVE Ret.

STR is not our best stat. Hit is, then STR, then Expertise shortly behind. Remember though STR is simply 2.53 AP. The leather belt is superior due to the AGI/AP and Expertise being overall better than STR/Haste.
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby honorshammer » Fri Apr 17, 2009 7:25 pm

Elsie wrote:
Which Badge belt? I've heard the leather is good, but the plate has STR. Rawr and MaxDPS both say the Leather belt, but I'm not sure. STR is by far our best stat as PVE Ret.

STR is not our best stat. Hit is, then STR, then Expertise shortly behind. Remember though STR is simply 2.53 AP. The leather belt is superior due to the AGI/AP and Expertise being overall better than STR/Haste.


Thanks for your help Elsie. Still learning the Ret ropes. I broke 2k in a Heroic for the first time tonight.
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Re: Ret [PVE] need quick gear help

Postby Elsie » Sat Apr 18, 2009 2:14 am

Honorshammer wrote:
Elsie wrote:
Which Badge belt? I've heard the leather is good, but the plate has STR. Rawr and MaxDPS both say the Leather belt, but I'm not sure. STR is by far our best stat as PVE Ret.

STR is not our best stat. Hit is, then STR, then Expertise shortly behind. Remember though STR is simply 2.53 AP. The leather belt is superior due to the AGI/AP and Expertise being overall better than STR/Haste.


Thanks for your help Elsie. Still learning the Ret ropes. I broke 2k in a Heroic for the first time tonight.

In terms of weights, I think hit is something like 216-226, str is 166, and expertise 156. Your preferred modeler and preference may vary.

Of course, heroics is a bit different since they, not being boss level, could have significantly different levels of miss/dodge. Heroics also have a ton more trash time which is usually level 70 as opposed to raid dps which is usually boss centric. In aoe circumstances obviously str comes out far ahead since consecrate and divine storm are nearly all that matters. Also, you generally won't have full raid buffs and, as paladins, we scale from damn near every raid buff somehow - even spell hit/crit on exorcism.
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