[10]naxx, 4 horsemen, 2 healers

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[10]naxx, 4 horsemen, 2 healers

Postby daemonym » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:28 am

so the way we've been doing this fight is the normal switch at 3. our dps isn't strong enough to zerg thane in 4 marks (best would be 30%) so we've had a holy pally and a caster tanking in the back and everybody else up front with a healer for thane and baron. but we're thinking of dropping the 3rd healer and going with just 2 so i was wondering how this is done with just 2 healers. mind you, 4 of the group is well geared and the other 6 are right on the line of naxx ready and do some more heroics.

it seems to me that you'd need a healer in the back and 1 on each of the melee tanks up front. does it work with like a spriest in holy gear or something like that in the back keeping them 2 alive?
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Postby Anubisknight » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:40 am

When we did this with 2 healers, our group composition was -

1 tankadin (me), 1 DK, 1 tree, 1 healadin, 1 retadin and 5 other dps.

The retadin and healadin tanked the back two mobs on their own, keeping themselves healed. I tanked the baron, keeping myself healed. The rest of the group took down Thane. Blow heroism right at the start of the fight. If you have a hunter, have him'/her MD to the Thane tank. We managed to kill him off just before the 5th mark from what I recall.

One other possibility would be to use a priest and another low dps tanking the back two horsemen, with the priest using binding heal (not sure if I got the spell name right) while a paladin solo tanks the baron and the rest take down Thane.
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Postby Biscotti » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:49 am

that number of hybrids makes it pretty easy. I'm looking at running Naxx next week with:

Prot Paladin (me)
Feral Druid
Priest x2
Fury Warr
Hunter x2
Mage
Warlock
Rogue

Seems to me our best chance will be Feral+healer, Warlock+Void (self heal), Me (self heal), Fury Warr + healer. Fun. :)
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Postby daemonym » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:53 am

Anubisknight wrote:When we did this with 2 healers, our group composition was -

1 tankadin (me), 1 DK, 1 tree, 1 healadin, 1 retadin and 5 other dps.

The retadin and healadin tanked the back two mobs on their own, keeping themselves healed. I tanked the baron, keeping myself healed. The rest of the group took down Thane. Blow heroism right at the start of the fight. If you have a hunter, have him'/her MD to the Thane tank. We managed to kill him off just before the 5th mark from what I recall.

One other possibility would be to use a priest and another low dps tanking the back two horsemen, with the priest using binding heal (not sure if I got the spell name right) while a paladin solo tanks the baron and the rest take down Thane.


is it really feasible to solo tank baron w/o a healer up to 5 stacks? i mean my gear is good but it's not zomgz good. also our average raid dps is about 12k dps including 1 tank (before bloodlust). our lowest dps'er is between 16-1700.
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Postby Anubisknight » Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:00 am

5 stacks could get a bit dicey. But if you use up all your cds, pots, nightmare seed, healthstone.. you could pull it off. Have the priest pws you just before the pull to mitigate the initial damage (however less it may be, it'll help), hots from other healers/shadow priests. Remember to keep sacred shield up.
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Postby dmok » Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:22 am

For 2-healer 4H, you can have 1 healer heal both baron and thane tanks until thane dies if your dps is good enough (should be 4 stacks). Yes, this means they will be taking double-stack damage until thane is dead.

At this point, run over and you (or another healing-capeable dps, but preferably you) start healing the other tank by spamming flash heal while the healer waits for its stacks to fall off. Then you resume like normal.
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Postby Playdoh » Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:16 am

yes,

We had a spriest and boomkin usually in the back. They can stand at a distance and heal each other and switch at 3.

Anymore than 3 stacks gets VERY dicey though.
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Postby daemonym » Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:24 am

Playdoh wrote:yes,

We had a spriest and boomkin usually in the back. They can stand at a distance and heal each other and switch at 3.

Anymore than 3 stacks gets VERY dicey though.


well here's the usual raid comp for us:

prot pally
prot warr
holy priest
holy pally
tree
rogue
*DW death knight
ele shammy
*arcane/frost mage
*s priest

* = over 2600 dps

what we'd do is have the holy pally respec ret (also 2600+ dps) with that in mind you're thinking the ele shammy and s priest can keep themselves alive in the back and leave the 2 healers up front on the melee tanks? all the classes w/o a * are anywhere from 1600-1800 dps, hence my concern of blowing up thane while hugging 5 stacks of the debuff.
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Postby Malthrax » Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:43 am

daemonym wrote:well here's the usual raid comp for us:
prot pally
prot warr
holy priest
holy pally
tree
rogue
*DW death knight
ele shammy
*arcane/frost mage
*s priest

* = over 2600 dps

Holy Paladin and Elemental Shaman tank the ranged bosses in the back, swapping positions at 3 marks, and healing themselves/each-other.

Holy priest heals you, Tree heals warrior - they swap at 3 marks

You tank Rivendare. Warrior tanks Thane. DK, Mage, Rogue, and sPriest burn down Thane. Warrior taunts Rivendare off you, you run to platform to let the marks fall off, DPS kills Rivendare.

Between a tree and a holy priest, there's no reason why you can't stay up - use DP, LoH, SacredShield, heal pot, and self-heal.

You have more than enough DPS to zerg Thane. Pop bloodlust and go for it. You're geared well enough to live through a 5-stack of mark of rivendare, too.
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Postby Playdoh » Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:54 am

daemonym wrote:well here's the usual raid comp for us:

prot pally
prot warr
holy priest
holy pally
tree
rogue
*DW death knight
ele shammy
*arcane/frost mage
*s priest

* = over 2600 dps

what we'd do is have the holy pally respec ret (also 2600+ dps) with that in mind you're thinking the ele shammy and s priest can keep themselves alive in the back and leave the 2 healers up front on the melee tanks? all the classes w/o a * are anywhere from 1600-1800 dps, hence my concern of blowing up thane while hugging 5 stacks of the debuff.


Yes that would work very well.

I always ended up with 5 stacks of the debuff, healing it was never an issue. 6 stacks was impossible though.

Back always switched at 3 stacks, and my healer and I would go to the back as soon as we could.

I will see if I have a wws report I can link to you when I get home.
Last edited by Playdoh on Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby daemonym » Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:58 am

Malthrax wrote:
daemonym wrote:well here's the usual raid comp for us:
prot pally
prot warr
holy priest
holy pally
tree
rogue
*DW death knight
ele shammy
*arcane/frost mage
*s priest

* = over 2600 dps

Holy Paladin and Elemental Shaman tank the ranged bosses in the back, swapping positions at 3 marks, and healing themselves/each-other.

Holy priest heals you, Tree heals warrior - they swap at 3 marks

You tank Rivendare. Warrior tanks Thane. DK, Mage, Rogue, and sPriest burn down Thane. Warrior taunts Rivendare off you, you run to platform to let the marks fall off, DPS kills Rivendare.

Between a tree and a holy priest, there's no reason why you can't stay up - use DP, LoH, SacredShield, heal pot, and self-heal.

You have more than enough DPS to zerg Thane. Pop bloodlust and go for it. You're geared well enough to live through a 5-stack of mark of rivendare, too.


you missed one thing though:

daemonym wrote:we're thinking of dropping the 3rd healer and going with just 2 so i was wondering how this is done with just 2 healers.


i know how the fight goes with 3 healers, we do it flawlessly each week, just wanting to know how people run it with 2.
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Postby Malthrax » Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:48 am

daemonym wrote:
Malthrax wrote:
daemonym wrote:well here's the usual raid comp for us:
prot pally
prot warr
holy priest
holy pally
tree
rogue
*DW death knight
ele shammy
*arcane/frost mage
*s priest

* = over 2600 dps

Holy Paladin and Elemental Shaman tank the ranged bosses in the back, swapping positions at 3 marks, and healing themselves/each-other.

Holy priest heals you, Tree heals warrior - they swap at 3 marks

You tank Rivendare. Warrior tanks Thane. DK, Mage, Rogue, and sPriest burn down Thane. Warrior taunts Rivendare off you, you run to platform to let the marks fall off, DPS kills Rivendare.

Between a tree and a holy priest, there's no reason why you can't stay up - use DP, LoH, SacredShield, heal pot, and self-heal.

You have more than enough DPS to zerg Thane. Pop bloodlust and go for it. You're geared well enough to live through a 5-stack of mark of rivendare, too.


you missed one thing though:

daemonym wrote:we're thinking of dropping the 3rd healer and going with just 2 so i was wondering how this is done with just 2 healers.


i know how the fight goes with 3 healers, we do it flawlessly each week, just wanting to know how people run it with 2.

Ok... The way your original post was worded made it sound, to me, like you guys were having problems getting it done with 3 healers and your DPS, and were looking for a 2 healer / moar DPS strategy to make it work.

Priest in the back, Tree in the front. Roll HoTs, keep PW:Shield up, swap Priest & Tree every 2 stacks (since they'll take double-stacks of the Marks). Put your top DPS on Thane and get him out of the equation asap.

Have the rogue & shammy throw on their Sapphiron frost-resist sets (lol) for more stamina and they can tank the ranged guys by just standing there /dancing.
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Postby Wolvar » Thu Feb 12, 2009 12:11 pm

is it really feasible to solo tank baron w/o a healer up to 5 stacks? i mean my gear is good but it's not zomgz good. also our average raid dps is about 12k dps including 1 tank (before bloodlust). our lowest dps'er is between 16-1700.


Yep, I tank him to 5 stacks all the time without using LOH. Wait until 4th stack to pop bubblewall, use pot and lock rock if you have it before then. Self heals and seal of light, you have to keep yourself near to max health at all times. I usually use an armor pot just before pull.

Also, don't use mana on anything but holy shield, judgement of light to keep it up (not each refresh) and holy light.
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Postby Spectrum » Thu Feb 12, 2009 1:12 pm

We've always done it by zerging Thane down with as many as 5 stacks. The times we've hit 6 have been wipes. We put one priest on each tank. In the back we usually have our elemental shaman and one other hybrid or a hunter. They manage and swap as needed.

We usually don't have all our DPS averaging over 2k, and the two that go to the back are two of our better DPSers. With Heroism we still manage to get Thane down before 6 if people know what's going on.

We usually run:

1 Prot pally (me)
1 Unholy DK tank
2 Priests
1 Elemental Shaman
2 Hunters
1 DPS DK
1 Mage
2 other DPS depending on what we can find.
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Postby daemonym » Thu Feb 12, 2009 1:39 pm

Wolvar wrote:
is it really feasible to solo tank baron w/o a healer up to 5 stacks? i mean my gear is good but it's not zomgz good. also our average raid dps is about 12k dps including 1 tank (before bloodlust). our lowest dps'er is between 16-1700.


Yep, I tank him to 5 stacks all the time without using LOH. Wait until 4th stack to pop bubblewall, use pot and lock rock if you have it before then. Self heals and seal of light, you have to keep yourself near to max health at all times. I usually use an armor pot just before pull.

Also, don't use mana on anything but holy shield, judgement of light to keep it up (not each refresh) and holy light.


i'll have to try this next time just to see if i can. and why only use mana on HS and JoL debuff refreshes, are you casting holy light on yourself or something?
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