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[25] Problems with Patchwerk

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Postby Fridmarr » Mon Feb 02, 2009 11:37 am

I don't think you were an idiot for going with 1 OT, but if guides are suggesting that for progression, they are stupid. The amount of damage to be healed isn't the problem, it's the rate of damage. You don't need a lot of healers, you need their timing to be spot on. Druids are a bit lower on avoidance (bears can't parry btw) but they can have the armor and health to live through 2 hits unhealed, but in my experience they generally don't have that much stamina on a progression kill.

In any event, congrats on the kill.
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Postby Rasmfrackn » Mon Feb 02, 2009 1:12 pm

Jagang wrote:A few people commented 'The problem was you only had 1 OT taking hatefuls, idiot.' Many other guides I've read have found it benefecial to the healers to let them focus on one target versus two. However, it seems for most of those groups they had a 40k health druid or a DK with very high dodge/parry.


It's not so much only having 1 OT as realizing that whichever OT has more max hitpoints is going to be eating the majority of the strikes. It pays to allocate more healing to the primary OT, as he's the one who's going to be targetting for strikes until he gets hit and only until he's below the other OT. So, the second OT should never take 2 in a row because the first OT should be getting healed by then.

If you're trying to do it with only 1 OT at all, your melee is going to hate you as 1 gets picked off every time the healers are a little slow.

Basically what you'd really need is 1-2 healers on the MT, 3ish healers on the primary OT, and maybe 1-2 healers on the secondary OT. If you keep healing the primary OT, the secondary OT and his healers have a relatively boring job.
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Postby search66 » Wed Feb 04, 2009 8:45 am

I'm having problems too, so I'm going to follow the suggestions posted here. I was taking the hateful strikes, and got hammered when Patchie got to around 25%. This is a progression kill, so I'll be sure to have 3 tanks taking him.

Thanks, and I hope to report success tonight!
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Postby sherck » Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:10 am

I did 25-man Patch for the first time last night.

Weakest tank was MT and the 2 better tanks were OT.

Resto Shaman # 1 spam-healed First OT with Chain Heal (with splash to the other 2 tanks)
Resto Shaman # 2 spam-healed second OT with Chain Heal (with spalsh to the other 2 tanks)
Resto Druid kept the MT HoTed up and then did DPS
Holy Paladin (me) Beaconed one OT and healed the second OT with chain-cast Holy Light the entire fight for Glyph splash healing goodness.

The other 2 healers did full-time DPS.

Worked like a charm. Neither of the Shamans nor myself were ever below 35% mana before Patch was down.

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Re: Problems with Patchwerk (25 man)

Postby Dianora » Wed Feb 04, 2009 10:01 am

Jagang wrote:A long time reader of maintankadin, this is my first post after repeatedly getting hung up on Patchwerk the past two weeks. I've researched his method of choosing people for hatefuls, watched the videos, and tried different strategies (2 OTs vs. 1 OT focused by healers).

I guess we're at a point where people are wondering if the tanks are simply undergeared. Armory: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... &n=Jaggang

My questions are, is my gear sufficient? And has anyone here seen success OTing with a paladin? I'm about to resort to just recruiting a pug Feral Tank with 40k hp.

Just a little more background, tried it with 7 healers last fight with 2 on MT and 5 on me (3 Paladins, Priest, and Druid). Things always go well until I usually doge/parry 3-4 Hatefuls in a row, and then suddenly eat 2 Hatefuls in a row. Perhaps Paladins are just inherently hard to precast/react with their heals? Or perhaps with that many Paladins, a 2nd OT is needed to relieve stress? (Our initial attempts with 2 OTs produced dismal results).

Appreciate any advice, and hope this thread helps other tankadins struggling to down Patch for their shield.


Don't know why you need that much health to OT Patch. We ran with DK main tanking Patch the past 2 weeks, and my biggest problem is trying NOT to out threat the DK tank since he needs a bit of time to settle down.
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Postby Halford » Wed Feb 04, 2009 1:14 pm

My apologies if this has been discussed for Patch or other fights... but what about the feasibility of Hand of Sacrifice?

So if the tank gets hit for 20K then something like 6.6K would be inflicted on the Holy Pally. If the Holy Pally bubbles, he takes no damage for the duration of the Hand of Sacrifice, right?

I would think doing this during the enrage may be helpful, especially after the tanks' shieldwall / bubblewalls have expired.
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Postby dmok » Wed Feb 04, 2009 2:01 pm

Halford wrote:I would think doing this during the enrage may be helpful, especially after the tanks' shieldwall / bubblewalls have expired.

He's enraged for more than 12s?

In all seriousness, it does work if the holy pally bubbles before applying it. Otherwise 2 quick hits to hit target and he could be in trouble.
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Postby Belarkan » Thu Feb 05, 2009 7:47 am

Not sure waisting 2 GCD just before the enrage is a good idea.
Juste let the tank pops his shield wall or whatever the equivalent he has.
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Postby lilbitty » Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:16 am

I usually MT this fight with a druid and war, or 2 wars OT'ing so I can set the threat pace high. Also I have the wars use vigilance on me so they can get a threat boost . Other than healers getting used to the fight, I would recomend having your mele remove fort from their buffs and also run in and out of the slime at the start of the fight to keep their hp low. this way you dont have to worry about a hatefull landing on dps imbetween heals. As every one has mentioned here pally healers are the way to go , druid healers on this fight seem to be the most inefficent . If we have a druid healing on this fight I usually have them spamming hots on the two OT's
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Postby Wolvar » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:21 am

STOP SENDING THE DPS INTO THE SLIME. WTF??

Hatefuls are based on aggro first, hitpoints second. The ONLY time you might care about your dps hitpoints is if you only have one OT on heroic mode. Otherwise, for the love of god, stop wasting time taking a bath in the slime.
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Postby Kellel » Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:26 pm

I second the pally healer motion.

Our guild was having trouble with it, and our army of resto druids kept complaining about the tanks gear level. They were fine, with 35-37k raid buffed ...

I kept saying .. holy pally's! holy pally's! .. and essentially volunteered myself to go respec haha ..

After a couple weeks of me and another pally tank building our holy offset's we both walked in there with about 1800 spwr, 25% crit with 19k mana ... not too shabby, but nothing spectacular compared to the gear level of our resto's ...

i beacon'd strike tank #2 and healed #1, other pally did reverse ...
once i finally convinced the drruids to stop hotting up the strike tanks it was smooth sailing and we one shotted him lol.

hot's on the strike tanks don't just .. NOT help .. they actually put the tanks in jeapordy. if you can't land a big heal on him .. better to have NO heals lol .. if you have OP healers .. the 3rd strike tank will rarely get hit .. but he makes a nice buffer. We had our forest of resto's hot up the MT and that was plenty to keep him alive .. we also had a priest and shaman spamming greater heals on whichever strike tank was down the lowest.

it's important to note as well ... spam holy lights ... even if your tank appears to have full health lol .. if he has full health .. it's a pretty good chance he's going to get spanked by the time your HL get's off.
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Postby Erutaron » Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:44 pm

When we do this on 25man, I normally MT with a Warrior and DK OT's. We normally have 6 or 7 healers (always 3 Holy pallies)

We assign 1 holy pally to each tank and assign them each a Beacon target. They spam, resto shaman Cheal thru the tanks they were assigned to, Patchwerk dies, we collect loots.....Simple and quick

Favorite WTF moment on Patchwerk thought, was a couple weeks back. I was in a pug 25man, only had 4 melee, 3 tanks, 6 healers, 12 Ranged.....

Was going smooth until 30% when 2 of our healers DC'd and both OT's went down, followed by the melee of course, The 2 healers got back in and started spamming me along with the other 4.

I solo tanked him down to about 13% before his strikes overwhelmed the healers and I was outta CD's to compensate. Was still pretty crazy how far we got him with only 1 tank up tanking the hateful strikes and the regular melee attacks.
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Postby Indago » Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:15 pm

Just looking for any helpful suggestions, or to see if there is something I can do to help the raid down patch, but the last 2 nights we haven't been able to get him down. For both nights, we used 3 tanks and 6 healers. The pally with the lowest EH was MT with a pally and a tree healing him, then myself and the warrior who is usually the group's MT were offtanking the hatefuls. The warrior had another pally and a holy priest healing him, and I had a tree and a resto shammy on me.

Almost every time we get about 1/2 way through then one of the OTs would take a dirt nap and it would fall apart from there. Someone in the raid had an addon that showed every hateful, who it landed on, and how much dmg it did or whether it was avoided. From what I could tell I would dodge/parry 2 or 3 in a row and then have a string where they all hit and the healers couldn't keep up. Last night I used the dodge trinket over the stam one I had in and seemed to last a little longer, at least it was our best attempt so far, but I still died when it was on cd.
I keep saving bubblewall for if it goes into enrage, but we never get that far. I'm just wondering if there isn't something I can do to increase my survivability, or if I'm just undergeared (armory is on my sig).
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Postby dmok » Mon Feb 09, 2009 7:07 am

Indago wrote:The pally with the lowest EH was MT with a pally and a tree healing him, then myself and the warrior who is usually the group's MT were offtanking the hatefuls. The warrior had another pally and a holy priest healing him, and I had a tree and a resto shammy on me.

Put the pallys healers on the OTs. Bacon the other OT, and go nuts.

If you throw the resto shammy on the MT, he can chain heal and it should hit all 3 tanks giving them the armour buff should it crit.
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Postby Janduin » Mon Feb 09, 2009 9:02 am

Pallypete wrote:Heck, 3 paladins could probably heal the whole fight themselves with Bacon.


dmok wrote:Bacon the other OT, and go nuts.


OMG WTB heals in the form of hot, greasy bacon.
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