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How long does T6 last

All things related to the expansion

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Postby majiben » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:46 pm

You'll replace Karazhan/Tier 4 stuff around level 71-73
You'll replace Tier 5/Early Badge stuff around level 72-76
You'll replace Tier 6/2nd-Generation Badge stuff around level 76-78 (a few might go all the way to 80 but that is not the norm)
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Postby PsiVen » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:56 pm

You will replace anything less than T5 by 72, anything less than T6 by 75, and anything less than Sunwell gear by 78. A couple SW pieces are worth keeping until 80 epics.

It is possible to keep items slightly longer than normal just because of the enchants you have on them. So it's unlikely that you'll change your legs out before 80 raids unless you get a new kit for them, etc. Except as Maji points out, you'll replace your legs and gloves anyway because the crafted BS ones have so much defense that you have no choice.
Last edited by PsiVen on Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby majiben » Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:29 pm

Sadly many will be forced to use These pants simply because they provide a huge amount of defense, twice as much as Sunwell pants.

Though regemming them with wotlk gems might make the sunwell gear usable
Last edited by majiben on Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby mavfin » Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:35 pm

By the time you hit 80, ilvl differences are starting to make armor values significant, so your T6 will start going away when armor becomes more important. Also, DR on avoidance will start to bite, too.
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Postby Worldie » Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:53 pm

Majiben wrote:Sadly many will be forced to use These pants simply because they provide a huge amount of defense, twice as much as Sunwell pants.

Though regemming them might make te sunwell gear usable

SHAME I HAD ALREADY GEMMED ALL FOR DEFENSE

Yea i foresaw the future.
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:37 pm

Worldie wrote:
Majiben wrote:Sadly many will be forced to use These pants simply because they provide a huge amount of defense, twice as much as Sunwell pants.

Though regemming them might make te sunwell gear usable

SHAME I HAD ALREADY GEMMED ALL FOR DEFENSE

Yea i foresaw the future.

You're even more of a defence whore than I am.

/boggle.

PS: Can Worldie and Psiven stop contradicting each other re whether my Sunwell gear will work for Heroics.

Have a pit fight or something. I want clear directives so I don't have to think for myself.
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Postby majiben » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:40 pm

Knaughty wrote:
Worldie wrote:
Majiben wrote:Sadly many will be forced to use These pants simply because they provide a huge amount of defense, twice as much as Sunwell pants.

Though regemming them with wotlk gems might make the sunwell gear usable

SHAME I HAD ALREADY GEMMED ALL FOR DEFENSE

Yea i foresaw the future.

You're even more of a defence whore than I am.

/boggle.

PS: Can Worldie and Psiven stop contradicting each other re whether my Sunwell gear will work for Heroics.

Have a pit fight or something. I want clear directives so I don't have to think for myself.
You can if it has lots of sockets.
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Postby Darus » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:00 pm

that gear is alright to maintank naxx10 atleast, defense cap is nice but not needed since the content is very easy in general.
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Postby Tieran » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:08 pm

I have been looking at certain pieces and how gemming them may make them viable naxx10 tanking.

For example the Muru chest piece gemmed with two 16 def gems becomes a nice piece, and I suppose the same applies to the legs / hands.
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Postby Ryuusuke » Mon Nov 03, 2008 11:44 pm

Patchwerk while being critable? I don't see that pretty comfortable xD

Most of us SW/T6 Users can do a lot of stuff with just regemming our items. Few pieces (Rings, Neck, Back) will change really soon, but most of the Setparts (regemmed to def) will take a long way into our journey ;)
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Postby PsiVen » Tue Nov 04, 2008 12:04 am

You'd be fine to tank heroics if all you did was ding 80 and put def gems in your existing gear. But if you want to have optimized gear you're going to see upgrades that you don't have much choice in. For example:

Gloves -> 78 Blue vs. SWP
Two rare defense gems in the gloves, right? Well, you're still 17 Defense short. Is all that dodge, parry, and some stamina worth losing the armor and defense? No, the crit cap is more important.

The example we already saw:
Pants -> 78 Blue vs. SWP or SWP
In this case 3 rare defense gems and the pants have defense equal to the blues, as well as arguably superior stats otherwise (15 sta 4 str 96 armor vs 33 BV 34 dodge). If you're not a miner, it's questionable that you'll even want to put 3 rare 80 gems in an old piece.

Might as well go down the list at this point.

Belt -> 80 Blue or 80 Blue > SWP, no straight pre-80 upgrade but 74 Blue has more defense.

Boots -> 78 Blue > SWP

Helm -> 80 Blue or 80 Blue vs SWP
Also look at the 80 Epic Crafted and consider that Uther's has 153 stamina effectively 400 extra armor if you choose to gem for it. The heroic helm is a sidegrade that offers slightly more def/armor/str for less BV, but if you have this helm you probably won't feel the need to farm it.

Shoulders -> 78 Blue vs. SWP
This blue comes from an 80 instance, and is a direct sidegrade (you want dodge or SBV?)

Chest -> 78 Blue < SWP
Another 80 instance drop, this time the SWP item pulls ahead slightly. ~100 armor for more defense and dodge instead of parry. An 80 Blue edges it out.

Bracers -> 77 Blue vs. SWP
Hard call here, you get more defense but lose out on a fair amount of other stats.

Trinkets:
As you can see the choices are limited. You will need an excess of defense to upgrade your trinkets beyond SMI+Scarab and you might even be stuck with unsavory alternatives.

Rings:
Few upgrades exist for defense, and pre-raid options sacrifice a lot of stats for defense.

Necks:
A couple options exist at 80, but not before.

Cloaks:
Unsurprisingly, there are numerous upgrades to the best-in-slot badge cloak which has low defense. The SWP cloak is not an option as it has no defense at all.

Bottom line, it depends on how accessible you find gems and enchants. If you're fully decked in SWP gear and want to stay that way, it's gonna take a lot of rare gems to stay afloat in the defense department and you'll still be stuck making a tough decision or two that leaves you with a questionable sidegrade. On the other hand, if you have trouble getting enchants right away you won't be able to change certain pieces before you hit T7 regardless.

Here's my personal plan. Note that I get +32 defense rating from BS-only slots.
Helm -> Keep until T7.
Shoulders -> Keep until T7.
Chest -> Keep until T7.
Bracers -> Keep until T7, add BS socket.
Gloves -> Replace @ 78, add BS socket.
Waist -> Replace @ 80, add BS socket.
Legs -> Keep until T7.
Boots -> Replace @ 78.

Neck -> Replace @ 80.
Rings -> Keep until T7.
Cloak -> Replace @ 78.
Trinkets -> Replace 1 @ 80 & Keep 1 until T7.
Last edited by PsiVen on Tue Nov 04, 2008 1:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby majiben » Tue Nov 04, 2008 12:37 am

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Postby Worldie » Tue Nov 04, 2008 12:40 am

Knaughty wrote:PS: Can Worldie and Psiven stop contradicting each other re whether my Sunwell gear will work for Heroics.

Have a pit fight or something. I want clear directives so I don't have to think for myself.

Shading what Psiven said, it mainly depends on how you gemmed / enchanted. Mainly you will replace everything at 80. Expecially considering some of us fail at drop rates.
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Postby maurok » Tue Nov 04, 2008 5:09 am

so...
In my case for example, I´m geared with some nice badges (100 badges chest and legs), some ZA (shoulders, boots, ring), some T4 (Helm and Gloves), and the rest are kara/gruuls/mag epics... my guild is around the same place as I am. But it´s been really hard making 25-man since ppl lost the interest in raiding. they are all "waiting for WoTLK".
Do you think once the expansion hits, it would worth making tries on MH/BT or even SWP when we get around 72~73?

for what I read, by this time we would all be at least with T5 equivalent gear from the expansion, and we could get some items that would last for a good time. would those instances be much easier with the extra HP/Mana/Skills/Talents from these 2~3 lvls?
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Postby Bhall » Tue Nov 04, 2008 5:09 am

I saw several reports of patchwerk 10-man where the tanks were not crit immune, so its definitly doable.

I dont think its rly worth it to sacrifice everything for defense. You can always use defense elixir and maybe there is also a defense food to get some extra.
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