Venting thread

All things related to the expansion

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Postby ziggyunderslashone » Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:56 am

I hope I haven't passed into needlessly negative, but I do think criticism is important. If only to establish that there is an issue, part of blizzards "keeping an eye on it" involves our feedback.

I really do love my paladin, and the changes they've made for wotlk have been massively impressive. And while I've no doubt we'll see work going in for 3.1, rounding if not completing the spec, I am concerned about entering wotlk as a work in progress.

Perhaps it's purely a perception thing on my part, which is why my issue is largely with the nature of blizz's two way information service.

I wanted to fit a "playing with a full deck" line in there somewhere, but it was clunky.
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Postby Aranbenjo » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:06 am

I don't think blizz nerf pallys for fun...
Balancing is their primary goal and i think it's the right way to go.
They want to make money ... the more the ppl are happy, the more the money they make. Warriors are Tons ... pallys are few....

What i'm really concerned is about the fact that still in 3.0 there's no viable path to build a good pally class.
Nowdays they are concerned about the 11-pt talent on prot because of the retry consequences ... !!!!
I think this is not planning a place for pally ... this is fixxing bug forever!!!

That's it ...
It's not a problem of being viable at tanking ... it's a problem that very few guilds feels pally special enough to invest on them. There are classes that does the same things at the same pace (if not better).
PALLADIN IT'S A PERPETUAL BETA CLASS
... and i think nothing special to invest ... (yeah! they have good buffs ... )

Btw ... i will still play my pally ... I LOVE the song of htor ... :D
But in the meanwhile i'm taking care of dofferent toons ...
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Postby Dehn » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:13 am

Worldie wrote:Ulush, you cannot consider Vanilla, simply because in vanilla paladin tank tree just didn't exist. Pretending to tank as paladin was as wrong as pretending to DPS as shaman.


I raid-tanked in Vanilla.. JoW, manapots, mp/5 trinkets etc.. Not on progression, but was a solid offtank, and did tank stuff like Onyxia, and MC bosses pre 2.0.
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Postby Gamingdevil » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:31 am

I just can't get passed the fact that they are nerfing the entire class because one spec is overpowered. Nerf their talents ffs, or nerf them somewhere else that doesn't hurt us. I'm sick of getting worse because of "collateral damage"
I'm sure as hell not rerolling, spent too much time on my character and love it too much for that. But I still haven't pre-ordered wrath and if they keep screwing us like this I'm just going to go play WAR with the rest of my friends...
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Postby Barathorn » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:36 am

Gamingdevil wrote:I just can't get passed the fact that they are nerfing the entire class because one spec is overpowered.


It is happening, and I know you don't want to hear it but get over it. Its not the end of the world. Things will get better with time. It really just comes down to 'how much time' before things get sorted out.

We are miles ahead of where we used to be, I am very happy :).

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Postby ulushnar » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:37 am

Gamingdevil wrote:But I still haven't pre-ordered wrath and if they keep screwing us like this I'm just going to go play WAR with the rest of my friends...


Please do. I'm sure your twenty lost bucks will be the ones that make Blizzard see sense.
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:41 am

Ulushnar wrote:
Gamingdevil wrote:But I still haven't pre-ordered wrath and if they keep screwing us like this I'm just going to go play WAR with the rest of my friends...


Please do. I'm sure your twenty lost bucks will be the ones that make Blizzard see sense.

QQers have friends?
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Postby ulushnar » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:42 am

Knaughty wrote:
Ulushnar wrote:
Gamingdevil wrote:But I still haven't pre-ordered wrath and if they keep screwing us like this I'm just going to go play WAR with the rest of my friends...


Please do. I'm sure your twenty lost bucks will be the ones that make Blizzard see sense.

QQers have friends?


They have support groups.
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Postby Elsie » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:58 am

They want to make money ... the more the ppl are happy, the more the money they make. Warriors are Tons ... pallys are few....

This doesn't hold true necessarily for all blizzard's constituents. Particularly speaking, it's possible that having an underpowered class increases the enjoyment for enough people who do not play that class to have an overall increase in "happiness." To put it bluntly, people enjoy being mechanically stronger - in anything. Some people, excepts, also enjoy to whine and need something to whine about. Some people enjoy abuse. etc.
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Postby Gamingdevil » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:11 am

Hey, I thought this was a venting thread, I just wanted it out of my system. Leave me alone :cry:
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Postby ulushnar » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:13 am

I'm venting too.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:15 am

Explains the smell.
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Postby Barathorn » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:24 am

Gamingdevil wrote:Hey, I thought this was a venting thread, I just wanted it out of my system. Leave me alone :cry:


I understand matey, I really do, and take no notice of that nasty Scotsman, bad Ulushnar!

Venting is good, constuctive discussion and debate is good. Negativity is negative, as is QQ about something over which we have little control.

As a community, unity will get us through this.

We have become lazy and are living on past glories of TBC. Now is the time to show what we can do when hard pressed and backed into a corner.

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Postby Macha » Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:06 am

QQing might be futile...just like QQing about QQing. ^^ It's all the same at the end of the day, it's all the same. Crying and QQing about people thinking differently.


@Elsie: Indeed.
Some people also enjoy making broken things work - and I am sure many of them were prot paladins of the first hour. Those of us who made Paladins work as more than healers in classic WOW definitely are in this group.
That's another problem: We're nowhere near as broken enough to make that approach workable. We're not 100% equal yet...but are still close enough so we don't even have to really prove ourselves to our guilds if we are already MTs, either. It's kinda a silly position to be in. I'd rather be back in the "can't do this that and that!" place of 2.4.3, because then I could show it'd work anyway, like I did with ROS p2 pre nerfs. But now everyone knows that we're mostly fine, and I know we're still a bit behind. Nothing to prove, but small things to get annoyed about for us neurotics. Just a wipe here or there that only we know what caused it.

After some thinking...well, I think I might actually be annoyed mostly about this, and less about the viability problems I find. They're small, just annoying as fuck. The lack of challenges, however, is big.

Where's the next frontier? As far as the Paladin goes, there is no undiscovered country anymore and no place to push. There is nothing left to prove or to tweak to make work. We simply can tank all, and everyone believes so, with the sole exception of the "you're hybrids! Only warriors should MT!" minority that is shrinking already.
Heck, even "solotanking multitank fights" has been done before(Cheers to Invisiura.). I already know how to tank Naxx as a Paladin, I did in the beta, I did in life, and I even did some of it at 60.

Maybe I'm less annoyed about the state of the class, and just about the lack of challenges and things to prove. Wonder what I should do about that.
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Postby ulushnar » Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:34 am

Macha wrote:QQing might be futile...just like QQing about QQing. ^^ It's all the same at the end of the day, it's all the same. Crying and QQing about people thinking differently.


Not really.

The difference is, I'm complaining to the people who are currently exhibiting the behaviour that annoys me. Hopefully with the understanding of the distress it causes, they'll abate their behaviour.

The other people on here are complaining to people who by and large agree with them but are equally powerless to implement useful change. That can't be constructive.
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