whoa whoa buff blood/matyr??? wtf

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whoa whoa buff blood/matyr??? wtf

Postby steadypal » Mon Oct 27, 2008 4:38 pm

why not buff sor and sov??
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Postby Levantine » Mon Oct 27, 2008 4:44 pm

Because they don't want Ret using those seals in PvE.

They're buffing Blood for Ret Paladin deeps, not Tankadins.
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Postby ziggyunderslashone » Mon Oct 27, 2008 4:48 pm

Desired effect: Reduction of Retribution DPS
Suggested solution: Nerf Protection TPS

Mindlessly optimistic as ever, I can only hope they're far from done and are making changes back and forth until it slides into place.

Though with that one you have to wonder if they put all the brainstorming notes on a dart board and are picking them at 7 feet 9.25 inches.
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Postby Levantine » Mon Oct 27, 2008 4:50 pm

ziggyunderslashone wrote:Desired effect: Reduction of Retribution DPS
Suggested solution: Nerf Protection TPS

Mindlessly optimistic as ever, I can only hope they're far from done and are making changes back and forth until it slides into place.

Though with that one you have to wonder if they put all the brainstorming notes on a dart board and are picking them at 7 feet 9.25 inches.



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Postby Fridmarr » Mon Oct 27, 2008 4:51 pm

ziggyunderslashone wrote:Desired effect: Reduction of Retribution DPS
Suggested solution: Nerf Protection TPS

Mindlessly optimistic as ever, I can only hope they're far from done and are making changes back and forth until it slides into place.

Though with that one you have to wonder if they put all the brainstorming notes on a dart board and are picking them at 7 feet 9.25 inches.


I have some straws in my pantry they are free to grasp at.

I'm more concerned with the DPS change as opposed to the TPS change, well that and the poor holy pallys, good grief.
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Postby Maihes » Mon Oct 27, 2008 4:52 pm

God that Motivational post is awesome.
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Postby ziggyunderslashone » Mon Oct 27, 2008 5:02 pm

Fridmarr wrote:I'm more concerned with the DPS change as opposed to the TPS change, well that and the poor holy pallys, good grief.

I suppose dps is low on my list of priorities as I'm an efficiency whore, and wouldn't even try to do anything solo other than aoe grind in prot, and I really can't see a situation where people are asking tanks to trade out some health and avoidance to push that extra dps on a boss.

I have it on a mental "That'd be ace" list, but if they can actually pull of balance in the tanking role (which, lets face it is a herculean task that we can expect to be debating until 4.0) I'll be largely content.

As for holy dps, even a rampantly positive spin amounts to "under construction"
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Postby crabcrouton » Mon Oct 27, 2008 5:15 pm

Depending on how much they buff Blood, it wouldn't be out of the question to use it as an offtanking seal.

Even if Blood does less dps/tps than Vengeance by 20%, the combo with Spiritual Attunement would be nice for longevity. Plus Seals are such a small part of our overall dps now, it wouldn't make that much of a diff.
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Postby Fridmarr » Mon Oct 27, 2008 5:47 pm

crabcrouton wrote:Depending on how much they buff Blood, it wouldn't be out of the question to use it as an offtanking seal.

Even if Blood does less dps/tps than Vengeance by 20%, the combo with Spiritual Attunement would be nice for longevity. Plus Seals are such a small part of our overall dps now, it wouldn't make that much of a diff.


It's probably not needed, I can HotR, Judge, and ShoR indefinitely in beta with Blessing of Wisdom on me, JoW on the mob, and Divine Plea. I know JoW is being nerfed, but there'll be other sources of mana in a raid setting, not to mention a higher mana pool to start with.
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Postby Kysen » Mon Oct 27, 2008 5:52 pm

Well GC finally stated that the ret dps cycle consists of 3 buttons. Trying to do anything else = oom. Sounds similar to the prot rotation.

Talk about boring combat, in 3 gcds you are done and just waiting for cds to come back up.

Gonna take another revamp to recover rets gameplay.
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Postby DeadMilliken » Mon Oct 27, 2008 8:33 pm

Seal of Blood was never a "bad" tanking seal...it was mediocre. Better than SoR but lagging behind SoV.

There is a VERY real possibility that SoB will end up being the best damage/threat seal for tankadin.

Pros to SoB:

Works well with HotR, Reckoning.
The damage returned is barely noticeable in Raiding.
It can Crit and is not partially resistable.
(*the judgement used to be 100% hit...unsure if it still is)

Cons:

Not a great PvE grinding seal as the self dmg can be more than Judge of Light can keep balanced.
Can be missed, blocked, dodged, parried.
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Postby PsiVen » Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:00 am

SoB remains a terrible tanking seal.

Cons:
Will fucking kill your ass dead on the ground pushing daisies up with the stench of your rotting carcass which wouldn't stink if you'd only used SoV instead.
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Postby fafhrd » Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:07 am

Kysen wrote:Well GC finally stated that the ret dps cycle consists of 3 buttons. Trying to do anything else = oom. Sounds similar to the prot rotation.

Talk about boring combat, in 3 gcds you are done and just waiting for cds to come back up.

Gonna take another revamp to recover rets gameplay.


well WoW's alternative to that is usually "use all your GCDs on just one button, which has no cooldown" - not really fun either :/
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Postby Macha » Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:23 am

PsiVen wrote:SoB remains a terrible tanking seal.

Cons:
Will fucking kill your ass dead on the ground pushing daisies up with the stench of your rotting carcass which wouldn't stink if you'd only used SoV instead.


THIS.

Anyone here ever had one of these 300 HP survives? Grats - using SoB had wiped you there. Good job, let's just try him again because the Paladin has to damage himself and just wiped the raid.

Terrible, terrible tanking seal.

Gonna take another revamp to recover rets gameplay.


And prots, too.

But I really love that they nerfed all seals across the board...and then only restore the ret one. Where's the logic there? Oh, wait, there's none.
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Postby Dantriges » Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:37 am

Wonder if they will lower consecrates AP coeefficent as that seems to be a better choice for retribution to use right now, rather than single target abilities according to the other thread here.

Has GC actually said anything about our worries regarding prot threat , soloing and leveling?
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