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Frequently *Answered* Questions 3.0.2 & Wrath.

All things related to the expansion

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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:24 pm

At 70, I strongly favour EH/DPS/TPS over avoidance. I don't think it's worth stacking agility because it provides negligible armor, and no synergy - just avoidance on diminishing returns, and some crit that is very poor as a threat stat for us.

Strength provides 2.5 AP per point, and 0.625 BV per point after Kings and Divine Strength.

Stamina converts @ 11% to spell-power, as well as providing EH.

The real gearing priority is something like this:

(1) 540 Defence
(2) Uncrushable, or close to it.
(3) Either threat or EH, depending on the fight.

For (2) I've always been a defence rating slut. I socketed green stam/defence gems any time I had an excuse (yellow slot with a decent stam bonus for colour matching) all the way into Sunwell. Defence kicks ass, IMO.

For (3) - Strength and Stam do double duty as EH & threat. Stam emphasises EH, Str emphasises threat - but both provide both benefits. Expertise gives a lot of threat, and a little mitigation. Hit/Crit provide pure threat only (and crit is bad at providing threat - Str much better). Haste is useless.
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:49 pm

<saved by Psiven>
Last edited by knaughty on Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:31 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:53 pm

Another point regarding your gear sets:

If you do have multiple pieces, don't balance out each piece - emphasise that pieces strength!

If you have two pairs of legs, one with a lot of defence & stamina, and one with str/stam/expertise, then here's what you do:

• Stamina legs get defence / stamina gems & enchants.
• Expertise legs get strength gems & threat enchants.

That way on the EH fight, you have your "max stam" legs. On a TPS fight, you have your TPS legs.
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Postby DanimalEQ » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:06 pm

Knaughty wrote:Expertise is an excellent TPS stat, and it's OK for mitigation. But you can't gem for it, and I don't recall any enchants. So it's useless to bring it up as a gem/enchant option.


I believe they are adding Expertise gems in WotLK:

Resolute Monarch Topaz
Precise Scarlet Ruby
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:08 pm

DanimalEQ wrote:
Knaughty wrote:Expertise is an excellent TPS stat, and it's OK for mitigation. But you can't gem for it, and I don't recall any enchants. So it's useless to bring it up as a gem/enchant option.


I believe they are adding Expertise gems in WotLK:

Resolute Monarch Topaz
Precise Scarlet Ruby


Stupid WoWhead.

I did actually do a search before my post.

http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?items=3&filte ... rs=1;crv=0

Zero results :evil:

Resolute Flawless Ametrine will be a kickass option for a TPS set. Defence/Expertise, and matches both yellow and red sockets.
Last edited by knaughty on Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby majiben » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:10 pm

Yeah they only put some of the wotlk items on the normal site, the others are still on their wotlk site. Half done changes are annoying.
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:11 pm

Majiben wrote:Yeah they only put some of the wotlk items on the normal site, the others are still on their wotlk site. Half done changes are annoying.

I searched the "wotlk" site - I thought that had everything.
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Postby majiben » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:13 pm

Knaughty wrote:
Majiben wrote:Yeah they only put some of the wotlk items on the normal site, the others are still on their wotlk site. Half done changes are annoying.

I searched the "wotlk" site - I thought that had everything.
Must be a bug then. If you do a search for all gems the first one to come up has expertise on it but if you ask for gems with expertise on it you get nada.
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:17 pm

<saved by Psiven>
Last edited by knaughty on Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby PsiVen » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:19 pm

Gemming for Expertise is silly since Strength is better for threat and provides SBV as well. But really I would never gem or gear for threat in the first place with things as they are.
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:26 pm

PsiVen wrote:Gemming for Expertise is silly since Strength is better for threat and provides SBV as well. But really I would never gem or gear for threat in the first place with things as they are.


!

Saved!

If surprise - I would have assumed that Expertise was more TPS per item point than Strength?

More edits incoming, I think...
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:32 pm

kurros wrote:My basic understanding is you want defense until 490 (or 540 @80), and after that you want stamina. Beyond that if you MUST socket a red gem, go agility, and if you MUST socket a yellow gem go defense. Using a defense gem over a dodge gem is an irrelevant comparison, because if you are ignoring the color of the red socket you can just put in a stamina gem. This is for maximum survivability, isn't that the focus of the FAQ?

To maximize your capability at a role it's usually best to focus on what is most important, rather than go for a "well-rounded" setup. If you are doing a progression boss where tank death is the biggest risk, you want to maximize for maximum survivability, not strength gems with some survivability + some threat. And if you are doing a progression boss where maximum tank threat is most important, you want to gem for maximum threat, through expertise, not some moderate threat increase plus moderate survivability increase of strength.*


(1) Yes, defence to 490/540.

(2) Uncrush next. Taking unblocked hits off the attack table is more important than stamina. Think of it like this: Once you're blocking every hit, your block value:
• Counts as AH
• Counts as a heal.

If you have 25k health and 2k BV, and 102.4%, then you actually have 27k health, and every block is a 2k heal.

Once those are done, you want to have two gear options: EH & TPS. Maybe an Avoidance set, but I haven't heard of a tier-7 fight that strongly benefits a pure avoidance setup, and doubt one will eventuate given diminishing returns.

While the theory is that what you want is a EH set with stam gems in every slot, and a TPS set with nothing but expertise/strength, the practice is that three quarters of the gear in your TPS/EH sets is the same gear.

Because the bulk of you gear is in both your TPS & your EH sets, you want your "core gear" to be gemmed and enchanted in a balanced fashion. You're not going to have two Tier-7 chest pieces, one with Str gems, one with stam. Unless you're willing to re-gem and re-enchant from boss to boss, balanced setups tend to win out in practice.

Most of your tuning between your EH and TPS sets is going to be rings/trinkets/neck.

If you're pushing through content fast, emphasise EH. If your guild is a bit cruiser, maybe put in a little more TPS/DPS stuff.

kurros wrote:*This is not based on any testing or number crunching, maybe expertise is worse than I think it is. I haven't seen the comparisons done either way and my natural feeling is that for an uncapped tank expertise is probably the most valuable threat stat.


Strength is better TPS than Expertise. Colour me surprised.

Do pick up any expertise rings/trinkets/necks you can find, and put them in your TPS set.
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Postby kurros » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:37 pm

PsiVen wrote:Gemming for Expertise is silly since Strength is better for threat and provides SBV as well. But really I would never gem or gear for threat in the first place with things as they are.


Just curious what your source is for that.

As expertise is a % increase and strength is a mostly flat increase ,even if expertise is initially worse it may become better at some point due to scaling with gear.
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Postby knaughty » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:39 pm

kurros wrote:
PsiVen wrote:Gemming for Expertise is silly since Strength is better for threat and provides SBV as well. But really I would never gem or gear for threat in the first place with things as they are.


Just curious what your source is for that.

As expertise is a % increase and strength is a mostly flat increase ,even if expertise is initially worse it may become better at some point due to scaling with gear.


Maybe this? :lol:
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Postby djlar » Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:17 am

Re-reading the FAQ and about KINGS, I was in a raid with 4 pallies, including me, I was "pallypowered" for Sanct, I asked for Kings, none of the other 3 had kings ,so I had to king myself but they didn't sanct me, why ret/holy can't spend 1 lousy point on kings? beats me...

Or at least have all the pallies have pallypower installed, I'm not a mindreader LOL.
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