Agility in WotLK

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Agility in WotLK

Postby Eanin » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:43 am

I was looking at some of the threat lists people were coming up with, and Agility was doing surprisingly well, coming in at about one-third of the value of strength.

All things considered, doesn't this make agility a really nice, well balanced stat, maybe worth considering over strength in some cases (or maybe even most cases)? On top of that nice threat boost, we get 0.04% dodge (not affected by diminishing returns) and two armor, plus it is affected by Kings.

So much discussion about threat stats or mitigation stats, and agility isn't great on either count. However, when considered in both respects, it looks like it might actually add up to a very, very good balanced stat.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:45 am

Given that a third of str's value is much less than what hit, expertise, crit, spell damage gives us.... nah.
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Re: Agility in WotLK

Postby Fridmarr » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:46 am

Eanin wrote:I was looking at some of the threat lists people were coming up with, and Agility was doing surprisingly well, coming in at about one-third of the value of strength.

All things considered, doesn't this make agility a really nice, well balanced stat, maybe worth considering over strength in some cases (or maybe even most cases)? On top of that nice threat boost, we get 0.04% dodge (not affected by diminishing returns) and two armor, plus it is affected by Kings.

So much discussion about threat stats or mitigation stats, and agility isn't great on either count. However, when considered in both respects, it looks like it might actually add up to a very, very good balanced stat.


Agility is nice, however it's not on any tanking gear I've seen to date. I wouldn't be surprised if it appeared on a later tier due to scaling, and Ilevel costs. Your only options for it now are basically enchants or gems, though in many cases there are superior alternatives.
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Postby Eanin » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:46 am

Snake-Aes wrote:Given that a third of str's value is much less than what hit, expertise, crit, spell damage gives us.... nah.


Yes, but my point was to compare it on more than one scale. One-third the threat of strength plus about 80% the mitigation of dodge is really very nice.
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Postby Boldbeard » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:48 am

I think it'll be a hard stat to come by from tank gear anyways. Nearly all tanking pieces I've seen are STR+STA with green stats. Maybe enough Gems could help you get some effective levels of AGI, but I would imagine it'll be easier to just stay focused on Dodge/Parry Rating for avoidance and STR for mitigation vs AGI for a little of both.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:50 am

Agility is 75% of dodge in the dodge-per-point value, and is subject to the same DR iirc.

How much armor do we get from agility? 1:1? 1:2? In either case, agility for us is nothing more than a watered down version of dodge that we happen to get through Strength of Earth totem.
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Postby OmegaDN » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:53 am

Edit: Double post ftl
Last edited by OmegaDN on Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:55 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Eanin » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:54 am

Snake-Aes wrote:Agility is 75% of dodge in the dodge-per-point value, and is subject to the same DR iirc.

How much armor do we get from agility? 1:1? 1:2? In either case, agility for us is nothing more than a watered down version of dodge that we happen to get through Strength of Earth totem.


I was counting Kings, with which Agility gives 83% of the dodge from dodge rating.

Again, though, you're comparing on only one scale. You've just switched scales :).

Agility gives 2.2 armor with kings.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:57 am

so 0,83% of dodge's worth + 2.2 armor per point(which is about 0,14 item points worth of armor), and how much crit again?
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Postby Eanin » Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:01 pm

With Kings, 22.7 agility = 1% crit, while 22.1 crit rating = 1% crit, so they're nearly equivalent.

Also, when comparing it to dodge, agility isn't affected by diminishing returns, so they actually become much closer the more dodge you have.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:05 pm

http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t29453-comb ... evel_80_a/


Doesn't look like agi-dodge is separated from dodgeR-dodge
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Postby Eanin » Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:10 pm

Snake-Aes wrote:http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t29453-combat_ratings_level_80_a/


Doesn't look like agi-dodge is separated from dodgeR-dodge


I stand corrected. It can be considered equivalent to 83% dodge, then.

Agility then can be basically considered:

0.83 dodge rating
0.97 crit rating
2.2 armor

All in one stat.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:14 pm

Not giving me a tanky boner :/ crit is nothing to ignore but also nothing to look forward either. And TWO armor is, like, err, 2/14 of an item point.
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Postby Tronden » Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:15 pm

I think I am starting to understand the point.

I can help bring the picture into focus. Lets look at it in the way we look at gems.

Solid [insert blue gem here] give x stamina
Subtle [insert red gem here] gives x dodge rating

Each gem is directly related to one thing, one focus. Blizzard threw us a nice curve and gave us gems of combined color... so in this case it would be a purple gem.

Yes, there is a point, and I am getting to it.

The purple gem would not have nearly as much stamina as the blue, nor would it have nearly as much dodge rating as the red - but would have both. In theory, 2 purple == 1 red + 1 blue.

What is being said is that agility is like a hybrid gem. it has dodge, armor, and crit. So it is defensive and offensive at the same time. Yes, the dodge and armor by itself == meh. Yes, the crit by itself == meh. Jack of all trades, Master at none.

But here is where it gets interesting - Kings. Kings does not affect armor, dodge, or critical chance by themselves. It does however affect them through Agility.

So it might be interesting to theorycraft this. 1 crit chance gem + 1 dodge gem vs 2 agility gems. First without kings, and then with full kings.

This of course is *entirely* based on the idea that those are the 2 stats you were planning to gem for anyways... but I am not posting for or against those stats.

So who has a good math hat on today who can look at this idea?
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Postby steadypal » Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:15 pm

much better things to stack imo
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