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Diminishing Returns on Avoidance

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Diminishing Returns on Avoidance

Postby Diazepam » Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:51 pm

I keep seeing this mentioned in various posts, but I haven't seen any hard numbers. Do we know when it starts and what the rate is? I've spent the last 30 minutes searching the foums trying to find this info, does it even exist?
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Postby Sechs » Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:54 pm

I have not seen any numbers yet. Figure it cap around 75% and most ppl will be at 60ish~~ % like it is for armor.
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Postby majiben » Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:59 pm

The mechanics are entirely worked out yet and it's made harder by the fact that dimishing returns don't appear to be showing up on the character sheet.

Here's what we do know:
for every X amount rating the next X amount of rating is only worth 95% as much.

Agility is affected by dimishing returns and may share the same penalty as dogde rating.

ie if it takes A amount of dodge rating to get 1% dodge and B amount of agility to get 1% dodge then if you had A dodge and b agility then you would only have 1.95% dodge
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Postby Eender » Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:10 pm

You asked for it...

http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t29453-comb ... evel_80_a/

Looking @ it gives me a headache..
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Postby Brand » Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:52 pm

Eender wrote:You asked for it...

http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t29453-comb ... evel_80_a/

Looking @ it gives me a headache..


Dear Lord. I just spend the last 10 minutes wiping the blood that gushed out of my eyes from looking at all those numbers for a few minutes.

Needless to say, very informational.
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Postby Worldie » Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:06 am

Making a TLDR version:

Diminishing Return starts already at 1%, however it doesn't become significant until 25%+. The perfect level of a specific avoidance stat is at around 25-30%, after which DR starts to become excessive.


That's a very brief recount of all the topic :P
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Postby steadypal » Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:19 am

Worldie wrote:Making a TLDR version:

Diminishing Return starts already at 1%, however it doesn't become significant until 25%+. The perfect level of a specific avoidance stat is at around 25-30%, after which DR starts to become excessive.


That's a very brief recount of all the topic :P



hmm ptr i have 32% dodge i think, so try to trade out dodge gear for BR or threat stats?

or you speaking 30% at lvl 80?
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Postby KysenMurrin » Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:50 am

I don't think level matters; level affects the rating -> percentage conversion, but the diminishing return applied to the % only depends on class (DK, Warriors and Paladins diminish at the same rate).
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Postby Worldie » Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:56 am

I'm tecnically speaking about level 80, at 70 there's not much you can do, parry is extremely rare on gear anyway.

Just don't bother until 80 tbh.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby majiben » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:01 am

Worldie wrote:I'm tecnically speaking about level 80, at 70 there's not much you can do, parry is extremely rare on gear anyway.

Just don't bother until 80 tbh.


You could stack defense to spread the DR around all the avoidance stats. It would take a lot of defense to start making parry and miss be significantly affected.
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Postby Worldie » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:12 am

Defense got DR too :D
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Postby majiben » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:20 am

Worldie wrote:Defense got DR too :D

Oh I know but it's split 3 ways: Dodge, Parry, Miss. So while if you have a lot of dodge the dodge portion of defense is hit hard the parry and miss portions are relatively untouched.
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Postby ulushnar » Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:34 am

Majiben wrote:Here's what we do know:
for every X amount rating the next X amount of rating is only worth 95% as much.


Playing around with that's quite brutal. At the moment I have 340 Dodge Rating which is equivalent to 17.97 Dodge. If I've done my maths right, then it looks like that's going to be worth about 13% Dodge after 3.0.
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Postby majiben » Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:35 am

Ulushnar wrote:
Majiben wrote:Here's what we do know:
for every X amount rating the next X amount of rating is only worth 95% as much.


Playing around with that's quite brutal. At the moment I have 340 Dodge Rating which is equivalent to 17.97 Dodge. If I've done my maths right, then it looks like that's going to be worth about 13% Dodge after 3.0.


Start swapping that dodge out for parry and defense.
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Postby KysenMurrin » Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:41 am

Using the formula and constants from the EJ thread, 17.97% dodge -> 15.49% after DR.
However, the DR is not applied to contribution from seperate ratings, it is applied to your total % dodge (after base + talents). If you take your dodge % when naked, subtract it from dodge % when geared, then pass it through the formula you'll see the actual change. Taking your dodge rating alone and calculating it will give an incorrect result.
Last edited by KysenMurrin on Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:53 am, edited 7 times in total.
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