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Pally Shield Wall?

All things related to the expansion

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Postby PsiVen » Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:48 pm

Invisusira wrote:The 30% raid damage reduction talent works with this too!


\o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/


By \o/ I assume you mean "yay, I just saved two talent points" :P
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Postby Caelia » Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:52 pm

PsiVen wrote:
Invisusira wrote:The 30% raid damage reduction talent works with this too!


\o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/


By \o/ I assume you mean "yay, I just saved two talent points" :P

As a main tank ability i dont think it would be wise to absorb 30% raid wide damage if you use it as a shield wall type talent.

As an offtank ability it would be very usefull.
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Postby Invisusira » Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:54 pm

lol yeah the other hamster just woke up and started spinning its wheel and I put 2 and 2 together. so yes, that is YAY NOW I HAVE NO REASON TO SPEND THOSE TWO POINTS BECAUSE IT ARE BAD
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Postby Sechs » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:22 pm

Lore wrote:
Vencedor wrote:I'm not following what you're trying to say.
Shield Spec increases BV by 30%.

STR on live does affect BV. Are you saying it does not in Beta at the moment?

On live, Imp Shield Spec increases BV by 30%, which is the BV from your shield, other gear and STR combined.

What is different on Beta as compared to live?


Bolded where you're getting confused. Shield Spec doesn't do exactly what it says it does - it doesn't increase all block value, it only increases the block value gained from +BV on your gear. It doesn't count BV gained from Strength.

On live the difference is completely negligible as the vast majority of our block value comes from the value on the shield and whatever's extra on our gear, but since we're not likely to see much +BV in the expansion (and tons of +str instead, which has had its contribution to block value increased tenfold) then the talent's effectiveness is significantly reduced.


Sorry if this is old or have been brought up before, but where do everyone get this block value removed as a "standalone stat"? and only get block value from str idea from?

So far for me it just seems everyone is assuming block value is being removed and replaced by str as its been massively buffed to give more block value.
I find this kinda hard to believe as tank gear would need something around 100-150 str to cover the old block value from warrior gear. If that is so we have more str then stam on our gear. :/
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Postby Aertho » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:24 pm

I'm more interested in where we're getting block rating. Shield, jewelry and trinkets?
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Postby Rofladin » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:26 pm

Sechs wrote:
Lore wrote:
Vencedor wrote:I'm not following what you're trying to say.
Shield Spec increases BV by 30%.

STR on live does affect BV. Are you saying it does not in Beta at the moment?

On live, Imp Shield Spec increases BV by 30%, which is the BV from your shield, other gear and STR combined.

What is different on Beta as compared to live?


Bolded where you're getting confused. Shield Spec doesn't do exactly what it says it does - it doesn't increase all block value, it only increases the block value gained from +BV on your gear. It doesn't count BV gained from Strength.

On live the difference is completely negligible as the vast majority of our block value comes from the value on the shield and whatever's extra on our gear, but since we're not likely to see much +BV in the expansion (and tons of +str instead, which has had its contribution to block value increased tenfold) then the talent's effectiveness is significantly reduced.


Sorry if this is old or have been brought up before, but where do everyone get this block value removed as a "standalone stat"? and only get block value from str idea from?

So far for me it just seems everyone is assuming block value is being removed and replaced by str as its been massively buffed to give more block value.
I find this kinda hard to believe as tank gear would need something around 100-150 str to cover the old block value from warrior gear. If that is so we have more str then stam on our gear. :/


The idea that STR is replacing straight BV comes from Blizzard's desire for the plate tanking classes to use the same gear. Since DKs have no shield, it seems unlikely that warriors and paladins will find a lot of straight BV on tanking items, at least before "tier" levels. I think I've only seen one Northrend item with BV on it, and that was a shield.

Edit: I've been wondering about BR also... No clue where we'll get that from, besides straight defense rating. It's less important now that we don't have to worry about crushing blows, but it would still be nice to have around 100% avoidance/block so we don't have to eat regular hits.

Wait a minute... What does this have to do with bubblewall? :?
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Postby Grehn|Skipjack » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:33 pm

Currently, the only items new in WotLK with Block Value or Block Rating are shields.
http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?items=4&filte ... :1;crv=0:1

[e] And yeah, this is definitely deviating from the topic. If someone wants to start a thread on Block mechanics on armor, that would be great.
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Postby Sechs » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:49 pm

whoopps forgot!

OMG OMG OMG!!!!11111111ononeonoeonoenonoeoneoe shieldwall!!!!!!! elevenelevenetttettettettett
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Postby moduspwnens » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:06 pm

Aertho wrote:I'm more interested in where we're getting block rating. Shield, jewelry and trinkets?


Probably tier gear if anything. Block rating doesn't mesh with the idea of gear consolidation, since DKs won't be using it. I've been arguing that it's likely we won't have high passive avoidance and block, so I don't expect to see it at all. We'll see, though.
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Postby Mithos » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:12 pm

I'm still debating if bubblewall is better than pie.

Offtopic but regards the block value thing I'm going to Shield spec in my "possible wotlk specs" anyway because it's going to be fixed and we all know it. For warriors its like a tier 6 talent or whatever and havign a tier 6 talent which is currently king now become useless sounds like something which they are actively countering.
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Postby Makaijin » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:17 pm

Seems no one have mentioned this yet, but how will these changes affect our bubble pull? While tanking the majority of the time I only use my bubble to either remove debuffs, or for bubble pulls.
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Postby Karock » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:18 pm

Honestly have you guys seen any parry rating or dodge rating on gear yet? DK, Warriors and Paladin can use all of those stats so I'm thinking we really aren't going to see lots of tanking itemization till level 80 instances.
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Postby Karock » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:19 pm

Makaijin wrote:Seems no one have mentioned this yet, but how will these changes affect our bubble pull? While tanking the majority of the time I only use my bubble to either remove debuffs, or for bubble pulls.


It wasn't a change to Divine Shield so you can still bubble like you used to (well sans the fact that forbearance has a 3 min duration now).
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Postby Vorps » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:08 pm

With the latest changes Divine Guardian is going to be a pain. In some cases it will be great, but at times you'll wish you didn't have it.

In 10-person raids I think it will be awesome. In 25s I'm thinking it will severely hinder the usage of Divine Protection on some fights.

WTB toggle? Just what we needed, right... another ability to micromanage.

Speaking of such, someone get Righteous Fury to be made so it's like Hunter aspects. Seriously.
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Postby Fridmarr » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:42 pm

Vorps wrote:With the latest changes Divine Guardian is going to be a pain. In some cases it will be great, but at times you'll wish you didn't have it.

In 10-person raids I think it will be awesome. In 25s I'm thinking it will severely hinder the usage of Divine Protection on some fights.

WTB toggle? Just what we needed, right... another ability to micromanage.

Speaking of such, someone get Righteous Fury to be made so it's like Hunter aspects. Seriously.


I'm pretty sure I won't pick up the talent unless it's for some sort of gimmick fight.
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