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Threat Meter + Rotations

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Postby Lemondish » Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:49 am

Lexdivina wrote:Hi,

about judgements that are off GCD, that's already the case since quite a long time.
You can judge while GCD, and judgements don't cause any GCD already.

Because of that you can use some macro like those in this helpful topic:
Code: Select all
#showtooltip
/cast Judgement
/stopcasting
/cast Seal of Righteousness


Only possible because they are off GCD.


Talking about Warriors' threat, their Defensive Stance will become +45% threat, instead of 30% at the moment.
It seems like every tanks will have a threat boost with the removal of Blessing of Salvation.


What's interesting is, Worldie said, seals are no longer removed while judgeing, really cool for mana and we won't last without seal if we judged by mistake during a GCD.


The mana savings is something I'm really interested in. After all, currently, we're used to resealing everytime we judge, which depending on spec and how hardcore you are with keeping the same rotation, ends up happening every 8 to 10 seconds. With this change we could realistically see a shift towards using multiple Seals effectively.

Like for instance, swapping SoV and SoR would be a lot more effective due to not having to worry about the stacks falling off. Not to mention a longer duration =D
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Postby PsiVen » Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:08 am

GCD management due to 2 new 6sec cooldown abilities means that SoV-SoR twisting will most likely not be an option.

I'm working on an addon that shows a 30sec "cooldown" based on seal duration to train myself to stop resealing every 8-10 seconds. WTB more lua experience though :o
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Postby Lemondish » Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:12 am

PsiVen wrote:GCD management due to 2 new 6sec cooldown abilities means that SoV-SoR twisting will most likely not be an option.

I'm working on an addon that shows a 30sec "cooldown" based on seal duration to train myself to stop resealing every 8-10 seconds. WTB more lua experience though :o


We'll see on that 'not an option' part. After all, it may be better for mana and single target threat to NOT use Hammer of the Righteous when you can twist the Seals.
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Postby Splug » Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:24 am

Lexdivina wrote:Talking about Warriors' threat, their Defensive Stance will become +45% threat, instead of 30% at the moment.
It seems like every tanks will have a threat boost with the removal of Blessing of Salvation.
This is actually a buff to non-prot warrior threat generation, but a slight reduction to prot warrior threat generation. Currently, defensive stance is +30% threat, with a tallent called "Defiance" increasing threat by 15% and granting 6 expertise skill. The tallent Defiance is being removed, and base threat is being moved up to 30+15=45% for defensive stance. However, threat increases are not additive, they're multiplicative. With defiance, warriors actually have a 1.15*1.3=1.495% threat increase, so changing it to a flat 1.45% is indeed a nerf to tank-spec warriors. The expertise is also lost, but in exchange there is now a tallent to increase the critical strike chance of heroic strike, cleave, and thunderclap by 15%.

Regarding the changes to warrior threat AP-scaling: Most of the effected skills are not part of the current threat rotation, though this may add them to it. Things will have to exceed the status-quo before they even start to make a difference, though I suspect at least a few things will at trivially-obtained gear levels.

A friend said he's seen a recent post by Blizzard specifically stating warriors and mages were a work in progress, and not to get too tied down to the tallent trees/skills as-is. In the current state, the warrior changes in wotlk are fairly underwhelming, and their net sum basically amounts to fury and arms becoming more capable as tanks, and prot warriors boggling over the shield block nerf.

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Postby dmok » Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:36 am

Lemondish wrote:We'll see on that 'not an option' part. After all, it may be better for mana and single target threat to NOT use Hammer of the Righteous when you can twist the Seals.

Somehow, I doubt that dropping HotR for a reseal will result in an INCREASE in tps. In my half-t4 gear, I would be generating 140 holy damage plus whatever threat modifier "high amount of threat" gives to it ALONG with any AP/crit/+spell power coefficient it may get(using king's defender as my baseline tanking weapon in wotlk). So in those 30s between re-sealing, SoR would have to provide more than 140 damage more than what I would get just using a straight SoV. Currently, I do not feel that's what's happening assuming a 5 stack of vengence.

all this using an un-optimized weapon for HotR damage. (I dont worry about the 2nd "reseal" since you would have to do it anyways when your seal falls off fter 30s)
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Postby Lemondish » Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:01 pm

dmok wrote:
Lemondish wrote:We'll see on that 'not an option' part. After all, it may be better for mana and single target threat to NOT use Hammer of the Righteous when you can twist the Seals.

Somehow, I doubt that dropping HotR for a reseal will result in an INCREASE in tps. In my half-t4 gear, I would be generating 140 holy damage plus whatever threat modifier "high amount of threat" gives to it ALONG with any AP/crit/+spell power coefficient it may get(using king's defender as my baseline tanking weapon in wotlk). So in those 30s between re-sealing, SoR would have to provide more than 140 damage more than what I would get just using a straight SoV. Currently, I do not feel that's what's happening assuming a 5 stack of vengence.

all this using an un-optimized weapon for HotR damage. (I dont worry about the 2nd "reseal" since you would have to do it anyways when your seal falls off fter 30s)


I wrote a pretty in depth explanation as to how you don't need to lose out on HotR or ShoR in order to reseal, you're just limited as to when you can.

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Postby Lore » Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:35 pm

Lexdivina wrote:Talking about Warriors' threat, their Defensive Stance will become +45% threat, instead of 30% at the moment.


About this, it's actually not a threat buff - they removed the talent from the Protection tree that increased defensive stance by 15%. Basically it just gives them their 3 talent points back.
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