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Reckoning and Seal of choice in WotLK

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Reckoning and Seal of choice in WotLK

Postby Griffonheart » Tue Jul 22, 2008 5:42 am

I am not very familiar with Seal of Blood but does it proc Reckoning?

Either way, I am wondering if the 6% Reckoning in WotLK remain viable, consider:

SoR - We can have up to 20% extra of SoR damage. 30% stam also -> spell power.
SoB - Our tanking weapons may well be dps/strength based, given the new item info on worldofraids. (heavy 1H SoB and Hammer of Right)

Reckoning apparently will hit much harder. The problem remain, though, as which talent we have to sacrifice for that 3 talent pts in Reckoning? (just switch Benediction and Deflection? ^_^)

Also, compare to Guarded by the Light, which would cut our expensive Consecration and AS (AS is now 0.5 second cast, well usable mid-tanking) by 50%, it's hard to decide.

And, if one would use SoB for tanking (at least Off-tanking), we can cut the 5pt from Holy tree to add more into Prot? (again, I am Ally, no experience with SoB or SoM).

Here is one of the possible spec WITHOUT Reckoning:

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/cla ... 0000000000

And one with 4%:

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/cla ... 0000000000

I am in favor of the second build because of how expensive Consecration and how long the CD of AS are, may not be the best spells to use during boss fight (at least not Consecration unless down-rank). 4% Reckoning is not as flavorful as 6% but it will proc and give the boost. Need good math for the effect as always.
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Postby Worldie » Tue Jul 22, 2008 5:50 am

Yes SoB procs with reckoning...

I'm still wondering, we actually got 3 viable tanking seals now...
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Postby Griffonheart » Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:19 am

And the best thing is, no need to waste time activating Seal of L/W before we can judge it.

Let's think about SoB with Reckoning:

Assuming we can hit 500 with our 1H melee, SoB would be adding another 175 holy damage and takes 67.5 damage. Threat = 832.5 every hit. Reckoning doubles the melee threat when proc.

1) Scales with new tanking gears better thanks to +strength adding to block value at 2:1 ratio, as well as the new 51pt HoR.
2) Allow us to use weapons with mitigation (which lack +spell).
3) Mitigate overheal. Overheal = no mana so SoB allow a little more room for mana regen.
4) 1H SoB does not cause as much self-damage as 2H which is easier to heal with Imp. Devotion Aura.

However:

1) SoR scale with +spell (which we still use) and have higher Judgment coefficient and aggro. JoB make you take damage also.
2) There is no talent specifically for SoB.
3) Reckoning = more damage taken?

Questions:

1) Can SoB crit? And can it crit for 100% extra damage like melee attack?
2) Does JoB scale with AP?

Guarded By the Light or Reckoning?

If +spell is no longer the priority in our tanking, that would also mean less threat from Consecration, Avenging Shield, and Holy Shield (shield spells will recieve +15% damage though), instead the major threat generation would be from ShoR and HoM that doesn't use much +spell as far as we know. With that said, is Guarded by the Light vital for boss tanking? If not, that's more free points we can use for Reckoning?
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Postby Worldie » Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:58 am

SoB can crit, and works like a additional melee attack, thus can miss and be parried/dodged.
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Postby Lore » Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:11 am

For clarification:

SoB does work with Reckoning, meaning if Reckoning is active and gives you a second swing, you will get a second SoB attack as well.

The self-damage done by SoB does not proc Reckoning, to the best of my knowledge.
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Postby Levantine » Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:19 am

With all our new scaling, wouldn't Blood be the seal of choice for overgeared content?
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Postby Griffonheart » Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:22 am

Lore wrote:For clarification:

SoB does work with Reckoning, meaning if Reckoning is active and gives you a second swing, you will get a second SoB attack as well.

The self-damage done by SoB does not proc Reckoning, to the best of my knowledge.


So SoR that cannot be resisted v.s. SoB that can be mitigated but works better with new tanking weapons? Really need to look into the new weapons to know if Reckoning would be effective (of course, some Reckoning is always better than none, but which talent will we skip for it?).

EDIT - Levantine: You're right about using SoB for overgeared contents, but it may go beyond that.

Hm... I'd think a new pally tanking weapon (if any) would be:

110 DPS
40 Stam
30 Strength
30 Def rating
+250 spell
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Postby Dorvan » Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:35 am

I'm not so sure....it really depends on a lot of things about how our gear settles out, plus SoR apparently has scaling with both melee and spellpower stats now. Personally it looks to me as though a SoR/SoV rotation is the best now. What just occured to me though, is that such a rotation reduces the value of Reckoning since SoV procs every swing now, which could tilt things in favor of Seals of the Pure over Reck. Still quite speculative at this point though.
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Postby Griffonheart » Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:56 am

Dorvan wrote:I'm not so sure....it really depends on a lot of things about how our gear settles out, plus SoR apparently has scaling with both melee and spellpower stats now.


O_O

Seal of the Pure or Rackoning... or both?

http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basic ... 0000000000

I pick Divine Guardian because it would be useful in a solo tanking situation, provide more utility. Given the extra spells like ShoR and HoR perhaps 4% is all we need.

If AP can buff SoR as you said, that's another reason NOT to get Guarded by the Light talent unless we overgear the content?
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Postby Dorvan » Tue Jul 22, 2008 8:20 am

That build skips out on AD, which I find unacceptable for almost all purposes, though it will depend a little on the exact nature of WotLK content.
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Postby Argali » Tue Jul 22, 2008 9:21 am

Even with a nice high dmg weapon, won't SoB do less dmg than SoR cause it isn't affected by spell dmg? touched by light for the uber spl dmg win!
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Postby Moraus » Tue Jul 22, 2008 10:06 am

SD wont be THAT uber because it wont be raw, it will be there enough for us.

I think SoB might have a bit of a part to play to tanking, moreso than it does now
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Postby Dorvan » Tue Jul 22, 2008 11:03 am

Moraus wrote:SD wont be THAT uber because it wont be raw, it will be there enough for us.

I think SoB might have a bit of a part to play to tanking, moreso than it does now


I think his point was that SoR apparently scales with both AP and +dam while SoB scales only with AP. Of course, how well each scales with those stats makes a big difference, but I'm a bit skeptical of SoB getting a lot of tanking traction atm.
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Postby shifttusk » Tue Jul 22, 2008 11:46 am

Dorvan wrote:
Moraus wrote:SD wont be THAT uber because it wont be raw, it will be there enough for us.

I think SoB might have a bit of a part to play to tanking, moreso than it does now


I think his point was that SoR apparently scales with both AP and +dam while SoB scales only with AP. Of course, how well each scales with those stats makes a big difference, but I'm a bit skeptical of SoB getting a lot of tanking traction atm.


Yea but it also takes into consideration base weapon dmg. While SOR does have a base dmg per swing with what looks like a SD and AP component SoB Will have scaling based on tanking weapon DPS as well as your crit rate. Your crit rate will go signifigantly up with raid wide agility totem as well as a ret putting up the revised Improved judgement buff.

I keep saying it conviction is looking more and more interesting with how our threat rotation will be. Consec and Sor and HS's non criting component being lowered in importance looks very interesting.

The super cool thing will be the improvement to OTing we will have as well as (and I know this is weird) the ability to go high threat without requiring consecration up making us play better in CC heavy instances like MrT.
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Postby Griffonheart » Tue Jul 22, 2008 2:46 pm

So you guys think the choice of seal will determine the usage of Reckoning in Wrath?
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