New WotLK tanking style

All things related to the expansion

Moderators: Fridmarr, Worldie, Aergis

Postby Sharlos » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:07 pm

Knaughty wrote:
Lore wrote:- Is consecration still part of our main threat rotation? Or is it purely an AOE tanking ability (where we're not likely to be using Shield of Righteousness)? What about Holy Shield?

I can see Rank 6 & Rank 8 both being keybound.
Lore wrote:- Will Hammer of the Righteous be worth using when it's not hitting multiple targets?

Semi-Useless level 70 theorycraft incoming.

Assume a Brutalizer. Average white hit, in my current tanking gear (T-6), would be ~200, with very little warrior gear in my set. Same weapon, one of our warrior tanks, non-crit of 223.

So assume 223 holy damage, * 1.9 for RF, and it's at 70 TPS before it's innate multiplier. If I'm reading the "Threat 2.0" source-code right, "high threat" warrior moves are about triple threat.

So it's probably something like 200 TPS at level 70, assuming "high threat" means triple (same as warriors), a level 70 tanking weapon, that RF stacks, and spellpower doesn't help.

I'd spam it.


Is 'causes a high aount of threat' a multiplier or a static amount of threat?
User avatar
Sharlos
 
Posts: 1566
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 7:46 pm
Location: Australia

Postby Tradyk » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:24 pm

One thing that I think needs to be tested and checked out is how HotR (I like HotR, btw:P) works for maintaining #2 agro. I don't think I've seen someone bring this up before, but its the first thing that occurred to me when I red the skill description. Finally, direct threat!

I don't know about you guys, but with how paladins are atm, maintaining #2 on the threat list can be a right pain for me. I'm wondering how HotR can help us with that. Combining it with our seals and consecration, it might be enough to replace the reflected damage agro that we loose when we play second fiddle.

Something to be looked into at any rate, imo.
Tradyk
 
Posts: 210
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2008 6:07 am

Postby djellum » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:30 pm

much of the new stuff that I have scene so far leads me to beleive that lots of aoe will be present in the expansion. almost every tree I've looked at (druid, pally, Shaman mostly) has had their aoe capabilities buffed in some way. lots of additions for survivability for dps and healers too, which might mean more chaotic fights (or just pvp buffs lol)

this would seem plausable with the elimination of crushing blows since more aoe + crushing blows would be a nightmare for warriors in their current style.

my thoughts for what their worth anyway...

probably no crushings and HS can likely be tossed backa few notches in priority. still very usefull and wont be out of the cycle, but with all the multimob tools we have extra, and built in the case of our judgements, it may be down or almost down before we get to it. also may see less use of it for some fights, depending on the nature of it (caster fights where we can now actually do great threat but dont need much physical reduction)

Redoubt looks like it may get more time in the light since we still have to buy it anyway and passive extra block lets us use the time for other abilities instead of worrying about whether HS is up 100%.

all guesses of course, who the hell knows what will happen at live and after but im hopefull. I love the idea of more tools than your able to use, I just hope they make them usefull enough that you actually get to change it up a bit and work your class instead of having the hamster wheel spam a rotation macro

oddly enough the most interesting changes ive scene are in the holy pally sector. use of judgements for healing power and close range aoe heals may mean a bit of fun doing dmg and slapping ppl with the new hand spells, while healing. Holy pallies have been asking for a less boring heal, looks like they got it. kind of glad I made my offset a healing set (not that I will respec out of tanking, but could at least be fun for pvp or something)
Image

Image
djellum
 
Posts: 158
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 10:11 pm

Postby Lore » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:30 pm

"high threat" usually means a flat amount of bonus threat.
User avatar
Lore
Global Mod
 
Posts: 7757
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 11:52 am

Postby djellum » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:32 pm

Tradyk wrote:One thing that I think needs to be tested and checked out is how HotR (I like HotR, btw:P) works for maintaining #2 agro. I don't think I've seen someone bring this up before, but its the first thing that occurred to me when I red the skill description. Finally, direct threat!

I don't know about you guys, but with how paladins are atm, maintaining #2 on the threat list can be a right pain for me. I'm wondering how HotR can help us with that. Combining it with our seals and consecration, it might be enough to replace the reflected damage agro that we loose when we play second fiddle.

Something to be looked into at any rate, imo.


also got a huge OT buff with divine guardian, taking partial dmg from everyone around to fill up mana...

Pennervate lol
Image

Image
djellum
 
Posts: 158
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 10:11 pm

Postby Lore » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:58 pm

djellum wrote:
Tradyk wrote:One thing that I think needs to be tested and checked out is how HotR (I like HotR, btw:P) works for maintaining #2 agro. I don't think I've seen someone bring this up before, but its the first thing that occurred to me when I red the skill description. Finally, direct threat!

I don't know about you guys, but with how paladins are atm, maintaining #2 on the threat list can be a right pain for me. I'm wondering how HotR can help us with that. Combining it with our seals and consecration, it might be enough to replace the reflected damage agro that we loose when we play second fiddle.

Something to be looked into at any rate, imo.


also got a huge OT buff with divine guardian, taking partial dmg from everyone around to fill up mana...

Pennervate lol


Well, that's assuming we actually take the damage from people around while we're bubbled (and aren't immune to it)

TBH if I'm not immune I might not take the talent; I use my bubble for immunity way too often to be taking damage while it's up.
User avatar
Lore
Global Mod
 
Posts: 7757
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 11:52 am

Postby Tradyk » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:24 pm

Agree with Lore here. Plus, 30% of all damage from party or raid, in a situation where it'd be useful, would mean insta-death, most likely.
Tradyk
 
Posts: 210
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2008 6:07 am

Postby Echaa » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:57 pm

If the damage you take is fully absorbed by bubble then it would likely be best used on fights like bloodboil or kalecgos(?). If the damage taken goes through bubble then its not really worth it for tanking, specifically if you use bubble for immunity and theres aoe damage going around. It would probably see more use being in the holy tree in either case but at least allowing us to remain invulnerable for the duration of it would make it at least semi-useful for some fights.
Echaa
 
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:24 pm

Postby Kethion » Sat Jul 19, 2008 12:45 am

Fairly obvious I'd say, but I assume we'd alternate priority of our cooldowns based on the fight and our current situation.

Holy Shield priority when we have a threat lead or need the extra mitigation. Threat priority would be Shield of Righteousness for single target or Consecration/Hammer of the Righteous for AoE (dependant on how many mobs?). Remember, judgements only need to be put up once every 20 seconds, though I assume for single target threat a full stacked JoV/JoCor would take priority over HotR (seeing how we don't know the modifier or static amount of threat it gives, that can't quite be confirmed).

I assume that they would actually be a % threat modifier for HotR and ShoR, because (in it's current form at least) they only have one rank, which I am taking to mean they would probably scale.

EDIT: Also confused as to why everyone is going all crazy over Divine Guardian :\ I don't quite understand how it would help in a MTing situation. Also, holy paladins may have a spec where they go deep enough into the protection tree where they grab that talent, making it probably more useful for them (assuming the damage is absorbed).
Image
Kethion
 
Posts: 228
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:14 am

Postby lakhesis » Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:22 am

Haven't seen anyone include this in their rotations yet: Sacred Shield

35 mana is seriously cheap, but.. that's another GCD (assuming you don't have a holy pally doing it for you o'course). Opinions?

- Lakhesis
When society says jump, we say pass the salt.
lakh's armory
User avatar
lakhesis
 
Posts: 166
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:02 pm
Location: oz

Postby Kethion » Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:47 am

Lakhesis wrote:Haven't seen anyone include this in their rotations yet: Sacred Shield

35 mana is seriously cheap, but.. that's another GCD (assuming you don't have a holy pally doing it for you o'course). Opinions?

- Lakhesis
Since you can only gain the effect once every 6 seconds, I think I'll stick with a ret or holy applying it to me.
Image
Kethion
 
Posts: 228
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:14 am

Postby Amran20 » Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:01 am

Dear lore,

What is sacred shield? Amran has been out drinking, and is wondering very much.
Image

“Time is too slow for those who wait, too swift for those who fear, too long for those who grieve, too short for those who rejoice, but for those who love, time is eternity.”
Amran20
 
Posts: 474
Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2007 1:22 am

Postby lakhesis » Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:16 am

Kethion wrote:Since you can only gain the effect once every 6 seconds, I think I'll stick with a ret or holy applying it to me.


For 25 mans, I'd agree... but we're gonna be seeing a profusion of 10 mans which is probably what I'm thinking of more. Assuming a two healer group in a ten man, there's a decent chance you won't have a holy pally (i typically run with priests/shamans)... and ret pallys are rare as hell outside BG/arena on my server.

- Lak.
When society says jump, we say pass the salt.
lakh's armory
User avatar
lakhesis
 
Posts: 166
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:02 pm
Location: oz

Postby Ossuary » Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:31 am

Basically, once i saw the WotlK talents page on Wowhead... i had a nerdgasm. Can't wait for a beta key to play test it all and get a good rotation setup for different situations.
Image
User avatar
Ossuary
 
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 12:55 pm

Postby lesurk » Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:42 am

Lakhesis wrote:
Kethion wrote:Since you can only gain the effect once every 6 seconds, I think I'll stick with a ret or holy applying it to me.


For 25 mans, I'd agree... but we're gonna be seeing a profusion of 10 mans which is probably what I'm thinking of more. Assuming a two healer group in a ten man, there's a decent chance you won't have a holy pally (i typically run with priests/shamans)... and ret pallys are rare as hell outside BG/arena on my server.

- Lak.


Ret is getting huge buffs in WotLK. Sounds like you're playing on a pretty backward server now too tbh.
lesurk
 
Posts: 46
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2008 3:36 pm

PreviousNext

Return to WotLK

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 1 guest

Who is online

In total there are 2 users online :: 1 registered, 0 hidden and 1 guest (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 380 on Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:28 pm

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 1 guest