Tanking Brutallus: Gearing for it, and surviving it.

Kalecgos, Brutallus, Felmyst, M'uru, Entropius, Kil'jaeden

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Postby Cakes » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:50 am

Siryn wrote:
I've been using Bloodberry Elixir + Elixir of greater defense(+500 armor) - should i switch to flask of fort maybe?


If your health is below 22k or so, I'd say yes.
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Postby Morganim » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:53 am

Baelor wrote:
Worldie wrote:If you do it as retri, you will not take any damage. Mana pots, Haste pots and Elixirs of Demonslaying, that's all.

If you bring Elixirs of Demonslaying, bring Elixirs of Major Mageblood as well.

Dark Runes or Demonic Runes are also helpful for an extra surge of mana.

For each attempt at Brutallus, if you're ret and want to throw the kitchen sink at him, you'll want:
    2 Elixirs of Demonslaying
    1 Elixir of Major Mageblood
    1 Scroll of Strength V
    1 Scroll of Agility V
    2 Haste Potions
    1 Fel Mana Potion
    2-3 Dark Runes
That's the full-out, no-holds-barred, gotta-kick-'im-in-the-pants consumable read-out for a ret paladin. Enjoy.

EDIT:
For towelliee, my "BOOM" macro from memory, I think it is...
#showtooltip Avenging Wrath
/cast Avenging Wrath
/cast Haste Potion
/cast Berserker's Call


I use a mix of some BT bits, ZA gear, pvp gear (lol sso helm enchant) and t6 chest/legs. My dps is usualy at 1800-1900, being held back by gear now.

I use 3 Haste potions when i go ret for this. Between t6 2pce, Mp5 totem from enhance, and wisdom i dont have mana problems (sometimes spam rank 6 cons at end to burn mana) As well as mp5 + demonslaying elixir, i always forget to use the 2nd demonslaying though lol

My order is
(i have DST + MgT trinket)
~ 20-30 seconds Haste Pot + Wings
~2 mins ish, bloodlust is used
~1/2 way through bloodlust i use 2nd haste pot (go JoW mana)
~ 20-30% on brut 2nd Bloodlust (tank groups shaman) + Haste pot + Wings
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Postby Baelor » Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:32 am

Morganim wrote:
Baelor wrote:
Worldie wrote:If you do it as retri, you will not take any damage. Mana pots, Haste pots and Elixirs of Demonslaying, that's all.

If you bring Elixirs of Demonslaying, bring Elixirs of Major Mageblood as well.

Dark Runes or Demonic Runes are also helpful for an extra surge of mana.

For each attempt at Brutallus, if you're ret and want to throw the kitchen sink at him, you'll want:
    2 Elixirs of Demonslaying
    1 Elixir of Major Mageblood
    1 Scroll of Strength V
    1 Scroll of Agility V
    2 Haste Potions
    1 Fel Mana Potion
    2-3 Dark Runes
That's the full-out, no-holds-barred, gotta-kick-'im-in-the-pants consumable read-out for a ret paladin. Enjoy.

EDIT:
For towelliee, my "BOOM" macro from memory, I think it is...
#showtooltip Avenging Wrath
/cast Avenging Wrath
/cast Haste Potion
/cast Berserker's Call


I use a mix of some BT bits, ZA gear, pvp gear (lol sso helm enchant) and t6 chest/legs. My dps is usualy at 1800-1900, being held back by gear now.

I use 3 Haste potions when i go ret for this. Between t6 2pce, Mp5 totem from enhance, and wisdom i dont have mana problems (sometimes spam rank 6 cons at end to burn mana) As well as mp5 + demonslaying elixir, i always forget to use the 2nd demonslaying though lol

My order is
(i have DST + MgT trinket)
~ 20-30 seconds Haste Pot + Wings
~2 mins ish, bloodlust is used
~1/2 way through bloodlust i use 2nd haste pot (go JoW mana)
~ 20-30% on brut 2nd Bloodlust (tank groups shaman) + Haste pot + Wings

Not quite on topic, but I'll continue the discussion here, and we can take it to PM's or another thread afterward.

We killed him last night, Morendin will probably stop by to give his impressions of the kill and add anything necessary. From a ret point of view...

The heroisms for me were no where close to ideal. The raid lead insisted on using all the heroisms toward the end of the fight and having them nearly chained together. So I didn't get to line up my potions and trinkets how I originally intended: instead of Haste - Fel Mana - Haste on cooldown, all in conjunction with my Berserker's Call, I went Haste/Wings/Zerker after 3 stacks of Vengeance at the beginning, then held the potion/trinket til wings were back up, and then went Haste/Wings/Zerker again in conjunction with the enh shaman's Heroism at around 3:15. After that, I was switched out of the melee group momentarily to feed the rogue/bm hunter/fury warrior/enh shaman subsequent heroisms. I did get burned 3 times on the kill though, so I used a 3rd Haste Potion instead of a Fel Mana at the end.

Taking all that into account, I didn't crack 1800 DPS. I don't hack with Seal of Blood, didn't get multiple Heroisms, and had to mess with my cooldowns to accomodate the heroism rotation.

Damn you for having a DST, btw.
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Postby Imbur » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:56 pm

Ok. So threat is not an issue. Even in my avoidance gear with 490 unbuffed spell dmg, and no WoA or Sanctity, I still dont have an issue with threat. I have a problem surviving, still. Im using my max dodge gear, puttng me at 21k HP (required) and 38% dodge, 18.5% parry, and whatever shield block. I have about 400 BV without my libram proc. I use flask of fort, Rune of Warding, ironshield, as well as the eternal defender ring. I sit at about 26-28k armor for the fight. I use my Insignia for the first stomp, and me seed for the second. Then I ride the third, Then seed, then Insignia again. I have to use the commendation to get my HP up. We get brut to 30%ish and he kills me on a stomp, even with my trinket or seed popped. I get a string of unavioded blows, plus the stomp, and take like 24k dmg in 1-2 seconds. What can I do? The only pieces I lack for a perfect tank set are Illi or Felmysts shield, t6 boots, and felmysts gloves. I have an alt t6 glove/shoulder with dodge gems in them. There is nothing else I can do to increase my dodge without taking my HP below 21k. We have been discussing trying to get me a commanding shout, or a lock imp, giving more leeway to equip dodge? What do you think?
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Postby Worldie » Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:38 pm

Consider using Moroes over the Insigna if you can't afford losing the stam trinket. 15% dodge > 1750 HP at any time. Plus it has shorted CD, you don't need to eat the 3rd stomp (you'll likely eat the 4th tho but you can taunt into it)

Also, try to get to 22k HP rather than exactly 21500, a small edge is good to have. You can lose 2-3% dodge for about 1k more HP. Or get Commanding Shout.

The times we had to go druid+paladin, we got the DPS war in our group for CS, since anyway he was just debuffing rather than DPSing at all.
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Postby fuzzygeek » Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:50 pm

First night on Brut last night; best attempt was 38% with just under two minutes to go before we lost a healer, then a tank shortly thereafter.

This fight scares the pants off me. I've never felt more unprepared.






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Postby Worldie » Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:57 pm

As i said before, it's like going on the railway, and pretending to stop a train.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby Cakes » Wed Jul 30, 2008 4:16 pm

Worldie wrote:As i said before, it's like going on the railway, and pretending to stop a train.


So tanking Brut is like a watchable version of the movie Hancock.
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Postby blish » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:04 pm

Thanks for the thread again, Brut down after 2nd of tries, now for the next boss, wtb more Worldie videos
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Postby Worldie » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:09 pm

blish wrote:Thanks for the thread again, Brut down after 2nd of tries, now for the next boss, wtb more Worldie videos

I got a Felmyst one if you like :)

I'm soonish writing a guide for felmyst as well, when i can be arsed to stop exping my alts on beta :o
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby blish » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:19 pm

I believe that I have seen lores Video about picking up the adds, but not sure will need to look for it i guess, yea guess we got a few nights now on Felmyst, although we still need to do BT of course.
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Postby Morganim » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:57 pm

Baelor wrote:We killed him last night, Morendin will probably stop by to give his impressions of the kill and add anything necessary. From a ret point of view...

The heroisms for me were no where close to ideal. The raid lead insisted on using all the heroisms toward the end of the fight and having them nearly chained together. So I didn't get to line up my potions and trinkets how I originally intended: instead of Haste - Fel Mana - Haste on cooldown, all in conjunction with my Berserker's Call, I went Haste/Wings/Zerker after 3 stacks of Vengeance at the beginning, then held the potion/trinket til wings were back up, and then went Haste/Wings/Zerker again in conjunction with the enh shaman's Heroism at around 3:15. After that, I was switched out of the melee group momentarily to feed the rogue/bm hunter/fury warrior/enh shaman subsequent heroisms. I did get burned 3 times on the kill though, so I used a 3rd Haste Potion instead of a Fel Mana at the end.

Taking all that into account, I didn't crack 1800 DPS. I don't hack with Seal of Blood, didn't get multiple Heroisms, and had to mess with my cooldowns to accomodate the heroism rotation.

Damn you for having a DST, btw.


I honestly found my dps was higher using the haste pot + wings combo in the first 30 seconds or so and then going for the wings/haste/BL near the end. Although im lucky and get to control our bloodlusts so i keep myself in for the second as my dps is higher than our BF warrior and Enhance shaman.

Ill see if i can find a WWS for you, but i have shocking luck with WF and Crit RNG, (never been over 25 wf procs on a kill -_-) Also my gear is lack-lustre in some deparments, WTB helm and boots (seen 1 drop and went to dps war never seen them again)
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Postby Morendin » Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:17 am

As Baelor/Cathmor said, we killed him Monday night, I tanked it with our top warrior, Dellex.

This is the busiest fight ever.
before the pull I dump to 3.5k mana.
I open by drinking an Ironshield as I call for the hunter to MD it to me, throw my shield the instant Brut is in range, and then Cons->HS-> AW->Judge->Exor->Cons->HS->Judge as fast as the GCD allows...our DPS are crazy, and manage to eat up the 20k+ threat lead AW gives me in fairly short order.
I use Stoneform on my first Slash, because:
Dellex taunts out of stomp after the second Slash, and I judge light->seal vengence, using HL11 on Dellex during his stomps and dumping mana with attacks/RF to try to get down to ~2k before it's my turn again, and wait for his 2nd Slash so I can run over and get Commanding refreshed, and get back to my box before I need to taunt.

when there are ~5s left on my debuff, I call out taunting in 3, then Cons-HS->RD->judge SoV, seal SoR->Exor->cons->HS, and use my Pocketwatch for my second Stomp

Seed for third stomp

Pocketwatch for 4th stomp

Seed for 5th stomp


I LOVE THIS FIGHT
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Postby Zyphoid » Fri Aug 01, 2008 4:26 am

Great guide Worldie, thanks for taking the time.

Using some of the tips in here I tweaked my gear-set slightly and reduced damage I took compared to last week by about 7%. It's pretty amazing how big a difference 2 swapped pieces of gear can make.

And you are right, Watch + Insignia is better than 2 on use avoidance trinkets, for sure.

Got to agree with Morendin above me. I love this fight.

/e - One consumable I use that wasn't mentioned is Greater Rune of Warding. (http://thottbot.com/i25521) The damage they prevent looks negligible, but compared to the other consumables we are bringing, they are cheap, and you only need one per night assuming you are killing him in under an hour. The way I look at it is you need to avoid every single point of damage that is humanly/Belfly/Dwarfly/Nelfly possible. And these don't overwrite anything so theres no reason not to use em.
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Postby Questioner » Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:41 am

I finally got the go to tank this fight last night when we had a different raid comp.

After 6 "empty" taunts in a row, I'm freakin done. RD sucks.
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