Post your Frustrations.

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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Flex » Fri Dec 14, 2012 10:20 am

Slow slow slow start to raiding this expansion. I think in the month+ we've been running we've had 3 days of all mains, none twice in the same week. We'll probably miss the next two weeks due to people being out and the other tank's woman having a baby.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Dec 14, 2012 10:25 am

People going coo-coo for cocoa puffs as of lately and shooting indiscriminately in public places... including this morning's school shooting that left a kid dead...

Seriously... wtf...

Edit: fuck

27 dead including 14 kids
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Shoju » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:16 am

Klaudandus wrote:People going coo-coo for cocoa puffs as of lately and shooting indiscriminately in public places... including this morning's school shooting that left a kid dead...

Seriously... wtf...

Edit: fuck

27 dead including 14 kids


28 and 18 is the count now.

Holy Shitballs. I want to be sick.

EDIT:

And CNN and their interviewing fucking 9 year olds about this can go straight to hell.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Teranoid » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:20 am

Add this to the other 9 billion reasons I've lost almost all faith in the human race.

Unfuckingbelievable.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Nikachelle » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:24 am

Apparently it was the father of a student who did the shooting. In an elementary school? Good lord.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:26 am

Shoju wrote:And CNN and their interviewing fucking 9 year olds about this can go straight to hell.

I want to go Vlad Teppes on the CNN crew...
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Flex » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:34 am

I think one of the simpler arguments I've heard is that as a country the US has shown itself mature enough for gun ownership.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:37 am

Flex wrote:I think one of the simpler arguments I've heard is that as a country the US has shown itself mature enough for gun ownership.


As in, not mature at all.

I'd say.

Shoju's CopyPasta of George Takei wrote:4. You will learn to resolve personal issues without using guns, lawyers, or therapists. The fact that you need so many lawyers and therapists shows that you’re not quite ready to be independent. Guns should only be used for shooting grouse. If you can’t sort things out without suing someone or speaking to a therapist, then you’re not ready to shoot grouse.

5. Therefore, you will no longer be allowed to own or carry anything more dangerous than a vegetable peeler. Although a permit will be required if you wish to carry a vegetable peeler in public.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby bldavis » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:46 am

i am sickened ...

first we had the mall shooting yesterday near where i grew up in portland, and now this
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Nikachelle » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:48 am

I was going to bring up the gun topic but figured I'd get flamed to hell and back.

The first thing that was said in my office as soon as we heard the news was "....and yet the US doesn't think it needs stricter gun control. Riiiiiiiiight."
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Shoju » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:50 am

I am not a huge fan of Gun Control in mass sweeping reforms. I don't have a problem with rifles, shotguns, and handguns. I do have a problem with automatic weaponry in the hands of the general public.

And I don't think the answer to this unspeakable tragedy is to over react, and scream about gun control.

What we need to be speaking about, what we need to be focusing on, is Mental Health. Looking back at the history of violent outbursts by gunmen, (this one not included since no motive has been discerned, though I'd be surprised if there weren't Mental Health tie ins here, considering it was an Elementary School) Mental Health is the underlying theme in Mass Gun Violence. You want to stump on about Gun Control, this isn't the right example. Neither is Aurora, or Columbine, or Virginia Tech.

These are examples of Mental Health problems that were manifested to a catastrophic, and horrifically deadly act by someone who suffered from Mental Health related problems. Mental Health is an incredibly touchy subject, that far too many people feel needs to be dealt with quietly.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:53 am

I used to have guns, I'd not mind owning a gun again... but then again, I am also for background checks for prospective gun owners...and stricter gun ownership rules, which is what the NRA balks at...

Also, what Shoju said.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby djlar » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:56 am

Don't go that far, Mexico has way stricter gun controls, 65K dead in 6 years anyway...

Goes for saying but if criminals/insane people want to kill they'll find the means to do it, this shooter could have acquired his armament illegaly, specially if he was 20, I think you have to be 21 to buy those kinds of weapons..
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby bldavis » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:58 am

im all for owning guns for use in hunting and such....with background checks and mandatory training

but yeah what shoju said too :)
and i think you need to add the mall shooting into that list
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:00 pm

djlar wrote:Don't go that far, Mexico has way stricter gun controls, 65K dead in 6 years anyway...

Goes for saying but if criminals/insane people want to kill they'll find the means to do it, this shooter could have acquired his armament illegaly, specially if he was 20, I think you have to be 21 to buy those kinds of weapons..


Yeah, and part of the problem is US guns being smuggled into Mexico... guns purchased from licensed gun dealers...
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Gab » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:02 pm

Cause "Gun Control" has prevented mass stabbing in China right?

There's over a dozen children dead. Instead of looking at HOW they were killed maybe we should be looking at WHY they were killed.

While we are banning guns lets also ban kitchen knives and meat cleavers shall we?

Not saying gun laws are appropriate how they stand now but the answer is not always giving up more rights.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:13 pm

Gab wrote:Cause "Gun Control" has prevented stabbed mass stabbing in China right?

There's over a dozen children dead. Instead of looking at HOW they were killed maybe we should be looking at WHY they were killed.

While we are banning guns lets also ban kitchen knives and meat cleavers shall we?

Not saying gun laws are appropriate how they stand now but the answer is not always giving up more rights.


Actually, I was just gonna link the Chinese mass stabbing at a school... seriously, what's up with people this week? Everyone is going batty... is there something in the water? in the air? end of days craziness?

The WHY is because these people are NUTS... and nothing wrong with trying to prevent NUTS from getting stuff they can use to hurt others... which is what Shoju and I talked about.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Flex » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:29 pm

Gab wrote:There's over a dozen children dead. Instead of looking at HOW they were killed maybe we should be looking at WHY they were killed.


Part of the maturity argument is that often times people in positions of power don't want to believe that the WHYs can be things like mental illness and other disorders that remove full culpability from the actor. As long as the people with power continue to act like immature children about even discussing positive steps towards saner gun and mental health laws that can be a step towards preventing gun violence it becomes this circular reasoning behind the not mature enough for guns argument.

Shoju wrote:And I don't think the answer to this unspeakable tragedy is to over react, and scream about gun control.


not directly at you, but the line of thought of "now isn't the time to talk about gun control reforms" after mass shootings is dumbtarded. If not then, when?
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Shoju » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:42 pm

Flex wrote:not directly at you, but the line of thought of "now isn't the time to talk about gun control reforms" after mass shootings is dumbtarded. If not then, when?


I understand, and don't take it personally. Don't take this personally in response. Its my general response to the question.

I personally think that Mass Shootings and Gun Violence are separate, if linked, tragedies. Gun Control isn't going to stop a mass shooting. If you have it in your mind that you are going to perpetrate a mass violent crime, the last thing you are thinking about is "Golly Gee, I wonder if I can go to the store and bah mah gun"

You can see the Aurora case as an example. Most of those firearms were purchased, over the internet. Gun Control didn't stop that. Several of the weapons that were purchased and used were illegal to own in Colorado without significant licensing. That didn't stop the purchase. The Gun Control didn't work.

Gun Control, is to curtail violence on a personal level. Mass Shootings aren't personal.

And the idea that mass shootings are the only mass violence, one only needs to look to china today, and see a man who attacked 23 people, 22 children, with a Knife. Chinese gun regulations are supremely strict (almost no private ownership), yet there have been a half dozen ish acts of mass violence in recents years perpetrated against young children, by people wielding blunt, or bladed instruments.

With great power (gun ownership) comes great responsibility. I'm 100% in favor of far more stringent regulations on owning a gun, including a psychiatric profile as a possibility. But this can only work hand in hand with a society that gets its fingers out of its ears, and off its ass about Mental Health. The U.S. is deaf and dumb when it comes to mental health. It's only been recently that we have even thought about it as a serious after care for our returning troops. Mental Health Care is still a taboo subject, and until we strip away that taboo of it, and get down to the brass tacks of it, we are going to have problems.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Gab » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:44 pm

Flex wrote:
Gab wrote:There's over a dozen children dead. Instead of looking at HOW they were killed maybe we should be looking at WHY they were killed.


Part of the maturity argument is that often times people in positions of power don't want to believe that the WHYs can be things like mental illness and other disorders that remove full culpability from the actor. As long as the people with power continue to act like immature children about even discussing positive steps towards saner gun and mental health laws that can be a step towards preventing gun violence it becomes this circular reasoning behind the not mature enough for guns argument.


That's key here. If we can't find a way to keep legally acquired weapons out of potential murderers hands then we obviously should have tighter weapon control but where does it start and where does it end?

I'll just leave this here, for a country that has been implementing stricter gun control they sure didn't account for all the kitchen utensils.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school-related_attacks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_attacks_in_China_(2010%E2%80%932011)

It doesn't take a gun to kill people... Look at all the stabbings in China after they stepped up gun control.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:47 pm

Wow... apparently the shooter was actually the son of one of the teachers, and that teacher, and thus her classroom, were the main target
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby halabar » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:52 pm

The problem with gun control is how do you separate the legitimate users of guns (primarily hunting) from the nutjobs? NYC's gun ban is perhaps a place to start, but that doesn't stop everyone.

Another problem is gun culture, as was demonstrated in KC last week.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Flex » Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:57 pm

We're basically ruled by children. Any talk of revising and reviewing gun laws is met with anything from "they're taking our guns" to "this is the first step to socialism and UN take over of the United States." Look at the UN disability treaty to see that that mindset isn't just left to the far right paranoid wing.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby halabar » Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:01 pm

Klaudandus wrote:Wow... apparently the shooter was actually the son of one of the teachers, and that teacher, and thus her classroom, were the main target


And that's where the mental health issues come in.
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Re: Post your Frustrations.

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:01 pm

Flex wrote:We're basically ruled by children. Any talk of revising and reviewing gun laws is met with anything from "they're taking our guns" to "this is the first step to socialism and UN take over of the United States." Look at the UN disability treaty to see that that mindset isn't just left to the far right paranoid wing.


Sadly, this is 100% true.

They will say that its a ruse to prevent the common man access to guns, therefore making it easier for the UN to steamroll into the US and install a new socialist regime.
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