Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby halabar » Fri Jul 05, 2013 10:29 am

Flex wrote:
Fenris wrote:
Glyph of Scattered Thoughts (NYI) Your Scatter Shot no longer Disorients the target, but now interrupts their spellcasts, preventing any spells in the same school from being cast for 4 sec, and Scatter Shot's range is increased by 0 yards.

They are clearly messing with hunters on purpose now :D

The only thing i can think about it that makes sense is that they are going to remove silencing so you are forced to glyph for the interrupt (== one less CC,but SS still avaiable to every spec )


SS moved baseline Marks, everyone can glyph for a non-silencing interrupt.


Yeah, that glyph is the band-aid to fix the screaming by BM that several pets would be untameable without a silence of some sort.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Fenrìr » Sat Jul 06, 2013 12:34 am

Fixed an issue where Protection Warriors are unable to receive bonus loot upon defeating Ra-den.



Like really...only warriors?....
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Newsom » Sat Jul 06, 2013 7:12 am

Fenrìr wrote:
Fixed an issue where Protection Warriors are unable to receive bonus loot upon defeating Ra-den.


Like really...only warriors?....


I hope they just worded the notes like that. Will see on Monday if he refuses me again I guess. xD
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Worldie » Sat Jul 06, 2013 7:26 am

I have one guess.

Low pop realms will be merged with several other low pop realms. This would do very good to them as it has been asked for several years already. Economy, recruiting, pugging will all get a huge improvement on those realms. (Even though several AH goblins and bots will be sad)

What it hasn't been said however, is if people on the same virtual realm will actually appear near to each other like in CRZ. If they don't, which is what I hope, merging toghether a 99% horde with a 99% alliance realm wouldn't really do much.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby halabar » Sat Jul 06, 2013 10:27 am

Worldie wrote:I have one guess.

Low pop realms will be merged with several other low pop realms. This would do very good to them as it has been asked for several years already. Economy, recruiting, pugging will all get a huge improvement on those realms. (Even though several AH goblins and bots will be sad)

What it hasn't been said however, is if people on the same virtual realm will actually appear near to each other like in CRZ. If they don't, which is what I hope, merging toghether a 99% horde with a 99% alliance realm wouldn't really do much.


I for one, am looking forward to the AH chaos. I'm really hoping that they announce the merger list prior to the patch, as that will allow for all sorts of profiteering. Crafters are generally gonna get hosed. I've been seeing a rise in bots again, so we'll have to see what happens there.

TUMJ is gonna be a mess for a while. I imagine they will have to merge servers there or something.

I do hope they merge highly imbalanced realms.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby theckhd » Sat Jul 06, 2013 12:31 pm

Darielle wrote:
What I really don't realize about the cloak discussion, is why so many people feel so necessary to sacrifice such a strong passive cooldown, for a proc that will possibly be very minor for a tank, and some haste that you won't even need in SoS as people are already at or very close to 50% haste now.

If it was a extremely op dps cloak, like the meta gem is who accounts for even more than 10% total dps, I'd understand.


I would say that people ARE expecting the cloak proc to be on par with Capacitance, and probably even assuming it would be better - given that it's the last chain of the legendary on the last patch of an expansion where Blizzard doesn't really hold back and for the damage proc to be as salivatory to damage as the tank proc is to us.


Except we do have information on the DPS cloak proc, and we know that it's based on weapon damage. Which means it's going to be fairly crappy for us no matter what, because our weapon damage is very weak compared to other STR DPS classes, which is the target they'll be balancing around.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Thels » Sat Jul 06, 2013 1:00 pm

theckhd wrote:
Darielle wrote:
What I really don't realize about the cloak discussion, is why so many people feel so necessary to sacrifice such a strong passive cooldown, for a proc that will possibly be very minor for a tank, and some haste that you won't even need in SoS as people are already at or very close to 50% haste now.

If it was a extremely op dps cloak, like the meta gem is who accounts for even more than 10% total dps, I'd understand.


I would say that people ARE expecting the cloak proc to be on par with Capacitance, and probably even assuming it would be better - given that it's the last chain of the legendary on the last patch of an expansion where Blizzard doesn't really hold back and for the damage proc to be as salivatory to damage as the tank proc is to us.


Except we do have information on the DPS cloak proc, and we know that it's based on weapon damage. Which means it's going to be fairly crappy for us no matter what, because our weapon damage is very weak compared to other STR DPS classes, which is the target they'll be balancing around.


All the more reason to switch to the tank cloak when 5.4 hits. :)
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Fenrìr » Sat Jul 06, 2013 1:00 pm

Newsom wrote:
Fenrìr wrote:
Fixed an issue where Protection Warriors are unable to receive bonus loot upon defeating Ra-den.


Like really...only warriors?....


I hope they just worded the notes like that. Will see on Monday if he refuses me again I guess. xD



Heh, I'll know on Sunday.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Fetzie » Sat Jul 06, 2013 1:45 pm

Average melee damage for me is about 50k or so. 60% of that is 30k. 6 attacks @30k = 180k damage when it procs. i.e. less than a Judgement crit. And it isn't like it'll be proccing every 10 seconds either. It'll probably be modified proc rate depending on weapon type equipped, and it really wouldn't surprise me if we got less than 1 proc every 30 seconds. And that would be about 2 million damage over the entire fight. On a boss with (in ten man) 500 million life or (25 man) over 1000 million life that damage is just going to fade into insignificance.

If anything, having the tank cloak proc on a berserked boss' killing blow, giving the raid 3-4 more seconds before the boss starts munching squishies will give the raid more damage on the boss (execute raid dps of a current 25 man raid is in the millions of dps, if not tens of millions if bloodlust is up).

Not to mention that the proc is an uncontrollable cleave effect.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Darielle » Sun Jul 07, 2013 4:56 am

Except we do have information on the DPS cloak proc, and we know that it's based on weapon damage. Which means it's going to be fairly crappy for us no matter what, because our weapon damage is very weak compared to other STR DPS classes, which is the target they'll be balancing around.


Average melee damage for me is about 50k or so. 60% of that is 30k. 6 attacks @30k = 180k damage when it procs. i.e. less than a Judgement crit. And it isn't like it'll be proccing every 10 seconds either. It'll probably be modified proc rate depending on weapon type equipped, and it really wouldn't surprise me if we got less than 1 proc every 30 secon


Likelihood of it being RPMM based which basically mirrors the Legendary proc rate adjustments for various specs with tiny variations is pretty high. The Capacitance once doesn't vary TOO wildly.
- Base proc rate is multiplied by an additional coefficient:
1.136 Combat
1.789 Assassination
1.114 Subtlety
1.339 Arms
1.152 Fury SMF
1.257 Fury TG
1.721 Feral Cat
1.532 Frost DK 2H
1.134 Frost DK DW
0.838 Unholy
1.295 Retribution
0.809 Enhancement
1.087 Monkbot
0.950 Beast Mastery
1.107 Marksmanship
0.950 Survival
1.000 Anyone Else


While they ARE going to adjust around DPS specs and what they have, and tank will be sitting on base rate, the numbers are very unlikely to take into account Vengeance in any way. Where I can get 1.5 million crit Lightning Strikes in the first 20 seconds on Dark Animus thanks to Vengeance (as an extreme case), the cloak proc would do ~800k, similar amounts for Psiven. Using Primordius as a more realistic example, my average noncrit 127k Lightning Strike proc would be ~113k. Psiven's would just break 100k. That's not as good single target for a single event, but depending on the base RPMM, it still has the potential to be impressive overall. And that would be to a single target, if it can take advantage of the aoe component in any way for a mechanic, the scaling would be hilarious.

@Fetz:
Why do you find that kind of frequency unrealistic? Especially given that Lightning Strikes can go off pretty close to that every 10 seconds mark?
And bear in mind, Lightning Strike on a situation with similar Vengeance to what you described would be only around 200k. It doesn't stop Lightning Strike from getting over 10% of damage.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Fetzie » Sun Jul 07, 2013 5:43 am

Unless they modify the proc rate according to weapon type.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Darielle » Sun Jul 07, 2013 6:23 am

Why would they need to, especially in a RPPM system? Especially at this point in the game where we don't really randomly have weapons of all speeds all over the place for the same spec barring for relatively rare exceptions.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Sagara » Sun Jul 07, 2013 8:04 am

Mmh, maybe to push tanks away from the dps cloak?
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby KysenMurrin » Sun Jul 07, 2013 8:07 am

They can do that by just modifying the proc rate by spec, like they already have done with a few RPPM items.
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Re: Patch 5.4 - Flex Raid, Siege of Orgrimmar, and more!

Postby Darielle » Sun Jul 07, 2013 1:34 pm

^ Not only that, but why is there going to be a need on their end to actively push tanks away from the dps cloak?
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