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Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby fuzzygeek » Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:20 am

On the one hand O.o, on the other hand -_-, on the gripping hand anything that means we'll be done farming all six of our casters oranges before March is ^_^.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby halabar » Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:24 am

Ocin wrote:From some of what I've read on the forums (US/EU) it'll give us 2 raid lockouts per week on current content and the LFR will be the same as it's already been outlined. It's a horrible idea imho.


It's only a terrible idea if you feel that you have to clear the content twice each week.

I'd like to see this for T13 as well, as it would help initial progression.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Dantriges » Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:29 am

The assumption is that it will be extended to current tier sometime in the future.

We had the same for Wrath more or less, at least if you raided 25 man.

I could imagine that for quite a few guilds who raid three times a week there will be requests from some people to do it twice, but probably only a sizable minority of people who are not happy anyways in their guild and the greedy ones.

What will happen is that some people in a guild raid twice a week and some do not with an increasing item disparity between both groups. Tensions will rise between "people not dedicated enough" and "too much time people". Add in that the stuff will get boring fast if you visit it often enough.

So it´s nice for you that you fell that you don´t have to raid two lockouts each week. Quite a few guys will be happy to tell you, that you have to. Good that they actually don´t have the luxury anymore to kick you if you aren´t in a dedicated hardcore progression guild with enough applications.

It´s a bandaid fix for not providing enough content to fill a week or for overnerfing it so you can clear it in time.

Oh and the requirement to raid 5 to 6 times a week only works if your majority is in the demogrphic bracket having that much free time. And well besides a few hardcore guys, your raidroster will have a lot of guys who just can´t stand to raid that amount of time and burn out after a while. And I think most guilds with that schedule only raid that much during progression time anyways with a cooldown period in between.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Ocin » Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:45 am

halabar wrote:
Ocin wrote:From some of what I've read on the forums (US/EU) it'll give us 2 raid lockouts per week on current content and the LFR will be the same as it's already been outlined. It's a horrible idea imho.


It's only a terrible idea if you feel that you have to clear the content twice each week.


This is the kind of reply I see plastered all over the official forums. It's probably a good idea for super casual guilds and raiders, that much I'll concede. Those of us that are already raiding 3 nights a week are going to have to allocate at least 4 nights a week, just to keep up with the better guilds so we have a selling point when it comes to recruiting.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby halabar » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:01 am

Ocin wrote:
halabar wrote:
Ocin wrote:From some of what I've read on the forums (US/EU) it'll give us 2 raid lockouts per week on current content and the LFR will be the same as it's already been outlined. It's a horrible idea imho.


It's only a terrible idea if you feel that you have to clear the content twice each week.


This is the kind of reply I see plastered all over the official forums. It's probably a good idea for super casual guilds and raiders, that much I'll concede. Those of us that are already raiding 3 nights a week are going to have to allocate at least 4 nights a week, just to keep up with the better guilds so we have a selling point when it comes to recruiting.


Why?.. to farm gear? If the guild is doing hard progression, then a second lockout really isn't needed. For a not-so hardcore guild, it's a great change if they do it for current content, as it would allow another look at early bosses instead of the second or third night being limited to banging their head on the current progression boss. It will also allow players with more time to be able to raid with the second or third night team.

The biggest impact for this will be as already mentioned, people farming the legendary.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Shoju » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:19 am

ZOMG I MUST KEEP UPZ WITH THE OTHER GUILDZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I mean the following words with no offense.

/yawn.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Hrobertgar » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:23 am

If this only applies to T11 & T12, then I view it as Blizz' effort to both help undergeared folks/casual players gear up, as well as to increase the amount of time the older content is run.

I mean, I have not set foot in T11 on any toon in like 2 months, and even then it was jsut to farm H-halfus tier token a couple times. If I wanted to gear up my bank alt, two lockouts would help there. My main toon also needs certain achievements, and sometimes farming them can be stressfull if there are too many people being carried. A twice a week lockout on OLDER content could then allow people to farm it les stressfully, realizing that being locked to a loser raid isn't as big of a penalty.

On T13, I agree that I don't want to be put into a situation in which I have to try to run it on normal a couple tiems per week for gear, given that I am already almost obligated to farm LFR a few times up front for gear.

As long as it is just T11 and T12, I will probably be fine with the change.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Ocin » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:40 am

@shoju and halabar: I've been there before in a non-hardcore raiding guild when there were separate lockouts for 25m and 10m in WotLK, and it creates problems and splinters up people's schedules, not to mention burn-out. By no means do I run a hardcore raiding guild, but I do try and keep my team competitive on our server and this will just create a bigger rift when it comes to recruiting great players.

Quoting Lore here from the official forums:

"There is nothing that I would like to happen less than this.

At the hardcore level, there is no difference between "letting" someone raid more often and "making" them raid more often. If this change goes in, raiding guilds will be forced to choose between falling behind in progression or spending twice as much time raiding.

At the same time, the guilds that choose to raid more often will begin chewing through content twice as fast.

I don't often post on the official forums. Came here just to say that this an absolutely terrible idea."

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic ... ?page=2#31
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Fridmarr » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:48 am

There is a MASSIVE difference between "letting" someone do anything and "making" someone do anything, period. I realize this new freedom alters the game dynamic profoundly since guild structures have been built around it, but that doesn't change the semantics of choice.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby halabar » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:54 am

Ocin wrote:the guilds that choose to raid more often will begin chewing through content twice as fast.


That's the only really valid argument.

I'm not going to cry over hard-core raiders that feel compelled to raid 24x7. Play/life balance, yadda yadda....
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby mavfin » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:58 am

Fridmarr wrote:There is a MASSIVE difference between "letting" someone do anything and "making" someone do anything, period. I realize this new freedom alters the game dynamic profoundly since guild structures have been built around it, but that doesn't change the semantics of choice.


How much have we heard that the 10/25 shared lockout was 'horrible' because the hardcores couldn't raid as much? Now they get to raid twice as much, and they're not happy? I guess my friend was right. Some people can't be satisfied, and bash every decision from Blizzard.
Last edited by mavfin on Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Teranoid » Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:00 pm

It's funny how in vanilla and BC 5 day a week 5 hours a night was the norm for hardcore progression guilds and now everyone complains how more than 2 nights a week is too much. Gotta love it.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Fridmarr » Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:14 pm

Well from what I've read (mostly on other sites) there's a lot of narrow perspectives been thrown around with this idea. I'm not suggesting it's either good or bad for the game as a whole, but I just see a lot of folks saying it is good/bad for me, therefore it's great/terrible.

I know I would have loved this option at various times as a casual guild, the more control we had over the lockout process the more successful we could be. There's good reason for guilds in all sorts of situations to reset the lockout early or extend it. I think it's a nice choice to have but that doesn't mean it won't be abused in some way that could negatively affect the game. That's probably why they are just experimenting with it at this point.
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Fridmarr » Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:21 pm

mavfin wrote:
Fridmarr wrote:There is a MASSIVE difference between "letting" someone do anything and "making" someone do anything, period. I realize this new freedom alters the game dynamic profoundly since guild structures have been built around it, but that doesn't change the semantics of choice.


How much have we heard that the 10/25 shared lockout was 'horrible' because the hardcores couldn't raid as much? Now they get to raid twice as much, and they're not happy? I guess my friend was right. Some people can't be satisfied, and bash every decision from Blizzard.

Well Lore's comment seems odd to me:
Lore wrote:If this change goes in, raiding guilds will be forced to choose between falling behind in progression or spending twice as much time raiding.
Is that really true? I mean if you are still progressing competitively, aren't you already raiding at full capacity?
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Re: Raid CD reset - 2x a week on TW/KR realms

Postby Ocin » Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:27 pm

Teranoid wrote:It's funny how in vanilla and BC 5 day a week 5 hours a night was the norm for hardcore progression guilds and now everyone complains how more than 2 nights a week is too much. Gotta love it.


3 nights is plenty for me at the moment. I just see this pushing us to at least 4 nights which will drive some of my raiders away—and that's always a joy in a 10man raiding guild with 1 team :P
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