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Blizzcon predictions?..

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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Ocin » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:38 pm

"The goals for dungeons and raids in Mists of Pandaria are to create epic and challenging experiences, but Cataclysm also helped us learn where we can improve with the new expansion. The Raid Finder will help with taking that first step into endgame content, and it will be available for all Mists of Pandaria raids. Beyond that, we want to create more easily understandable encounters and move away from mechanics that simply set up groups to fail, while still keeping them challenging."

That's taken from the dungeons & raids panel page, but I bolded the last sentence. I really wonder what Blizz is trying to fix? I've enjoyed the current raiding tier, but at the same time I've read from some raiders that they were bored. I'm just wondering how they can dumb things down and keep super progressed raiders happy?

I get the feeling that Blizz might be trying too hard to keep everyone happy.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Steve » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:56 pm

They might be referring to mechanics that allow any player in the raid to wipe you.

The first example of this that comes to mind was Archimonde and his soul charges. If a player in the raid died, it was usually a wipe (especially if they were a Paladin, Priest, or Warlock). So if someone cratered because they have a bad connection, or if someone just could not seem to grasp the idea that before fear goes off you need lots of room between you and doomfire, then they would repeatedly wipe you. You absolutely couldn't carry them through the encounter.

I think generally Blizzard, on LFR and normal modes, has to get back to the idea of allowing a subset of key players to basically carry the others through encounters (80-20 rule). Step #1 is removing mechanics like these from LFR/Normal. Step #2 is probably removing enrage timers/soft enrage mechanics from LFR and most normal mode encounters.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Paxen » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:01 am

Ocin wrote:That's taken from the dungeons & raids panel page, but I bolded the last sentence. I really wonder what Blizz is trying to fix? I've enjoyed the current raiding tier, but at the same time I've read from some raiders that they were bored. I'm just wondering how they can dumb things down and keep super progressed raiders happy?


They're trying to fix the problem where you no longer learn to be a raider, but have to learn each individual boss. There was always some of that element, but the skills carried over between bosses is a lot less than it used to be.

Note that my raiding experience in cata is pretty slim, got most of that from greedygoblin.blogspot.com and tobolds.blogspot.com. My limited experience does bear it out, but it is, well, limited.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Worldie » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:03 am

Probably they mean to move out from encounter-specific mechanics that a non elite raider would have an hard time to learn, like Alystrazor tornados *cough* (which was not about not standing in fire, but just about realizing you need to do a O path.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby fuzzygeek » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:10 am

Arnock wrote:I don't know, I'm just getting the impression that Activision is trying to milk all of the money that they can out of WoW before it collapses under its own weight.


If I were going to milk something to death, I wouldn't spend money on developer time to drastically change talent trees and root game mechanics. I would just keep tweaking what's there because it would be cheap, and people are comfortable with it, and just coast on inertia for as long as possible. It would require very little time and energy investment to milk a product. Increasing the marketing and art design budget and reducing developer and programmers is a bad sign. I don't think this is what's happening here. If Blizzard was just milking things, I think they would spend a lot of time on safe things. Like updating model textures.

The huge amount of work they've rolled out at blizzcon suggests this is not what they are doing. People will like and dislike what's being done, but the time and energy and financial investment is not the sign of an agenda being set by someone more interested in collecting money than making a better product.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Gracerath » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:36 am

jumped the shark


Or as someone from another forum I read might say - rocket propelled over the shark.

When something that is originally shown as an april fools day joke ends up being the focus of an expansion, I'd say rocket propelled indeed. A good friend of mine made a great remark to me earlier. Its like if they made Diablo 3: The Cow Level as the first D3 expansion.

Anyhow, I wish Blizzard luck with whatever the hell their plan is for the future. I won't be a part of it.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Passionario » Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:25 am

Gracerath wrote:When something that is originally shown as an april fools day joke ends up being the focus of an expansion, I'd say rocket propelled indeed. A good friend of mine made a great remark to me earlier. Its like if they made Diablo 3: The Cow Level as the first D3 expansion.


After the grim dark present of the Cataclysm, where there is only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting Old Gods (punctuated by the sound of Val'kyr torturing some crippled Gilnean refugee), I appreciate the return to Warcraft's signature light-hearted humor.

Ocin wrote:That's taken from the dungeons & raids panel page, but I bolded the last sentence. I really wonder what Blizz is trying to fix? I've enjoyed the current raiding tier, but at the same time I've read from some raiders that they were bored. I'm just wondering how they can dumb things down and keep super progressed raiders happy?

I believe the most popular word at the moment for this sort of mechanics is "dancing", although terms like "twitch gaming", "Guitar Hero" and "Simon Says" also exist, along with the good old "don't stand in the fire". Basically, mechanics that rely primarily on reaction speed and situational awareness to move away from an environmental hazard or towards a safe/power spot.

And while not standing in the fire has been a persistent part of raiding since Magmadar and Gehennas, there is a growing sentiment among the non-hardcore community (including many prominent WoW bloggers) that Cataclysm encounters rely on them far too much. Each encounter has multiple types of fire to watch out for, every encounter has different types of fire (so skills learned on one fight don't carry over), any misstep will kill you extremely quickly, and you're essentially forced to play a class-agnostic minigame instead of playing your actual class (a warlock dodges Alysrazor's tornados just like a paladin; a shaman collapses towards Blackout just like a druid would).

If the sounds familiar, it's because they've already stumbled into that trap once in WotLK. Vehicle combat required players to play a mini-game instead of playing their actual classes, learning how to fly on Malygos did not prepare you for Tournament jousting, and a single mistimed click could easily lead to a wipe. Needless to say, players weren't happy - even after all nerfs and bribes, many preferred to steer clear of Oculus. One of the many reasons why Ulduar was more popular than Firelands is because Ulduar did not require half of the raid to ride vehicles for every single boss fight. :)
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby KysenMurrin » Sat Oct 22, 2011 2:22 am

So, they've said they're moving Heroic 5 mans back to a WotLK-level difficulty, how do people feel about that? The Challenge Modes are meant to be the way they're giving people challenge instead of the Heroics themselves, but personally I don't care for speed runs of instances, I find that kind of pace a bit frustrating.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Sagara » Sat Oct 22, 2011 2:29 am

11 A.M. here, finished reading the topic, MMO Champ and WoW Insider.

Three words: Sign. Me. In. It's not as testosterone-laden as the last two x-packs, but the story can hold (we CREATE our own enemy this time around - it can have some very interesting implications story-wise). Yeah, there are pandas-people. We already have cow-people, wolf-people, walrus-people, hyenas-people, fish-people, bird-people, bandage-people. Your point was? It was a joke race? It's not anymore, let's first see if those panda have a decent writeup and personality.

Technically, there's the inconsequential (Pokémon? *not caring*), but the new talent overhaul is really interesting and more like "keep going the way we went with Cataclysm". PVE scenarios and such? Good concept, let's see where it goes.

Raids and dungeons, we're WAY too early to comment on. New class? Sounds interesting, but alo too early to comment on.

Globally: I'm not as pumped up as when i heard CATACLYYYYYYYYYYYYYSM, but I'm a serene, cerbral, hopeful mood, which is pretty much par for the concepts of the new x-pack.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Klaudandus » Sat Oct 22, 2011 5:28 am

Did you guys miss the Metzen interview or what?

This is when he hints what the bad guys will be. (starting around the 4 min mark)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHDYGywd5Os
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby KysenMurrin » Sat Oct 22, 2011 5:46 am

The stuff revealed so far suggested that the Pandaren leader 10,000 years ago made some kind of shady bargain to protect Pandaria from the sundering, and the big evil will be related to that. (Running alongside the stuff about the two other "bad" races on Pandaria.)
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Klaudandus » Sat Oct 22, 2011 5:59 am

Also, those complaining about the nebulous nature regarding the big bad, I'd say it was handled worse with Deathwing in Cata, there's no real sense of urgency from any of the faction leaders or world heroes (like tyrion) regarding Deathwing.

LK at least had you encounter the LK in several quests, and the LK would actually do something that would piss off both factions and, and also draw in outside factions too, into pooling their resources together and bring down the LK.

So even tho they told us DW was the big bad, I am currently more disappointed with cata when it comes to big bads than I am with MoP about having to find who the big bad is in the first place.

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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby KysenMurrin » Sat Oct 22, 2011 7:53 am

Blackwing Descent didn't really get any tie in to the Cataclysm other than the person behind it. They could've had it be about going after Nefarian to try and find out something about how to stop Deathwing, but nope, we just went to BWD because it was there.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby Arnock » Sat Oct 22, 2011 7:56 am

KysenMurrin wrote:Blackwing Descent didn't really get any tie in to the Cataclysm other than the person behind it. They could've had it be about going after Nefarian to try and find out something about how to stop Deathwing, but nope, we just went to BWD because it was there.



Eh, well ulduar didn't have really have a tie-in to Arthas.
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Re: Blizzcon predictions?..

Postby KysenMurrin » Sat Oct 22, 2011 7:57 am

But it did have a big lore lead in with Bran Bronzebeard.
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