All about sports

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Re: All about sports

Postby Shoju » Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:41 am

Nakama wrote:
Shoju wrote:A couple of responses to topics and a Tribe note.

I'm very happy that the tribe picked up Giambi. He doesn't hit well, but he's had several clutch hits this season. He only came because Francona was willing to tutor him to be a coach / manager, and many of the younger guys on the team say he is a great source of knowledge in the clubhouse, and he's been great to have around. When you are building to make a team a contender, sometimes, you need that grizzled veteran presence to help keep things level headed. And honestly? I had forgotten that he was a PED user until my 16 y/o brought it up. I had forgotten. It's amazing what you can forget when it's not shoved in your face every day.

On the Rays? Man, I love that team. I love that they prove that you don't need a 100+M payroll to compete. I love that Maddon as a manager. What a great guy. And Thank you to the Ump last night for giving them first place again.

On the Bucs, My son and I are rooting for them. I'm not a fan of them, but I like HUrdle as a manager. Every time I hear him talk, He makes me like him more. I'll be rooting for them, right up until they play the rays or the tribe.

As far as A-Rod is concerned, if he REALLY did tamper with the biogenesis case by trying to intimidate witnesses, and purchase documents to keep them away from them, I hope to god that they throw the book at him. Crush him underfoot, ban him for life. If Rose can be banned for Gambling, never to see the inside of the Hall as a member, I don't want A-Rod anywhere near that place.


Damn your Indians for keeping up with the Royals! We can't be the surprise of the season with both you and the Tigers winning games the same time we have a 9 game winning streak! :)

A-Rod needs to just go away, forever. I sincerely doubt he's even vaguely clean on any aspect of the Biogenesis case.

--Jed



I'm just hoping that we stay relevant this season. This wasn't even the season that the Front Office had projected would be a "good" season for us. This was supposed to be the "lets make some moves, find some players that might work, and plan for 2014 as a run."

But, they've found some good pieces, and.... some not so good pieces. Raburn is CLUTCH and is quickly becoming a fan favorite for both his play, and his "I don't have to play every day to contribute, and I'm ok with that" work ethic. He makes the most of his opportunities, a quality that will endear you to the fans of Cleveland quickly. Swisher, has been a great addition, even if his numbers are down. Bourn is pretty solid, and most fans want to keep him. Stubbs is surprising people with his defense, even when his bat is worthless. Reynolds.... Well... Yeah. Interesting. He is still well liked. There is a lot of Apathy right now about his play. Kazmir is liked. Allballsdo Nostrikemez isn't the villain he was last year.

And Francona? Well... It would be hard to find a coach / manager that Cleveland has had in recent memory that is as well liked this early in his tenure. Last one I can think of would be Charlie Manuel, but I don't even know if he was this well liked.

And The news late last night, was that talks have stalled between A-Fraud and MLB. He wants his money, he doesn't want that long of a suspension, and he's just being the typical Bitch Tit that Jose Canseco called him (on A-Fraud's BDay no less).
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:51 am

Yeah, of course he doesnt want a long suspenion, AKA life... that means he doesn't get the rest of the contract money if he gets banned.

If I was cooperstown, and there was a need to have an A-Rod photo somewhere in the hall, I'd put this one
Image
just to show what a human puke he is.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fetzie » Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:55 am

Klaudandus wrote:Yeah, of course he doesnt want a long suspenion, AKA life... that means he doesn't get the rest of the contract money if he gets banned.

If I was cooperstown, and there was a need to have an A-Rod photo somewhere in the hall, I'd put this one
Image
just to show what a human puke he is.


Is that a HANDBAG he is carrying?
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:59 am

yeah, they photoshopped a handbag on him

here is that play on youtube
http://youtu.be/pZNujnIojMw?t=32m39s

the game was suspended for about 30 mins after the yankees fan decided to throw bunch of beer bottles onto the field following the umps decision on that play

a-rod even tried to plead his case to the umps, saying that was his natural running motion that knocked down the ball rather than what the pic shows, that he wilfully and forcefully swatted at the arm of bronson arroyo to knock down the ball off the glove.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fetzie » Sat Aug 03, 2013 6:41 am

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Sagara wrote:You see, you need to *spread* the bun before you insert the hot dog.

bldavis wrote:we are trying to extend it as long as we can...it just never seems to last very long
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Sun Aug 04, 2013 4:18 pm

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Re: All about sports

Postby Koatanga » Sun Aug 04, 2013 7:09 pm

Klaudandus wrote:http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaaf--ncaa-probe-of-johnny-manziel-raises-questions-about-amateurism-rules-230350855.html
Make it Johnny Dumbass


I'll grant he knew, or should have known, that selling his signature was against the NCAA, but the NCAA is so fundamentally flawed I can't take their side of it. If Manziel blows a knee this year, he walks (limps) away with nothing while the NCAA and A&M made tens of millions off of him.

College athletes should be able to make independent endorsement deals with organisations not related to the University. If the NCAA wanted to police and control it, they could operate as an agency, taking a percentage of the endorsements as would a professional agent take a portion of a professional player's endorsements. I'd have no issue with that, and the NCAA would retain control over what gets endorsed to protect the image of college sports, and maintain agreements with major sponsors.

It's just ridiculous that so much money pours into college football and the players are barred from making any of it.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:21 pm

Koatanga wrote:I'll grant he knew, or should have known, that selling his signature was against the NCAA, but the NCAA is so fundamentally flawed I can't take their side of it.

Hear hear!
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Sun Aug 04, 2013 11:02 pm

Man sometimes umpires just make my skin crawl: http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-l ... 09577.html

TLDR: Guy takes a strike that looks maybe outside. He says something to the ump and and then steps out of the batters box, a fairly typical and subtle method to let an umpire know you disagree with the call, without showing him up. A few seconds later, the umpire calls strike 2, and then calls strike 3, both without pitches. The hitter was out of the box for about 9 seconds total before being rung up on two strikes using the delay rule. And of course, as soon as the batter says one word after that he's ejected. Absolutely ridiculous...
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Re: All about sports

Postby halabar » Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:15 am

Koatanga wrote:
Klaudandus wrote:http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaaf--ncaa-probe-of-johnny-manziel-raises-questions-about-amateurism-rules-230350855.html
Make it Johnny Dumbass


I'll grant he knew, or should have known, that selling his signature was against the NCAA, but the NCAA is so fundamentally flawed I can't take their side of it. If Manziel blows a knee this year, he walks (limps) away with nothing while the NCAA and A&M made tens of millions off of him.

College athletes should be able to make independent endorsement deals with organisations not related to the University. If the NCAA wanted to police and control it, they could operate as an agency, taking a percentage of the endorsements as would a professional agent take a portion of a professional player's endorsements. I'd have no issue with that, and the NCAA would retain control over what gets endorsed to protect the image of college sports, and maintain agreements with major sponsors.

It's just ridiculous that so much money pours into college football and the players are barred from making any of it.


Totally agree that the player should make something, but that also opens a huge world of abuse and other issues.

However, Johnny Football is the next Todd Marinovich, if he even makes it that far.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:22 am

I think the NCAA has archaic rules, and that is a problem.

On the other hand, Johnny Manziel knew the rules and decided to break them.
The Manziel family is well-off
He has a full scholarship
He acts like he doesn't care about eligibility, the collegiate experience or anything else, given that he was partying the day before the Manning camp and decided to call-in sick rather than show up with a hangover to do his charity work.

As an Aggie, thank you for your on-the-field performances, but Gawd, you're making it very hard to like you off-the-field.
Can't say I didn't smile when he was kicked out of a UT frat house a couple of weekends ago. Dumbass.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Flex » Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:10 pm

The NBA and NFL just need to suck it up and implement some real junior leagues around the country and skip the entire NCAA joke.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Teranoid » Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:10 pm

Wow. That list of 50 game suspensions is riddled with a bunch of nobodies. Wonder what it's like to take steroids and still be terrible.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Aug 06, 2013 3:58 pm

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Re: All about sports

Postby Koatanga » Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:40 pm

Klaudandus wrote:http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-dr-saturday/broker-claims-paid-johnny-manziel-7-500-sign-202358867.html

Johnny Manziel... you ass!

I'll just copy/paste my previous response. Texas A&M is making an estimated $10 million from Manziel, but he's an ass for making $7,500. The NCAA must find some way to allow the athletes to share in the profits that are made from the athletes, even if only a small percentage of profits.

Just take 5% off the top distributed on a weighted basis per school, based on program revenue, which in turn is distributed to the athletes on a split proportional to NFL average salaries per position, defined as the position they play as at the end of the season, with a 60/40 split between starters and backups, whereby an injured starter and his replacement are both considered to be starters. Job done.

If I can come up with a quasi-equitable profit share in 5 minutes, just think of what the NCAA could do with all of their bright minds.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:53 pm

heh well it's a system, I'm not sure how equitable it would be, and the hurdles to implement something like that even if the NCAA wanted too are many and high.

I don't mind the concept of an NCAA regulating collegiate sports to keep the system fair and the leagues healthy, the problem is the implementation.

First of all, the NCAA are bullies. They govern over the athletic programs but are not in any way accountable to the athletes and barely the schools. Not surprisingly in that sort of system, you end up with a bit of a tyrannical oligarchy.

A few years back, Nebraska wanted to give their athletes a stipend, the NCAA told them no. Nebraska pursued it anyhow, and the NCAA informed them that paying a stipend would cause them to be removed from the NCAA and any team that played them would also be removed from the NCAA, effectively ending Nebraska's athletic program if they continued.

When an administration is found in violation of the rules, the punishment mostly lands on the current players, no matter how long ago the "crime" was. If the players try to change schools to avoid the punishment for a crime that they weren't any part of, they are (with very few exceptions) punished again with a year of ineligibility.

If a coach (who often recruits players to play in "their system") decides to leave the school for more money or whatever, the player must stay behind or be punished for leaving.

Then there's all the draconian sorts of rules and enforcement like you have with Johnny. I mean, yes he should have known what he was doing was a violation. These sorts of cases create headlines and happen quite often. I'm sure the players are taught about this sort of thing as well. On the other hand, the NCAA is so hypocritical about this.

If I'm a student at A&M I could take a pic of Manziel doing something stupid and probably sell it to a national rag for a chunk of change. Any student can make money off of Johnny Manziel...except Johnny Manziel. Yet the NCAA want's to keep pounding the "he's a student" mantra, it's bullshit.

I get that he's not exactly playing for free, as his education, room and board are paid for. I understand that opening up a system where the players could get endorsements and the like will just reduce college football to a few schools buying recruits, but certainly there's a happy medium to be reached here with a little common sense and a governing body that's actually accountable to the groups that they govern.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Wed Aug 07, 2013 4:59 am

I'm not saying the NCAA is not wrong! There's plenty of wrong with it!

I think coaches that quit/change colleges should be barred from working at the school they're going to for a year.

I think that players that come to a college with the idea of being under a coach and then that coach bolts, should be eligible to transfer to another school without penalty.

Heck, the NCAA is a hypocrite: http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the ... 10661.html

However... Johnny Manziel still did wrong! And I'm a goddamn Aggie!
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Re: All about sports

Postby Shoju » Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:22 am

I'm of the opinion that the NCAA is a joke. it's a sham, and I REALLY hope that the class action lawsuit against them ends with a landslide victory for the Plaintiffs.

Collegiate Sports is the only thing on a college campus where you are actively BARRED from making any money off of a set of skills that you posses, even while on scholarship.

I can speak with direct knowledge that I was not only allowed, but encouraged by my College to take side jobs, and earn cash while I was enrolled, using the knowledge I was learning at the University, while the University was picking up the dime for my expenses. My Academic Advisor, Professor's, Hell, even the DEAN OF ADMISSIONS offered me sidework.

I can speak with direct knowledge that while my sister's roommate was enrolled at Ohio State, and in the OSU Symphony (or whatever they call their Orchestra), she played gigs in local places, making money, and she was on Scholarship to OSU. It's how she paid for the other things that her scholarship DIDN'T cover while going to school.

I know that Actors, and Actresses, and Comedians, and all other manner of people have gone to school, on scholarship, while famous (Wasn't it River's Cuomo from Weezer who went Ivy League on an Academic Scholarship?), and making money.

But, Because College Athletics (okay, in most cases just basketball, and Football) are BIG BUSINESS for the NCAA, they don't want to lose any of that pie. Video Games, Jersey Sales, etc... that's a HUGE PIE that they currently don't have to share, and they can make all of it FOR FREE off of the indentured servitude of the "Student Athlete"

Getting paid for Appearances
Getting Paid for Autographs
Getting Free Stuff

Isn't that part of the Celebrity lifestyle that they foster? Isn't that the very culture that they have worked to cultivate to make their product (college sports) more equitable?

To me, I have absolutely no problem with what Manziel did. He shouldn't have done it, because he knows it's against the rules. But, If you want my opinion, I just don't care. I don't think that the NCAA should care. I didn't care that Bush got stuff at USC. I didn't care that Buckeyes Sold their Gold Pants, and got free Tattoos.

I do care that the NCAA seems to want to make sure that they are the only people profiting off the kids though.
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Re: All about sports

Postby halabar » Wed Aug 07, 2013 8:41 am

It's really simple...

Players should get a default base "salary".

Players whose names and likenesses are used should get a cut.

Players should be able to sign autographs and such and get paid, as the market bears.

The problem is, what do you do about the other sports?

You do need to make sure all schools are paying the same, otherwise the boosters will run amuck.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Wed Aug 07, 2013 9:51 am

All the other sports are leeching off the football programs, and the basketball program to a lesser degree.

Ask the guy in the swimming team. Ask the guy in the tennis program.

The incoming money from football is what pays for the other sports programs.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Shoju » Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:44 am

Klaudandus wrote:All the other sports are leeching off the football programs, and the basketball program to a lesser degree.

Ask the guy in the swimming team. Ask the guy in the tennis program.

The incoming money from football is what pays for the other sports programs.


This has made me look at my opinion about this topic over the past couple of years. Originally, I was of the opinion "PAY EM!" But, that would "hurt" the other sports. But something needs to be done. Barring a kid from making money off the celebrity that they earned is just ridiculous. The NCAA/Universities pocketing all the money from NCAA Licensed Video Games featuring the likeness of the "Student Athlete" is also ridiculous. This isn't the 1950's when people wearing Jersey's was not a common sight, or when the majority of your income came from ticket sales. This is the digital age, and they are (as Bilas proved) doing EVERYTHING they can to bilk money out of the likeness of a Student Athlete, while working hard to ensure that the Student Athlete can't capitalize on it themselves.

Honestly? I'm all for endorsement deals, and allowing kids to accept money for appearances and Autographs, and opening up the rules on gifts a little. That works for all sports, all athletes. Just because the main stream society doesn't pay serious attention to a sport doesn't mean it doesn't have fans. And where there are fans, there are endorsement deals. No, they won't be comparably equitable deals comparing FB & Hoops to Lacrosse, and Swimming. But if the kid can get an endorsement deal? They should be allowed.

If someone wants to pay them 7500 bucks to sign a ton of merch? Well, that's fine. Why is it ok for someone to sell an autograph that they get at a game, or at an event, for money, and profit on it, but the guy doing the signing isn't? That just boggles my mind.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Flex » Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:59 am

Like I said earlier the NFL and NBA need to really do what both MLB and NHL already do.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:01 pm

Well endorsements suffer from similar problems.  Big schools will already have endorsements lined up for recruits.  It's just a way to funnel money to recruits which results a league that is much less compelling than it is now.  It's no different than a booster handing a kid money to go to school X, which is all any sort of endorsement system will become.
 
In big schools other sports get to leech off of football, but many football programs aren't even profitable when you step away from the BCS division (or even some fringe schools in that division).  It's not a simple issue to solve, but the current solution could easily be improved.
 
 
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Re: All about sports

Postby Koatanga » Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:54 pm

halabar wrote:It's really simple...

Players should get a default base "salary".

Players whose names and likenesses are used should get a cut.

Players should be able to sign autographs and such and get paid, as the market bears.

The problem is, what do you do about the other sports?

You do need to make sure all schools are paying the same, otherwise the boosters will run amuck.

The NCAA should be that regulatory agency.

If they operated as an agent for all college players, then they could broker sponsorship deals for them on local and national levels. If the money for those endorsements and signature merchandise and etc. went into a pool, combined with NCAA's income from TV rights, etc., then a portion of it could be earmarked for other sports, some could go to competition-evening pools, such that Big 10 schools would share a portion of the profits from all Big 10 games, and a portion could go back to the players to reward them for earning the money in the first place.

Under that arrangement, players would get used to dealing with an agent and be exposed to the business side of being a professional athlete, smoothing their transition into the professional ranks. They would still have the regular agents for brokering their professional contracts.

Everybody wins, and the NCAA doesn't have to be a draconian douchebag.
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Re: All about sports

Postby halabar » Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:21 pm

Koatanga wrote:
halabar wrote:It's really simple...

Players should get a default base "salary".

Players whose names and likenesses are used should get a cut.

Players should be able to sign autographs and such and get paid, as the market bears.

The problem is, what do you do about the other sports?

You do need to make sure all schools are paying the same, otherwise the boosters will run amuck.

The NCAA should be that regulatory agency.

If they operated as an agent for all college players, then they could broker sponsorship deals for them on local and national levels. If the money for those endorsements and signature merchandise and etc. went into a pool, combined with NCAA's income from TV rights, etc., then a portion of it could be earmarked for other sports, some could go to competition-evening pools, such that Big 10 schools would share a portion of the profits from all Big 10 games, and a portion could go back to the players to reward them for earning the money in the first place.

Under that arrangement, players would get used to dealing with an agent and be exposed to the business side of being a professional athlete, smoothing their transition into the professional ranks. They would still have the regular agents for brokering their professional contracts.

Everybody wins, and the NCAA doesn't have to be a draconian douchebag.


Sure, as long as you fire all the current administration of the NCAA and start over, but the current jerks in those seats would never do the job well. (Get rid of the guys in charge of the various conferences as well, since that's pretty corrupt as well).
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