All about sports

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Re: All about sports

Postby Flex » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:20 am

Klaudandus wrote:Fuck RGIII and his ROTY... Luck and Wilson are more deserving


20 TDs and only 5 Ints, more yards than Wilson on roughly the same number of attempts, RG3 has 1 more attempt. 752 yards rushing and 6 rushing TDs.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:21 am

lol, good grief klaud...
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Re: All about sports

Postby Flex » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:25 am

Klaudandus wrote:Wilson is more mobile than other QBs, but doesnt seem to be as prone as RGIII to run for it and therefore I see him having a longer career than RGIII


I guess you didn't see the 'skins last game against the Eagles where RG3 was pretty immobile due to his knee injury and threaded beautiful passes.

He's a lot more than a running Quarterback.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:26 am

ok, fine, don't give it to wilson~ I still like Luck more than RGIII. Specially since the Colts were the worst team in the NFL last season, and are on the verge of going to the playoffs as a #2 seed (with some luck -- no pun intended)
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:27 am

Flex wrote:
Klaudandus wrote:Wilson is more mobile than other QBs, but doesnt seem to be as prone as RGIII to run for it and therefore I see him having a longer career than RGIII


I guess you didn't see the 'skins last game against the Eagles where RG3 was pretty immobile due to his knee injury and threaded beautiful passes.

He's a lot more than a running Quarterback.


I hardly watched that game, I'll be honest... and I'll like RGIII more if he learns not to be as reckless as he has been; hopefully he has learned his lesson with the knee injury he got.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Flex » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:30 am

.
I've got a pretty good sense of things for the Seahawks. No Wilson has not carried the Seahawks all year long the way that RGIII has with the skins, partially it's because he doesn't need too, but another part is that Wilson got to spend the first three quarters of the year just managing the games, RGIII never had that luxury.


This really understates how bad the Redskins defense was for most of the season. Somehow over the past month they've reached a "bend but don't break" point that works most of the time so RG3 and the offense doesn't need to put up 30+ points for a chance at winning.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Flex » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:33 am

Klaudandus wrote:I hardly watched that game, I'll be honest... and I'll like RGIII more if he learns not to be as reckless as he has been; hopefully he has learned his lesson with the knee injury he got.


The "reckless" behaviour combined with Alfred Morris becoming an amazing running back is what makes the offense so potent. It freezes defensive players hard where they have no idea where to go.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Teranoid » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:37 am

Klaudandus wrote:I'd say, Kirk Cousins also carried the redskins on his shoulders, considering that RGIII knocked himself out of a couple of games with his recklessness... and Kirk is the reason why they're even 9-6 and close to winning the division.


It makes it almost impossible to take you seriously when you post shit like this.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:38 am

Klaudandus wrote:ok, fine, don't give it to wilson~ I still like Luck more than RGIII. Specially since the Colts were the worst team in the NFL last season, and are on the verge of going to the playoffs as a #2 seed (with some luck -- no pun intended)

Yeah, I'm sure Luck will get some votes because of that. I don't think I could give it to Luck over the other two because his numbers are a step down in comparison, but he has done a terrific job for the Colts this year.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:30 pm

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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:30 pm

Cleveland won't need a QB, Big Ben will throw it to them.

Screw Rex Ryan. Realistically he's handled that situation about as bad as anyone could have dreamed. I guess I don't blame him for not starting Tebow at this point. If he did and Tebow was better than terrible, he'd be under that much more heat. Though I would hope it's too late to save him at this point.

EDIT: Also RGIII being the first rookie QB since Marino to be an outright selection to the Pro Bowl (while Wilson wasn't selected at all), probably isn't helping Wilson either.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Paxen » Thu Dec 27, 2012 6:36 pm

Can't say I think Ryan did anything wrong from the info in the article. Losing your QB three days before the game isn't a situation anyone plans for, and can you really blame him for going with the guy who has actually played and practiced with the team when he's got two practices and a walkthrough?

Tebow has never shown himself to be a decent quarterback. Sure, he won some games last year, but so did Sanchez. It's not that hard to win games with a great defense.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Thu Dec 27, 2012 8:16 pm

I think there was a reasonable debate to be had with Sanchez and Tebow, earlier in the year. Sanchez was particularly bad this year, statistically worse than Tebow as a passer, never mind Tebow's running abilities.

Ultimately though, I don't really care about any of that. The NFL and the idiots in the sports media (who rank extremely high on the idiot level), are a whole lot more interesting if Tebow does play. I was hoping to see some of that this year.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Koatanga » Thu Dec 27, 2012 10:06 pm

Fridmarr wrote:Cleveland won't need a QB, Big Ben will throw it to them.

Screw Rex Ryan. Realistically he's handled that situation about as bad as anyone could have dreamed. I guess I don't blame him for not starting Tebow at this point. If he did and Tebow was better than terrible, he'd be under that much more heat. Though I would hope it's too late to save him at this point.

EDIT: Also RGIII being the first rookie QB since Marino to be an outright selection to the Pro Bowl (while Wilson wasn't selected at all), probably isn't helping Wilson either.


Well, Pro Bowl selection does say it all. For instance, I was all fired up about Richard Sherman being the best corner in the league, but since he didn't get selected for the Pro Bowl, I guess he's just another also-ran, in spite of his 7 interception, league-leading 30 passes defended, and the ability to remove receivers like Calvin Johnson from the game. What a chump.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:53 am

Well, he didn't get selected because of the PED use. Apparently he won his appeal today though...but yeah there were several articles about that with teams saying they wouldn't vote for him even though they think he's the best CB and it's not even close. It's unfortunate for him especially given that he ended up winning his appeal (at least that's what he is reporting), but it wasn't an oversight about his skills.

And before you trot off to attempt to find an actual legitimate snub for your point, lets not try to make yet another straw man, I didn't say that the Pro Bowl was the end all be all, I said it wasn't going to help Wilson's cause for the Rookie of the Year, which isn't really debatable. So go poke somewhere else.
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Re: All about sports

Postby halabar » Fri Dec 28, 2012 8:43 am

Fridmarr wrote:I think there was a reasonable debate to be had with Sanchez and Tebow, earlier in the year. Sanchez was particularly bad this year, statistically worse than Tebow as a passer, never mind Tebow's running abilities.

Ultimately though, I don't really care about any of that. The NFL and the idiots in the sports media (who rank extremely high on the idiot level), are a whole lot more interesting if Tebow does play. I was hoping to see some of that this year.


The thing that really perplexes me is that if the Jets are going to dump Tebow, you think they would want to try to showcase his abilities to increase trade value. Although, perhaps that is what they are trying to do with the Sanchize.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Sat Dec 29, 2012 1:58 pm

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Re: All about sports

Postby Koatanga » Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:27 pm

Ok, I officially concede every point in the Wilson vs RGIII debate.

While Wilson did come to a Seattle and completely turn around an offense that redefined "pathetic", he's simply in the wrong city.

Take this last week, for example. Wilson goes against the #1 defense in football and throws 4 TDs, and had an 18-second scramble reminiscent of Benny Hill, en route to a blowout. RGIII goes against the #11 Philadelphia Eagles and scores two touchdowns. Rookie of the Week? RGIII.

If things are going the stacked that hard against Wilson, there's no chance he'll be getting a sniff of any rookie honours.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Teranoid » Sat Dec 29, 2012 3:53 pm

That's the biggest sticking point I think in this entire debate.

It's the Redskins potentially being taken to the playoffs by a rookie QB for the first time since 1999. The same team whose owner seems to go out of his way to see how he can sabotage the team before the season even starts. The team that has been a bottom feeder and a joke for years. The Colts had one down year out of what.. 10?

Tell you what give Luck ROTY if the Colts went 2-14 last year with Manning starting every game. When you have shit quarterbacks like Curtis Painter and Dan "I'm only known for being that guy Jared Allen ran out of the end zone" Orlovsky of course you're destined for absolute failure and unless you're the Browns the only way to go is up.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Paxen » Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:38 pm

It's almost like everybody went "Oh, they scored 42 on the Niners? That defense can't have been all that good then" even though it was probably regarded as at least top 5 by everybody before that game.

I do think the lack of Justin Smith and an effective 6 quarters of football against the Pats the week before played a role.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Sat Dec 29, 2012 6:34 pm

Paxen wrote:It's almost like everybody went "Oh, they scored 42 on the Niners? That defense can't have been all that good then" even though it was probably regarded as at least top 5 by everybody before that game.

I do think the lack of Justin Smith and an effective 6 quarters of football against the Pats the week before played a role.
Nah, it's the NFL that's how it works. Good teams, good offenses, good defenses, get their ass handed to them sometimes. That same defense gave up 34 the week before (and they aren't on the hook for the blocked FG returned for a TD in the Seattle game). They are a good defense a very good defense in fact. These days though, the rules are so slanted towards offenses that good defenses are going to yield some points sometimes.

I would have given the award to Wilson last week too. That said, RGIII could barely run on his hurt knee and made some really great plays on the road. Wilson had a near flawless game, but because they killed the niners there was no drama either which in a stupid sort of way, probably hurt him. It was pretty much over at 21 - 0 with that blocked FG being returned. Still, that was a huge division game on a national stage, and the voters missed in my opinion.

However, when it comes to RoTY, RGIII has better numbers and in my opinion better intangibles. The numbers are really close, close enough to flip after Sunday, but I suspect if he has a good game, in a rivalry game to win the division no less, it's in the bag and it's deserved.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:09 pm

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Re: All about sports

Postby Shoju » Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:27 am

Klaudandus wrote:Fuck RGIII and his ROTY... Luck and Wilson are more deserving


According to the numbers I ran, RGIII is the most deserving based on performance.

Best Yards per Snap (6.95 after last week. No other rookie is over 6.8)
Best Snaps per INT (His ratio is up higher than some of the most "Elite" Qb's in the league.)
Second in NPPS (The only category that Russell Wilson beats him in)
Best Snaps per TD ratio of the Rookies

But really, if we are going to be talking about rookies, there are really two rookies that will need to be included in the discussion, one of them is on the same team as RGIII. Alfred Morris is having statistically one of the best Rookie Rushing Seasons in the history of the NFL. He's a dark horse, and he doesn't get as much press as any of the QB's, but make no mistake about it, RGIII wouldn't look as amazing as he does without Morris.

You could argue that Luck's numbers look as "not good" at times as they do, because Indianapolis doesn't have a good runnning game, while RW and RGIII are both sitting with great RB's in the backfield.
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Re: All about sports

Postby Klaudandus » Sun Dec 30, 2012 10:10 am

Do you guys think that if RGIII comes short against the LOLboys, they will hand the ROTY award to either Luck or Wilson?

The whole thing would smell of East Coast Bias, specially considering that Wilson and Luck would be the ones going to the playoffs
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Re: All about sports

Postby Fridmarr » Sun Dec 30, 2012 11:30 am

Shoju wrote:
Klaudandus wrote:Fuck RGIII and his ROTY... Luck and Wilson are more deserving


According to the numbers I ran, RGIII is the most deserving based on performance.

Best Yards per Snap (6.95 after last week. No other rookie is over 6.8)
Best Snaps per INT (His ratio is up higher than some of the most "Elite" Qb's in the league.)
Second in NPPS (The only category that Russell Wilson beats him in)
Best Snaps per TD ratio of the Rookies

But really, if we are going to be talking about rookies, there are really two rookies that will need to be included in the discussion, one of them is on the same team as RGIII. Alfred Morris is having statistically one of the best Rookie Rushing Seasons in the history of the NFL. He's a dark horse, and he doesn't get as much press as any of the QB's, but make no mistake about it, RGIII wouldn't look as amazing as he does without Morris.

You could argue that Luck's numbers look as "not good" at times as they do, because Indianapolis doesn't have a good runnning game, while RW and RGIII are both sitting with great RB's in the backfield.
Especially in the case of RGIII, I disagree. It's not Morris that makes RIII look good, it's RGIII that makes Morris look good. Defenses are keying off of RGIII in both pass and run formations, which is pretty unique.

Wilson has that working to a degree now too. Seattle, with a healthy Oline had a decent running game, and earlier in the year that took some pressure off of Wilson, but now defenses are not playing nearly as much run first against Seattle, because Wilson is making them pay. The biggest advantage Wilson has is a really good defense. At this point, he's helping the run as much (and probably more) as the run is helping him.

Klaudandus wrote:Do you guys think that if RGIII comes short against the LOLboys, they will hand the ROTY award to either Luck or Wilson?

The whole thing would smell of East Coast Bias, specially considering that Wilson and Luck would be the ones going to the playoffs
If he stinks it up, maybe. However, he can have an incredible game and they can still lose. The Skins not making the playoffs isn't really that big of a deal for me for RoTY. He'd could easily still deserve the award if they don't.

If they hand it to Luck over Wilson on the other hand...that's a problem.
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