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Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:07 pm
by Flex
bldavis wrote:the ally side shows nothing but horde being evil and holding the kiddies captive and them befriending the jin-yu
the horde side shows the ally enslaving pandas to build a fortress, and you making the hozen afraid of you, and turning them into allies


The wowhead comments on the horde quest cast doubt that they were forcefully being held captive, no restraints being the big one.

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:16 pm
by bldavis
Flex wrote:
bldavis wrote:the ally side shows nothing but horde being evil and holding the kiddies captive and them befriending the jin-yu
the horde side shows the ally enslaving pandas to build a fortress, and you making the hozen afraid of you, and turning them into allies


The wowhead comments on the horde quest cast doubt that they were forcefully being held captive, no restraints being the big one.

all they say when you release them is i am so thirsty, or i want to go home
so it is debatable
the ally side, there is no question they kids are being held under fel magic

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:21 pm
by Sagara
I'll check that out. Well, nothing I'd put beyond *those guys* >_<

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:33 pm
by benebarba
bldavis wrote:the ally side, there is no question they kids are being held under fel magic


Nah, the crazy floating eyes and fel-casters were just really shiny babysitters :P

And woah - we (the alliance) were building a fortress? Here I thought we just got our butts marooned by the Sky Admiral until we found and convinced the prince to go back home. The Jin'Yu I just found to be a 'hey, there be horde here, let's convince the natives to kill'em. Oh, and let's totally disregard the ominous warning delivered after one of our best SI-7 operatives got taken over by some wierd PO'd smoke creature that may have been made of pure evil.'.

Maybe it's me, but I think the fact that the Jade Dragon didn't just eat us after that whole battle thing showed she's probably a better person than my character can ever hope to be :P

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:51 pm
by KysenMurrin
They kinda justified the Horde-being-evil stuff by having their leader turn out to be totally corrupted by Sha. Guessing something similar will have happened with the Alliance leader.

(The Horde-is-evil stuff is kinda strange coming immediately after Sky Admiral Rogers does her big dick move on the unarmed, surrendering orc sailors.)

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:24 pm
by bldavis
KysenMurrin wrote:They kinda justified the Horde-being-evil stuff by having their leader turn out to be totally corrupted by Sha. Guessing something similar will have happened with the Alliance leader.

(The Horde-is-evil stuff is kinda strange coming immediately after Sky Admiral Rogers does her big dick move on the unarmed, surrendering orc sailors.)

oh it does, just earlier in the chain horde side

ally we get sent to take out the ships, land and take out war materials, see the SI:7 agent infested with sha, sent to the town, and then are sent to the horde camp to take out their leader

horde - sent in to take out the war materials, take out the leaders, see the sha infestation, and then sent to town
which fits with garrosh (and the orcs) being kill first and search the bodies where as the alliance is we will fight if needed to secure our place

yes, that way of thinking can lead to horrible acts (barrens?) but for the most part, the allaince dont want to wipe out the alliance


it is really just the 2 main leaders that are out for each other
horde - sylvanis and vol'jin want to kill garrosh, blaine already said fuck you to the horde and helped allaince, Lor'themar is trying to keep favor and not piss off sylvanis, so really it is just the goblins (who are in it for the profit) that are truly loyal to garrosh and might push war (war = profits)

alliance side - dwarves still havent solved who should be the sole leader of ironforge, gnomes are still dealing with gnomer and taking back the city, nelfs seem to be involved in 5.1 but also are still heavily involved with the firelands and healing of hyjal, draenei...are trying to find thier place in teh alliance and the world? which leave worgen, who want to take on the foresaken and not much else, and the humans...who just lost theramore and are itching for pay back

so really each side only has 2 of the 6 factions (not counting pandas) that might want to push for war

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 5:03 pm
by benebarba
KysenMurrin wrote:They kinda justified the Horde-being-evil stuff by having their leader turn out to be totally corrupted by Sha. Guessing something similar will have happened with the Alliance leader.

(The Horde-is-evil stuff is kinda strange coming immediately after Sky Admiral Rogers does her big dick move on the unarmed, surrendering orc sailors.)


Ah, that does ring a bell - I think because the horde bosses got taken down so fast I missed the transformation.

I have to say though, I thought that Sky Admiral Rogers act was 1) in character and 2) a potential lead-in to her being corrupted during that battle just as Rell was... but since she appears to live through the zone I'm not sure what to make of that.

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 5:44 pm
by Sabindeus
benebarba wrote:I have to say though, I thought that Sky Admiral Rogers act was 1) in character and 2) a potential lead-in to her being corrupted during that battle just as Rell was... but since she appears to live through the zone I'm not sure what to make of that.


She might get taken over by the Sha later on? I wouldn't be surprised.

Did you guys talk to her before setting out? I feel like her anger towards the Horde is entirely justified. Remember that at this point in the storyline not only did the Orcs drive humans out of Stormwind in the Second War, but then the Undead massacred Lordaeron in the Third War, and now the Forsaken destroyed Southshore with the plague, killing all its inhabitants, including Sky Admiral Rogers' family.

So yeah I'd say her unwillingness to accept surrenders from unarmed Horde soldiers makes sense in character.

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:04 pm
by Sagara
Further, Sha victims are apparently fairly easy to spot.
Yeah, I think it was all her. Not blaming her, though.

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 6:08 am
by benebarba
Sabindeus wrote:Did you guys talk to her before setting out? I feel like her anger towards the Horde is entirely justified. Remember that at this point in the storyline not only did the Orcs drive humans out of Stormwind in the Second War, but then the Undead massacred Lordaeron in the Third War, and now the Forsaken destroyed Southshore with the plague, killing all its inhabitants, including Sky Admiral Rogers' family.

So yeah I'd say her unwillingness to accept surrenders from unarmed Horde soldiers makes sense in character.


100% agreed - I did talk to her, and so when it happened and her entire bearing was not a surprise. I actually liked it: it gave us (Alliance players) an undeniable hardass war commander ("Put your big boy pants on, Taylor.")... something after Cataclysm (and Theramore/Southshore) was needed. And the fact that she made the call she did was awesome: it completely made sense in context of her character, though I'm not so sure about Rell's response... He is a night elf assasin (*cough*Ashenvale & Stonetalon *cough*), right? I guess perhaps he's got some sort of serious forgiving streak ala Malfurion?

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 7:45 am
by Passionario
Sabindeus wrote:Did you guys talk to her before setting out? I feel like her anger towards the Horde is entirely justified.


She's from Southshore. So, yes, it is.

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 8:21 am
by Sabindeus
benebarba wrote:
Sabindeus wrote:Did you guys talk to her before setting out? I feel like her anger towards the Horde is entirely justified. Remember that at this point in the storyline not only did the Orcs drive humans out of Stormwind in the Second War, but then the Undead massacred Lordaeron in the Third War, and now the Forsaken destroyed Southshore with the plague, killing all its inhabitants, including Sky Admiral Rogers' family.

So yeah I'd say her unwillingness to accept surrenders from unarmed Horde soldiers makes sense in character.


100% agreed - I did talk to her, and so when it happened and her entire bearing was not a surprise. I actually liked it: it gave us (Alliance players) an undeniable hardass war commander ("Put your big boy pants on, Taylor.")... something after Cataclysm (and Theramore/Southshore) was needed. And the fact that she made the call she did was awesome: it completely made sense in context of her character, though I'm not so sure about Rell's response... He is a night elf assasin (*cough*Ashenvale & Stonetalon *cough*), right? I guess perhaps he's got some sort of serious forgiving streak ala Malfurion?


absolutely, we needed a real hardass commander to be more proximal to the fighting than Varian himself. Taylor is great as a character but he's been through too much shit to be That Guy.

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 5:30 am
by benebarba
I guess a followon - was Rell developed much prior to that first series of quests? I don't have much of a read on the guy... but he seems a little different than I'd expect. Clearly he's the leader of the SI-7 unit we deploy with in Pandaria, but compared to the others (forget their names at the moment - the human sharpshooter and the dwarf) he seems almost downright pacifist or at least far more interested in recovering Anduin and keeping his people safe than in fighting the horde. That, I think strangely, seems to be Taylor's bag - maybe I'm misremembering but it seemed like fighting the horde took on more for him than recovering Anduin.

On the one hand, I guess it makes sense: Taylor is a veteran commander of groups of soldiers marooned on a foreign land without support, not an experienced special operative sent with a single purpose. But on the other, he dropped the ball and I would think would be interested in doing whatever he could to secure Anduin.

But perhaps it's the seemingly toss-away story of the Pearlfin Jinyu that makes it seem that way to me? After we royally screw up and in no uncertain terms get told to GTFO of the Jade Forest until we redeem ourselves, they seem to have lost all story presence or were completely wiped out(we certainly didn't try to save any after the battle, if any survived at all).

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:37 am
by Sabindeus
benebarba wrote:I guess a followon - was Rell developed much prior to that first series of quests? I don't have much of a read on the guy... but he seems a little different than I'd expect. Clearly he's the leader of the SI-7 unit we deploy with in Pandaria, but compared to the others (forget their names at the moment - the human sharpshooter and the dwarf) he seems almost downright pacifist or at least far more interested in recovering Anduin and keeping his people safe than in fighting the horde. That, I think strangely, seems to be Taylor's bag - maybe I'm misremembering but it seemed like fighting the horde took on more for him than recovering Anduin.

On the one hand, I guess it makes sense: Taylor is a veteran commander of groups of soldiers marooned on a foreign land without support, not an experienced special operative sent with a single purpose. But on the other, he dropped the ball and I would think would be interested in doing whatever he could to secure Anduin.

But perhaps it's the seemingly toss-away story of the Pearlfin Jinyu that makes it seem that way to me? After we royally screw up and in no uncertain terms get told to GTFO of the Jade Forest until we redeem ourselves, they seem to have lost all story presence or were completely wiped out(we certainly didn't try to save any after the battle, if any survived at all).


I think the SI-7 unit in general is more concerned with recovering Anduin simply because they were tasked by Varian directly with that mission. Remember that SI-7 is special ops whereas they were travelling with straight military. So Admirals Rogers and Taylor are more focused on the overall military campaign whereas the SI-7 guys have a specific job to do.

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2015 5:58 am
by Njall
halabar wrote:
Digren wrote:
Dantriges wrote:Don´t ask about the worgen sex scenes. Let´s say this much. There was some confusion about what models to use.

Certain episodes of Being Human (UK) have covered this sufficiently.


Hmm.. with where this is going.. where's Njall when we need him...



Practicing necromancy, why do you ask?

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2015 9:48 am
by Njall
Speaking of Worgen and so forth, there is always the chemistry between my chief builder and my military commander... Dude. Get on your man pants and ask her out!

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2015 11:52 am
by Sabindeus
Njall wrote:Speaking of Worgen and so forth, there is always the chemistry between my chief builder and my military commander... Dude. Get on your man pants and ask her out!


*opens mouth to say something, closes it again*

... finish the garrison questline and then come back here...

Re: Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2015 12:01 pm
by Njall
Sabindeus wrote:
Njall wrote:Speaking of Worgen and so forth, there is always the chemistry between my chief builder and my military commander... Dude. Get on your man pants and ask her out!


*opens mouth to say something, closes it again*

... finish the garrison questline and then come back here...


*snicker*