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Paladin Tier 12

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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby tlitp » Fri May 06, 2011 4:52 am

The proposed Prot 2pt12 seems a bit underwhelming, compared to its Ret counterpart. Considering the most reasonable implementations for each, Prot's relative strength is 60-65% of Ret's at 0% Inq uptime, increasing to 80-85% at 100% Inq uptime.

Clarification : Prot build, Prot gear (ilvl ~378, including the weapon), simply juggling the two effects.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Crimsonheart » Fri May 06, 2011 5:17 am

well I personally think the ret one should be over 3seconds not 4...but thats me. If any of you play ret you know that your rough CS cd is probably around 4 seconds, 3 with BL. So during BL the ret "bonus" (as well as the others that have a dot, especially the dualwielders) is only 75percent strength. I guess they could implement (like some shields currently are) where it gets added to, but I doubt they would.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby RedAces » Fri May 06, 2011 5:21 am

hey,

they could implement it like the rolling dots (like Ignite or Deep Wounds).

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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Meloree » Fri May 06, 2011 5:37 am

RedAces wrote:they could implement it like the rolling dots (like Ignite or Deep Wounds).


2t12 prot + 2t12 ret for chasing big numbers could be fun, too.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Shoju » Fri May 06, 2011 10:13 am

After thoroughly examining Paladin and Death Knight T12 sets, I am happy to report that I'm very pleased with my main change, and look forward to wearing my DK T12 as opposed to the Paladin T12.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Archeth » Fri May 06, 2011 11:16 am

Shoju wrote:After thoroughly examining Paladin and Death Knight T12 sets, I am happy to report that I'm very pleased with my main change, and look forward to wearing my DK T12 as opposed to the Paladin T12.

:lol:
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby PsiVen » Fri May 06, 2011 5:43 pm

Meloree wrote:
RedAces wrote:they could implement it like the rolling dots (like Ignite or Deep Wounds).


2t12 prot + 2t12 ret for chasing big numbers could be fun, too.


Depending on the stats, this might be a pretty solid everyday setup. I'm not that impressed with the 4pc Prot bonus, and with only 7 bosses we might not get a single one with a sensible use for a short avoidance cooldown.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Meloree » Fri May 06, 2011 7:03 pm

PsiVen wrote:
Meloree wrote:
2t12 prot + 2t12 ret for chasing big numbers could be fun, too.


Depending on the stats, this might be a pretty solid everyday setup. I'm not that impressed with the 4pc Prot bonus, and with only 7 bosses we might not get a single one with a sensible use for a short avoidance cooldown.


A short block-capping cooldown? I actually like the bonus :P

I tend to be a stamina stacker, and I'm still over 90% on CTC, so that bonus is full coverage on demand.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Arincia » Fri May 06, 2011 8:43 pm

Well my intuition is to say the bonus actually becomes better as you get closer to block cap (even if your at it). This further reduce any physical damage taken in that period a lot.

(rough estimate going from 30% avoidance to 42% with 5 swings while active is going from 1.5 misses average to 2.1 on average that said there probably isn't any statistical difference between the two).

For dk it could really do some huge avoidance steaks. Going from 35% to 70% (20+%15% from set bonus). Certainly nothing to sneeze at for them.

Either way got a better look at the tier set and it's not looking as bad imo. I'm just confused as to all the diffrent coloring scemes so far (3 for everyone but hunter with 4). Wondering if blizz is just playing with colors or 1 per spec or more like toc/icc with 3 levels of tier to get.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby PsiVen » Fri May 06, 2011 11:05 pm

Well, clearly the ideal case is to have exactly 90.4% avoidance+block before popping it. Any more than that and you're wasting block, and any less and you'll be undershooting considerably. That might be a reasonable assumption in full T12-T12H gear, if there is indeed an avoidance penalty in Firelands (which we haven't heard about since Blizzcon), but then we would be generally short of the block cap until then. If there is not a penalty, we will rapidly outstrip this avoidance level and probably everyone will be wanting to passively block cap.

Given that, it still must be better than using a 20% DR or 40% magic DR cooldown alone elsewhere. Quite situational if Firelands is anything like this tier. But I'm sure tanking with a DPS set bonus is situational too; you'd want both options available.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Fetzie » Sat May 07, 2011 5:24 am

I still think the paladin set looks like a monster from Doctor Who >.>
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby tinalt » Sat May 07, 2011 6:55 am

with the 3d model from wowhead, it looks absolutely horrible on a tauren. I'm honestly considering race changing back to a belf for this tier of raiding just so i don't have to look like that.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Chicken » Sat May 07, 2011 7:08 am

mclem wrote:I was thinking when I first saw the 4pc that I didn't like it because it effectively acts against the damage reduction, but thinking further I'm guessing that this could have a nice synergy with the Glyph of Divine Protection. Combining the two lets the same spell act as both a *big* magic damage reduction cooldown and a pretty big avoidance boost cooldown.
That's a flawed line of thinking. The point of Divine Protection is to reduce your damage intake, and avoidance also reduces your damage intake. Getting an extra 12% parry on top of the 20% damage reduction is simply better, there is no part of it that acts against any other part.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Karnadas » Sat May 07, 2011 1:13 pm

I feel like the only one who actually likes pretty much all of the t12 sets, ESPECIALLY the paladin one. I love it.
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Re: Paladin Tier 12

Postby Arincia » Sat May 07, 2011 7:08 pm

Actually the set bonus should become stronger from 90.4% until one reaches the block cap of 102.4%. At block cap you just shoved that 12% block off in favor of undiminished parry.
Go form say 30% avoidance 72.4% block to 42% avoidance 62.4% block decreases average damage intake from 41.7% to 34.8% without DP -20% damage taken effect. So without up you take almost 20% more damage during that 12 seconds.

This set bonus makes DP stronger not weaker. So we take less hits with it up to take even less damage. That was the main reason we hit used it in the first place to reduce damage. This bonus just enhances the damage reduction effect of it.
If it block caps even temporary its reduced the worst case physical damage from 80% taken to 47.2% (taking hits to the face with dp up while block capped with block meta).

Even for magic damage situations it would be great. Great example think of nef adds in phase 3. Crackle goes off with high stacks on adds. Reduce the crackle damage and the melee spikiness for yourself.

Anyways I just think the set bonus just compliments DP's job of reducing damage but it is in a slightly rng fashion but that shouldn't detract from it though.

On a different note after relooking at the set for BE I'm looking very forward to getting this set (may just go for the full set since i think it looks really nice)
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