You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

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You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Sànguinius » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:07 am

Is there an in between?

I find myself not wanting to do casual guild because I prefer enjoying the game and doing all it has to offer. (Besides I take the time and effort to learn my class and gear up why not raid?) at the same time though I don't want to see a big prideful guild to take hold. Where each person is considered a number rather than a person.

Have any of you seen a semi-hardcore guild? Or not follow the tenets and stereotypes of "Hardcore"?

Edited in: Where the hell is the line anyways!?
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby halabar » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:21 am

double post ftl
Last edited by halabar on Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby halabar » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:21 am

There isn't a clear line. The type of guild you are looking for exists, but usually doesn't last, unless it's dominated by RL friends and and aquaintances.

Why? It's inheritly not stable. It's usually a smaller guild of skilled and semi-skilled-but-motivated players, and it's very easy for the addition of a few new players, or a few existing members to have time issues, to cause the guild to go off in another direction. A semi-hardcore guild will usually attract more members, and there often isn't the leadership to control that larger community.

Simply adding one more tank can throw it off. A few guilds ago I had a good group that had a good 6-month run. Then we added one new guy who threw it all to hell, as he wanted to tank to, and the balance we had was gone.

So yeah, it exists, but if you join one, don't expect it to last. Best chance is to find one that just lost a tank but otherwise has the balance needed.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Nikachelle » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:28 am

Define quasi and semi hardcore please. It means a different thing to each person.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Flex » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:28 am

semi-hardcore can exist in 10 man environments provided you keep the raiding team small and limited to about 12 characters, just enough subs that if someone misses a day you don't have to cancel it. It is when you get to the point that you have 15+ signups for a 10 man raid but no desire to branch out to 25 man raiding that things become bad. Our guild has been running with the same core group through 2 expansions now with just a very minor rotation as players take breaks.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Goodheart » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:42 am

I'm in just such a guild for a while now, and it's been around since the start of the realm nearly 5 years ago. Gotta admit though, the guild nearly died before every expansion so far. And always it was because a subgroup wanted more from our raiding, since the leading style is very mellow, resulting in slower progress.
And always they split of, but we move on, sticking to our principles.
In contrary to what Flex experienced, it really helped for us to have a considerate size. We also got 3 guild leaders who have been with the guild for years now, and another retired one that I recently replaced, and it is so much easier to properly lead the guild this way without getting to easily influenced.
So yeah, never gonna leave this gem, that's for sure. And we might not get there as fast as others, but we do get it done. In wrath we even made it to 11/12 hc (in the final month though :P).

About what hardcore really is, I guess it's the same as asking someone what fun is, you never get the same answer. I guess it's more dependent on the style of raid leading then the actual guild. Stick vs Carrot and all that.
I expect in our raids to have to explain and guide a lot, while that probably is not the case in the more hardcore guilds. Not that I mind, I love guiding people to a hard worked for boss kill :)
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Reckoni » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:03 am

Goodheart wrote:I'm in just such a guild for a while now, and it's been around since the start of the realm nearly 5 years ago. Gotta admit though, the guild nearly died before every expansion so far. And always it was because a subgroup wanted more from our raiding, since the leading style is very mellow, resulting in slower progress.
And always they split of, but we move on, sticking to our principles.
In contrary to what Flex experienced, it really helped for us to have a considerate size. We also got 3 guild leaders who have been with the guild for years now, and another retired one that I recently replaced, and it is so much easier to properly lead the guild this way without getting to easily influenced.
So yeah, never gonna leave this gem, that's for sure. And we might not get there as fast as others, but we do get it done. In wrath we even made it to 11/12 hc (in the final month though :P).

About what hardcore really is, I guess it's the same as asking someone what fun is, you never get the same answer. I guess it's more dependent on the style of raid leading then the actual guild. Stick vs Carrot and all that.
I expect in our raids to have to explain and guide a lot, while that probably is not the case in the more hardcore guilds. Not that I mind, I love guiding people to a hard worked for boss kill :)


I wouldn't really consider that a semi hardcore guild then, it just sounds fairly casual, and dont get me wrong, theres nothing wrong with that, but It sounds like the OP had a different idea of semi hardcore
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Nikachelle » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:07 am

And that's exactly why I asked what "semi-hardcore" means to the OP. Because killing 11/12 hc ICC 10 in the last month of Wrath (with a 30% buff and the removal of ICC radiance) is so very far from semi-hardcore.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Barathorn » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:09 am

It is almost impossible to define a broad stereotype that everyone has a different ideal about.

I have to agree with Nika /faints.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Goodheart » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:10 am

I suppose it depends on your current guild how you view it, casual is those that do less then you and hardcore those that do more :P
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Barathorn » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:14 am

Goodheart wrote:I suppose it depends on your current guild how you view it, casual is those that do less then you and hardcore those that do more :P


I don't necessarily agree because there were a lot of guilds nowhere near as active in doing things as my old guild was in WotLK but they were considerably further advanced than us from a raiding perspective.

Like I said, the definition of hardcore means so many different things to so many different people that it becomes impossible to quantify.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Reckoni » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:22 am

Goodheart wrote:I suppose it depends on your current guild how you view it, casual is those that do less then you and hardcore those that do more :P

I disagree with that, One of my previous guilds defined themselves as casually hardcore, which didnt make sense but gave them an excuse to slack off.
Hardcore, while not having a direct definition, doesnt mean its people who do more. Hardcore is a mentality among the players in the guild. If you have to explain the encounters to everyone, then likely they are not hardcore players for the fact that they hadnt taken the time to prepare in advance on their own time. My own personal definition of semi hardcore, would be a group of friends, who actually do take all the needed preparations and put forth 110% effort into raiding, however, due to work or personal lives, cant always have a 5 night raid week, and dont make progression on the bleeding edge (Maybe like finishing heroic icc a month or 2 behind the actual hardcore guilds)It kinda goes with the OPs post aswell because my definition of a fulltime hardcore guild works more like a machine, cant show up? you will be replaced with the next in line, and so on
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby culhag » Tue Jan 18, 2011 11:04 am

There's (at least) two parameters to hardcore-ness. Time commitment and strictness of the raid's rules.

Semi-hardcore could be raiding 2 nights a week and being very serious about it, or you could have 5 raids a week with relaxed rules.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby snoweagle » Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:11 pm

I think outside wow the opposite of casual is more formality than extremity, which in a lot of situations if pretty far from the word 'fun' in people's minds...

so the more formal requirements a guild has, the less 'casual' they can be perceived to be, though, depending on how much raid performance the formality can enable, this can actually lead to 'fun' on a different level due to the enjoyment of the focused atmosphere, and the fact that despite the formality people aren't robots so will have as much fun as the environment allows for anyway.

the problem is that in the real world 'casualness' and extremity aren't by any means mutually exclusive (see: metal music, sex, hard played 5-a-side)

so the same applies to wow, there can be plenty of one, the other, or both in a guild atmosphere. Whether they use one as an excuse to ignore the benefits of the other on the other is down to the people in the guild.
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Re: You're quasi-hardcore, you are semi-hardcore...

Postby Vort » Tue Jan 18, 2011 1:55 pm

My Guild right now is what I would classify as "Semi-Hardcore". We raid 3-4 Nights a week (between 3-4 hours per raid or more if bosses are close to dead and people are keen), people often take brakes but since we have roughly 13 active raid members we are able to fill spots. We have a Resto Druid who has Boomkin as offspec, and a Priest who plays Shadow/Holy/Disc depending on what we need him to do. Our MT even specs Arms for Al'akir and watches the Debuff while I tank adds and the Big Bad. I step out for Magmaw since our MT needs the trinket, and he steps out for Valiona/Theralion since he's got the Engi helm, and now that I've got a good combo leggings from Al'akir I step out for Atramedes. Our MT had to go on 1 week absence for family commitments and we had our Frost DK step up for the week as Blood. We've got enough people right now to comfortably fill spots if people are away, but not too many that it causes angst among the members if they have to sit a fight or two. We've run into problems but since most of us have been raiding together for years we can usually work it out and without causing drama.
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