From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

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From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby Shoju » Wed Dec 01, 2010 8:39 am

This had me thinking about how it would work to have a "player" as a raid boss for level60's, and it had me wanting to mock up a Paladin as a Raid boss. Some liberties would need to be taken with spell effects to make it work as a real boss.

Our tanks.
Using the best gear available at level60, and all buffs/flasks available, I was able to pump our tank up to
13,212 HP
7890 Armor
21.12% Dodge
11.4% Parry
5% Block

The Boss
The Damage on the abilities is the non crit value of a paladin tank parse from in guild recently.

Attacks
  • Hammer of the Righteous - Generates 1 Holy Power, Hits Everything in Frontal Cone ~1600
  • Shield of the Righteous - Expends 3 Holy Power Hits on Average (non Crit) - 12316
    this would be close to a tank killer if used in conjunction with just a simple Melee Attack... This might need a Cast Bar so that it could be interrupted, or used on a long enough Cooldown that it can be CD'd through.
  • Holy Wrath - Saber Lash Style Damage. Single Target 3500, can be split down as low as 650 damage with enough in range.
  • Avenger's Shield - Chains to all Targets in frontal Cone, ~7500 Damage per.
  • Judgement - Debuffs Current target, ~4600 Damage
  • Consecration - The raid wide, move the boss, don't stand in the fire. Ticks for 500 per (no AoE cap on this bad boy)
  • Censure - Fully Stacked, ticks for 1700 Damage per tick. This along with other abilities will be the tank transition mechanic. There is no way that a tank would live with 10% of their health ticking away on top of the other abilities being able to hit him. It would be similar to Gormokk the Impaler, but with more scary Specials.
  • Melee Swing - From the WoL I have, the average swing from the Gutbuster was 2.21 seconds, and hit for 1300 damage. This isn't factoring in the Seal % of weapon damage either.

At 20%, the boss switches to Seal of Insight, and each attack on the tank heals him for a % of his health. (similar to Anub)

We will also say that when the boss hits 5% health he starts to cast Lay on Hands, it is uninteruptable, and is the "enrage timer". At 5% he ceases to do anything else. If he gets off the Lay On hands before you get him dead, well.... you go back to square 1.


Now, I'm not sure if this is over the top or too weak because I didn't raid at 60, and I'm throwing around numbers that I'm getting from current Wowhead gear, which has been changed since 4.0.3.

I have the numbers for Crusader strike as well, but at 3600 damage on average, I thought that it would be a little excessive. in the damage department.

I would love some input on making a "real" paladin boss using just the abilities that they have. I always thought it would be really cool if Blizzard did a raid where you were fighting 1 of each class, using the abilities that the class had taken to a "boss" level. (and no faction champs doesn't count. I mean "Real Boss")
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby Njall » Wed Dec 01, 2010 8:46 am

You're welcome.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby sherck » Wed Dec 01, 2010 10:45 am

Hmmmm...I think rather...

Boss is an armored juggernauth of plate wearing, holy healing incredisauce. Wearing 5-piece Tier-17 gear. Has no melee attack abilities and has only 2 ranged attacks (Judgement which grants a haste buff and Holy Shock) but casts healing spells that heal his team of "adds" that do all the damage for the fight. Is always standing in the back behind his team waving his hands in the air.

The basic concept is that as long as the boss is alive, his adds will stay alive and continue to do damage to the raid and will outlast the raid's healers. The goal of the encounter is to either kill the boss (and then the adds will die eventually) or to drain the mana of the boss which will eventually accomplish the same thing.

Adds do enough damage that they need to be tanked and CCed or else they will destroy the raid. You cannot just concentrate on the boss or the adds kill you. You cannot just concentrate on the adds or else the boss will just keep healing and reset the encounter (while your healers keep expending mana). You need to balance things out with lots of changing assignments and need to adjust to things "on the fly" Sort of like Faction Champions but better done, hopefully.

Notable abilities:

Holy Light, Holy Shock, Word of Glory
Divine Shield, Lay on Hands, Divine Intervention
Hand of Freedom, Hand of Protection, Hand of Sacrifice
Auras
Judgement also "focuses" on a target that then all the "adds" DPS attack for 12 seconds. Will need healer and self CDs to survive the onslaught. Once every minute.

Adds:

Tank: Armored, lots of health but lowish DPS output. Ability to "taunt" in order to fixate toons; for 15 sec, they can use abilities against the tank but cannot target anyone else enemy or friendly even though a raid frame addon.

Ranged DPS - Physical based. Hunter type. Has pet, has stings, hard to melee, will disengage, traps. Fun.

Ranged DPS - Magic based. Mage type. Frost mage for control and CC.

Melee DPS - Rogue based. Think 2nd boss in Kara; lots of fun with control and CC to be had.

I think that could be made into an interesting Paladin fight.

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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby Worldie » Wed Dec 01, 2010 10:54 am

What if the boss casts Divine Intervention on someone, you automatically get loots? :P
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby sherck » Wed Dec 01, 2010 10:56 am

Worldie wrote:What if the boss casts Divine Intervention on someone, you automatically get loots? :P


Lol, yeah.

I meant Divine Plea. Really, I did. :lol:

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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby theckhd » Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:25 am

Shoju wrote:I have the numbers for Crusader strike as well, but at 3600 damage on average, I thought that it would be a little excessive. in the damage department.


I don't think that would be excessive, it just wouldn't be able to be used every 3 seconds. You'd want to un-link it from HotR for this though.

The boss could either be a crazy tank damage fight with several timers to be watching (up to one for each ability), or something with fairly predictable spikes (ShoR) and a semi-random component. For example:

HotR cast every 15 seconds. ShoR cast once he reaches 3 Holy Power, 3-second cast. Time between ShoRs is 45 seconds (alternate one each tank to manage cooldowns).

Every 15 seconds, he casts an ability from {Crusader Strike, Consecration, Judgement, Avenger's Shield, Holy Wrath}. This is offset from HotR by 7.5 seconds.

2-second melee swing except during ShoR.

Lay on Hands as you described.

The only issue with this boss is that it'd be pretty boring for ranged DPS, who can basically ignore all of the Boss's abilities. It might be better for AS to randomly target any player in the raid (and still chain to 3 targets), and Holy Wrath be randomly targettable as well. That way there's a definite trade-off between grouping up and spreading out. Throw in some environmental damage (Hodir-like falling objects, for example) to keep the ranged moving.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby crazyharry » Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:28 am

Being a paladin boss it would naturally have an awesome tanking shield THAT WOULD NEVER DROP for you but you see people's shaman bank alt with it in Org.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby Flex » Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:29 am

theckhd wrote:The only issue with this boss is that it'd be pretty boring for ranged DPS, who can basically ignore all of the Boss's abilities. It might be better for AS to randomly target any player in the raid (and still chain to 3 targets), and Holy Wrath be randomly targettable as well. That way there's a definite trade-off between grouping up and spreading out. Throw in some environmental damage (Hodir-like falling objects, for example) to keep the ranged moving.


Ranged targeted Consecration like that Scarlet Crusade chick in Dragonblight.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby theckhd » Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:32 am

Flex wrote:Ranged targeted Consecration like that Scarlet Crusade chick in Dragonblight.

I was thinking about that, but Cons seemed too iconic to do that to. That said, mechanically I think it makes more sense to make Cons the ranged ability and keep Holy Wrath as the melee-range ability.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby Shathus » Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:40 am

What about making Holy Wrath include a feature like the Eadric's blinding ability where all (but the tank) have to turn around else they get stunned (basically make it blinding shield that we never got). That would at least give the ranged/healers something to look out for. AS should definitely be targetable a la chain lightning from Jaraxxus (bonus points if it silences).

At 1 hit point the boss should bubble-hearth leaving behind a chest filled with loot.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby bldavis » Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:50 am

crazyharry wrote:Being a paladin boss it would naturally have an awesome tanking shield THAT WOULD NEVER DROP for you but you see people's shaman bank alt with it in Org.

not to mention a healing mace and a massive 2hd weapon :twisted:

you could make cons like the D&D on LDW
stay out of the glowing circles
and as far as abilites, you could treat them like the Twins in TotC, the boss has a list of abilities that they will cast randomly, and after so many or after each has been cast the list resets and its random again
or you could tie them to seperate phases?

overall i would love to see this
Last edited by bldavis on Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby KysenMurrin » Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:52 am

The raid tier's only relic upgrade - with "Class: Shaman". :twisted:
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby Shoju » Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:02 pm

theckhd wrote:
Shoju wrote:I have the numbers for Crusader strike as well, but at 3600 damage on average, I thought that it would be a little excessive. in the damage department.


I don't think that would be excessive, it just wouldn't be able to be used every 3 seconds. You'd want to un-link it from HotR for this though.

The boss could either be a crazy tank damage fight with several timers to be watching (up to one for each ability), or something with fairly predictable spikes (ShoR) and a semi-random component. For example:

HotR cast every 15 seconds. ShoR cast once he reaches 3 Holy Power, 3-second cast. Time between ShoRs is 45 seconds (alternate one each tank to manage cooldowns).

Every 15 seconds, he casts an ability from {Crusader Strike, Consecration, Judgement, Avenger's Shield, Holy Wrath}. This is offset from HotR by 7.5 seconds.

2-second melee swing except during ShoR.

Lay on Hands as you described.

The only issue with this boss is that it'd be pretty boring for ranged DPS, who can basically ignore all of the Boss's abilities. It might be better for AS to randomly target any player in the raid (and still chain to 3 targets), and Holy Wrath be randomly targettable as well. That way there's a definite trade-off between grouping up and spreading out. Throw in some environmental damage (Hodir-like falling objects, for example) to keep the ranged moving.



I like these changes.

AS can target whoever, and chain. Holy Wrath is for melee, Consecration is "droppable" where ever. While that might seem a little off from the standard ability it does make a more engaging encounter, give it a longer longer duration so that movement is key. Similar to Putricide, but not permanent, just long enough to keep you moving. Maybe 1 min duration, cast every 30 seconds, so that you always have 2 rather large Consecrate zones down that you need to stay out of, forcing the spread for ranged / clump of melee to be more integral.

To add in some environmental damage, it could be against some Scarlet Crusade whackjob. He is holed up in his chapel, and (similar to the blood knight charger line) you are there to raze the chapel, and defeat the last of the Scarlet Crusade. With the Chapel blazing, it is falling down around you. and falling flaming debris can be fun right?

As far as what type of fight it would be, I love fights that have periods of heavy raid damage and heavy tank damage.
As weird as it sounds, one of my favorite fights in ICC is Festergut Heroic.

You have two damage components that are on sliders.
When tank damage is "Low" raid damage is high
When tank damage is "high" raid damage is low.

All the while you need to watch out for Goo, and you need to watch where to move to for the spores. Failing at spores (pre-buff) was death. You have a tank transition (which i like) as well. The fight is a little snoozy for tanks, but overall I like the concept.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby halabar » Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:59 pm

Transition phase where the paladin boss kneels in prayer, and you have to fight the charger.

And don't forget the acolyte adds.
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Re: From the "Favorite Shattering Change" thread, You as a boss

Postby Malthrax » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:45 pm

Use Sir Zeliek's implementation of Holy Wrath :)
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