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[ulushnar]

- They say they removed armor pen also? didn't check.

Yep. It will be replaced by crit (if the ArP piece didn't currently have crit) or haste (if the arp piece had crit). That seems to be how they're prioritising it based on checking my DK's gear on Beta.

[Thornir]

- They say they removed armor pen also? didn't check.

All ArP is gone. Gems have been changed to Crit, gearwise either haste or crit. Warriors are QQing (Then again, everyone is QQing; "My class is so UP! No, MY class is so UP!").

[Chicken]

i finally played on the PTR a bit. Copied my toon over. My tank is in full 277 gear, much of which is BiS. I went into REGULAR Violet Hold solo and by the time I was done killing the first trash pack I was down to 1/3 health. There's something fishy going on with the mob levels in there and how much damage they do. Someone in trade mentioned that the mobs are acting like level 85 or something.

Does anyone know what's going on?

I did a lot less damage that I expect but I'm sure at least half of that is me not knowing the rotation well. My armor was about 4 to 6k less than live, but that doesn't explain it completely. On live I can solo that place without taking any damage from trash (except casters). Given how much damage I took, and how little damage I put out, I tend to think that maybe the level 80 mobs were in fact acting as higher level mobs.

A buddy of mine went into ICC 10 regular on his Druid healer and he said the saberlash was hitting each of the two tanks for 35k. The went splat in a matter of seconds after the pull.

Mobs have been buffed in all instances, or so I've heard.

They did buff all mobs from level 65 and up on the beta, so chances are that's affecting the PTR as well. I've heard in particular that mobs that rely heavily on magic damage were a bit overbuffed though, which is something that'd definitely show up in VH.

[Goins2754]

This is my experience on the PTR, for what it's worth:

I made a new warrior because I was so excited about the heal they got. Secretly, I'm a warrior-lover but I'm too addicted to the paladin's self-healing to level one. I leveled him to 15 in one night. It was so amazing to faceroll things & heal myself as a warrior. At level 10, I was grinding the troggs near Thelsamar. They are the ones that are on a ridiculously fast respawn timer & they've been my bane in the past. They spawn the very second you kill the last one. Sometimes so fast that your Thunderclap can actually kill the last one & somehow hit the respawn!

Anyhow, I literally stood in the camp from level 10-15 and hardly ever did they almost kill me. Shield slam hits like a train pulling trucks! I was critting for around 210 in crap vendor gear at level 10-11ish. I had a few amazing crits of approx 300ish at level 15.

At 15, I went to RFC only to find that aggro is nigh impossible! This makes me a sad panda. I imagine it's a combination of lowbie overpowering (huntards are ridiculous) and the new non-AOE tanking philosophy. I run in and shield slam then TC. That's really all I have. By then, DPS had pulled almost everything off me. My taunts are on constant cooldown.

On the other hand, lowbie dungeons are a JOKE. I mean, a serious joke. There was one RFC where we got 3 heirloom DPS & a noob-geared healer / tank (me). We almost ran through the dungeon non-stop. If anything, we only stopped moving so the healer could pop off a heal once or twice. Full run lasted maybe 3-5 min.

By then, my 24 paladin had transferred and I ran Deadmines. AoE tanking is much easier on the paladin as I had Consecrate by this time. If all I had was CS & AS, sheesh! I can't imagine that nightmare - especially in DM where there are packs of like 10 non-elite mobs. The paladin heals aren't as big as I remember & I honestly feel like my prot warrior's healing is better. +20% heal every time I kill someone seems better than WoG after 3 CS.

All in all, the new changes are amazing! I love finally having the "special attack" animation on my paladin when I use CS. I love the warrior self-healing. I love the OP feeling at level 10 and I really think that'll go a long way to making people stay with their class. I leveled my warrior to 15 before I died. It was epic!

Overall review of lowbie PTR: 4.5 stars out of 5.

[Flex]

Does anyone know what's going on?

Also you are no longer full blocking anything which may be a factor.

[ulushnar]

Does anyone know what's going on?

Also you are no longer full blocking anything which may be a factor.

And Parry's no longer 100% mitigation.

[Flex]

Does anyone know what's going on?

Also you are no longer full blocking anything which may be a factor.

And Parry's no longer 100% mitigation.

They reverted that change.

[djlar]

What about defense? they removed it yet?

[ulushnar]

Also you are no longer full blocking anything which may be a factor.

And Parry's no longer 100% mitigation.

They reverted that change.

They did? When? I haven't been tanking much in Beta to notice it, but that's a shame. They finally did something interesting with it rather than making it Dodge's poor cousin.

[ulushnar]

What about defense? they removed it yet?

Yes, it'll get switched to Dodge and/or Parry rating. But before you start drooling, without Anticipation and Deflection, you'll probably still take an overall Avoidance hit.

Curiously though, the DK tanking Runeforges still give Defense when last I checked.

[Chicken]

They did? When? I haven't been tanking much in Beta to notice it, but that's a shame. They finally did something interesting with it rather than making it Dodge's poor cousin.

They did change it so parry rating gives parry at the same rate that dodge rating gives dodge at least, so they're basically equal now.

[djlar]

So 4.0 is out before cata.. I wonder how all the changes will turned out, like raiding ICC with no defense and tons of dodge, will it offset the 20% debuff?

Seems like Max HP took a hit.. no problem for i277 tanks.. bout what about lower geared tanks?

[Flex]

am I just incapable of reading?

Patch 4.0.1 should be the pre-Cata push. They also said that all players, no matter which expansion they have, will get the revamped old world but this blue confuses me

Patch 4.0.1 is slated to be released prior to Cataclysm and will not include the changes to the old world or any content exclusive to Cataclysm

So does the wording imply two game worlds or am I dumb?

[ulushnar]

So 4.0 is out before cata.. I wonder how all the changes will turned out, like raiding ICC with no defense and tons of dodge, will it offset the 20% debuff?

Not really. Like I mentioned, you lose 5% Dodge from Anticipation and 5% Parry from Deflection, plus the 5.6%+ miss chance from your Defense.

[Chicken]

am I just incapable of reading?

Patch 4.0.1 should be the pre-Cata push. They also said that all players, no matter which expansion they have, will get the revamped old world but this blue confuses me

Patch 4.0.1 is slated to be released prior to Cataclysm and will not include the changes to the old world or any content exclusive to Cataclysm

So does the wording imply two game worlds or am I dumb?

It does both kind of. I expect they'll just patch in a 4.0.2 later which brings all the other Cataclysm changes. It seems doubtful they'd revise all the lower level content because apparently 70% of people who make trial accounts don't make it past level 10, to only make the revised content available if you have the latest expansion.