11 point talent "Maybe" Info

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Postby Fenris » Sat Nov 01, 2008 6:43 pm


We're not sure if we're going to do this or not. If we do it (make an 11-point Prot talent that is attractive to Ret) it would be for these reasons:

-- It would be cooler if the talent was something fun for Prot and not something they "need" to tank.
-- In our experience, Ret paladins who PvP often go down into Prot anyway to get Imp Hammer of Justice.
-- I suggested we might offer Ret more PvP utility since we are stripping some of the burst damage, so PvE Retadins might not want this ability anyway.
-- We wouldn't want this talent to be something Prot would never get and Ret would always get. If anything we need to err on the side of something Prot definitely wants.

The idea i get after reading this one is more than before that we'll have a pvp 11 pointer that's basically useless while tanking .

Improved divine guardian i bet,at this point i expect everything...
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Postby Chevalier » Sat Nov 01, 2008 6:45 pm

Something vs spells sounds like it would be a reasonable way to go.
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Postby Ilara » Sat Nov 01, 2008 7:02 pm


We're not sure if we're going to do this or not. If we do it (make an 11-point Prot talent that is attractive to Ret) it would be for these reasons:

-- It would be cooler if the talent was something fun for Prot and not something they "need" to tank.
-- In our experience, Ret paladins who PvP often go down into Prot anyway to get Imp Hammer of Justice.
-- I suggested we might offer Ret more PvP utility since we are stripping some of the burst damage, so PvE Retadins might not want this ability anyway.
-- We wouldn't want this talent to be something Prot would never get and Ret would always get. If anything we need to err on the side of something Prot definitely wants.


I see back peddling and an attempt to cover a dumb choice..
I'm not forgiving at the moment.
Still sounds like it will be something aimed at PvP to fix Rets little problem, and useless for PvE.
I'm seriously getting fed up with GC going round the actual problems in circles. We have less than two weeks and they have our class in pieces for all the wrong reasons.

Oh and I hate PvP. Get rid of it.
there, I said it.
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Postby divinituss » Sat Nov 01, 2008 7:17 pm

Death's Grip anyone?

IMO give it to prot, which solves the Single Target taunt QQ + make pvp viable.

Maybe even make it do damage that scales with our stamina to make up for the lack of Prot DPS.
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Postby Seraphia » Sat Nov 01, 2008 7:41 pm

Holy DeathGrip (AKA: Hand of Justice!)

Gives a Single Target Taunt
Gives a Single Target Pull
Gives a Silence AND more importantly
Gives a way to MOVE a caster
Gives a way for Ret to close the distance on kiters in PvP.

If you want to spruce it up a bit more, make it work on Friendly targets too. To pull them out of harms way, that way a Holy paladin might think of taking it too. (plus it would be :lol: )


You could even further enhance it with Imp Hammer of Justice talent, which would turn into plain old "Improved Justice"

Decrease the cooldown of Hammer of justice by 10/20/30 AND decrease the cooldown of Hand of Justice by 5/10/15. (Could also possibly add something for Seal/Judge of justice too in the talent, Justice for all!)


Plus make the animation an actual Hand, grabbing the target and yanking them back! A big glowing one! 8)
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Postby Worldie » Sat Nov 01, 2008 7:56 pm

Seraphia wrote:If you want to spruce it up a bit more, make it work on Friendly targets too. To pull them out of harms way, that way a Holy paladin might think of taking it too. (plus it would be :lol: )

You could then rename it Holy Gnome Ping Pong since that would be the first use any paladin would do of it.
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Postby Jtree » Sat Nov 01, 2008 8:24 pm

Ilara wrote:

We're not sure if we're going to do this or not. If we do it (make an 11-point Prot talent that is attractive to Ret) it would be for these reasons:

-- It would be cooler if the talent was something fun for Prot and not something they "need" to tank.
-- In our experience, Ret paladins who PvP often go down into Prot anyway to get Imp Hammer of Justice.
-- I suggested we might offer Ret more PvP utility since we are stripping some of the burst damage, so PvE Retadins might not want this ability anyway.
-- We wouldn't want this talent to be something Prot would never get and Ret would always get. If anything we need to err on the side of something Prot definitely wants.


I see back peddling and an attempt to cover a dumb choice..
I'm not forgiving at the moment.


Wow. Back peddling to cover a dumb choice? More like trying to put out yet another QQ flare-up that resulted because he gave a so frequently demanded insight into what the developers are currently kicking around.

I'm sure GC has realized by now that is damned-if-he-does, and damned-if-he-doesn't.



So, what would Ret PvP and Prot PvE both find usable? An interrupt, a distance closer, a damage-out increase, or a damage-in decrease. How about a Hand of Magic Protection? Solves all sorts of complaints in one neat spell, and there are no talented Hands right now anyway.

Although I do love the idea of a spell that yanks friendlies out of harm's way. Needs to have no more than a 3 seconds cooldown though, so pallys in a raid can play hacky-sack with gnomes during breaks.


ETA: Hand of Magic Protection does suffer from an unfortunate sounding acronym, now that I think about it.
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Postby majiben » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:03 pm

Hand of Warding sounds good and in theme.
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Postby Sharlos » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:15 pm

Kalgan wrote:The World (of Warcraft) isn't ready for Hand of Spell Warding yet.
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Postby moduspwnens » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:20 pm

BLUE UPDATE

Ghostcrawler wrote:Announced Ret Nerfs for WotLK - Pt. 3

After hotfixing in some of our recent changes with a few more incoming on Tuesday, we were still unsure whether or not Ret still had some PvP viability. So, the development team has decided to make the following fixes to bring Retribution to the appropriate level:
    Holy Shield damage decreased by 50%.
    Improved Righteous Fury has been removed.
    Avenger's Shield daze removed and damage reduced. However, you'll now hear an awesome Captain America sound effect!
    Shield of the Templar's 3% DR has been removed.
    Flash of Light and Holy Light mana costs increased by 100%.
    Seals of Blood, Command, Vengeance, and Righteousness have been removed.
    Divine Strength has been renamed to "Divine Spirit" and grants a 3/6/9/12/15% increase to Spirit!
We believe this will bring Ret back in line. If we find that these changes affect any of the other trees (what were those again?), we'll make necessary changes. It may take a few months, though.


http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/threa ... sid=2000#0

Good to know. I'll make a post over on the Beta forums to thank GC and the development team.
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Postby Seraphia » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:43 pm

Isn't this like the second time you tried that? :P
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Postby moduspwnens » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:48 pm

Seraphia wrote:Isn't this like the second time you tried that? :P


Yeah, except this time it isn't a Rickroll. :)
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Postby Arnock » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:54 pm

I C WUT U DID THAR MODUS


But back to the topic, I am all for having targeted Heroic leap as our 11 pointer

give Avenger's shield a single-target taunt effect
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Postby Karock » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:58 pm

Avenger's Shield daze removed and damage reduced. However, you'll now hear an awesome Captain America sound effect!


But that's a buff....... at least for the daze =P
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Postby Ilara » Sat Nov 01, 2008 10:07 pm

omg modus, you actually had me believe points 1 and 3 for a moment there...
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